This issue has a ton of implications to it. Do you kick out the child that was brought here at age 1 and knows no language besides English and has no connection with anyone from their "home" country?
[quote name='"DarkSideofHerb"']Yeah man illegal is illegal. I went through this argument in my civics class in high school. Her argument but where they come from its poor and shitty so they should be able to come because we the land of opportunity. I replied with "how are you a teacher? With you logic I can rob a bank and get away with it cause I came from a poor family and we should all have the same opportunity. BULLSHIT. Life isn't fair it's not. I don't have it that bad compared to someone. But I also have it really fucking shitty compared to someone else.... It's not our countries responsibility to take care of the world. There are so many lazy people looking for handouts look at our welfare system it's a fucking joke. Help the people of your country that are struggling."[/quote] Weed is illegal. So your a hypocrite. Immigrants should be given citizenship.for free as soon as they enter. It would solve all.illegal.immagrant related problems. And while we are on the subject of robbing banks I'd like to point out that the law makers are the ones stealing the most
When discussing illegal immigration, you must first ask why do they want to come here in the first place? "Free" education, healthcare, tax less jobs are all magnets to attract undocumented immigrants. Remove the magnets, and create a realistic and obtainable path to citizenship is what's needed.
Illegal aliens are a fiction. If someone wants to work and someone wants to hire them it is no one else's business. Who are you to tell another person what to do?
You realize those magnets have been here for the passed... who knows, hundred and fifty or so years. Which are the reasons for harder to obtain citizenships to act as barriers. We have to realize we cannot be fair to everyone and to attempt to do so will break the system even further then it is already broken. Those who attempt to defend everything, defend nothing. We cannot defend the illegals reasons for being here and need to have a tough, but fair policy of extradite with extreme prejudice and distinction. Eliminate the incentive the old fashion way just short of killing and permanent imprisonment, but on a wider more productive scale. The States have done similar things with native Americans many years ago and it worked spectacularly! Crude, but a necessary evil. These are merely the signs of our time. Homefront first. Take money from all those programs benefiting illegals and newcomers and put that money into massive-scale deportation and removal to their home countries. Yes I know it sounds terrible. However if you think this sounds bad and desensitized. The future we have in store for us and our children will be quite dystopic, I promise you when all the government institutions collapse from over encumbrance and there are food, water, shelter/money riots in the streets and we have to channel huge portions of the few remaining capital in the government treasury to FEMA camps and riot control the surviving and sane remnants will look back wish they had changed their previous courses of action. Not saying this will solve the entirety of our troubles, its all of one of but many steps needed to be taken for the survival of these here United States. People need to start thinking of the children and the future! Once we have our criseses in order then we can think about letting more in. For now there needs to be an Iron Curtain. The future of the nation depends on it. That and encourage the legal way, that way the right kinds of people can home here the correct way. It will also stem illegal drugs that flow passed our borders.
[quote name='"yurigadaisukida"'] Weed is illegal. So your a hypocrite. Immigrants should be given citizenship.for free as soon as they enter. It would solve all.illegal.immagrant related problems. And while we are on the subject of robbing banks I'd like to point out that the law makers are the ones stealing the most[/quote] Smoking reefer and sneaking your family into a country are completely different things.. And yeah of course allowing whoever the fuck wants in without any kind of process would solve all problems. But don't you think that's the point of them being illegal? So they don't pay taxes and such so therefore can live off getting paid less?? If they were legal citizens the farm labor union would make sure they get fair pay. And then benefits... See where this goes? They become too expensive to work..
It is pretty much an economic wash. As for the taxes; Economic impact of illegal immigrants in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Undocumented Taxpayers Most arguments against illegal immigration begin with the premise that the undocumented don't pay income taxes, and that they therefore take more in services than they contribute. However, IRS estimates that about 6 million unauthorized immigrants file individual income tax returns each year.[33] Research reviewed by the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office indicates that between 50 percent and 75 percent of unauthorized immigrants pay federal, state, and local taxes.[33] Illegal immigrants are estimated to pay in about $7 billion per year into Social Security.[34] Most undocumented immigrants pay sales, federal and state income taxes. In addition they also spend millions per year which support US and helps create new jobs. The Texas State Comptroller report in 2006 that the 1.4 million undocumented immigrants in Texas alone added almost $18 billion to the state's budget, and paid $1.2 billion in state services they used.[35] Their Social Security and Medicare contributions directly support older Americans as undocumented immigrants are not eligible to receive these services.[36] The Internal Revenue Service issues an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) regardless of immigration status because both resident and nonresident aliens may have Federal tax return and payment responsibilities under the Internal Revenue Code. Federal tax law prohibits the IRS from sharing data with other government agencies including the INS. In 2006 1.4 million people used ITIN when filing taxes, of which more than half were illegal immigrants.[37] [edit] Social Security subsidizing Illegal immigrants pay social security payroll taxes but are not eligible for benefits. During 2006, Standard & Poor's analysts wrote: "Each year, for example, the U.S. Social Security Administration maintains roughly $6 billion to $7 billion of Social Security contributions in an "earnings suspense file" -- an account for W-2 tax forms that cannot be matched to the correct Social Security number. The vast majority of these numbers are attributable to undocumented workers who will never claim their benefits."[20]
I'm a democrat, but I CAN'T STAND the immigration policy they have. It's bass ackwards and makes no sense at all. Losing jobs, money, lives, it's ridiculous
I dont think it matters, its mostly people who sucked at school and work minimum wage jobs who complain about them, but most illegal immigrants probably came from a worse situation than us, such as coffee and tobacco pickers who make a few cents an hour. If it gets them out of their shit lives then i say go ahead, but we do have laws, and if they cant lay low and hide the fact that they are illegal, they will be deported. I can take them or leave them. Thats my answer.
I don't believe in borders. I believe in unrestricted travel and trade. And as an American, I am glad that we have illegals help keep prices down. They're just people, they don't have a return to sender option
I'm pretty sure I said this is a previous post. The government passes laws that make it so immigration hurts.
I have to disagree here. It's actually the fault of the minimum wage laws. Because if an employer wants to hire American citizens to do a job, say for example, building a house, he has to pay them the legal minimum wage. If he tried not paying it, they could complain and sue him. So, say he pays $8 per hour, but he can only afford to pay $160 per hour total for the project, hiring Americans means he can only afford 20 workers. Now, if he hires illegal workers, there is no need to pay the legal minimum wage, they're already illegal after all, so now he can offer $4 per hour, and hire 40 workers. He gets the job done in half the time with twice the workers, it's a win-win for him, but a lose-lose for the American workers looking for work.
No disagreements here, I completely agree that that's the case in today's United States. I guess I was kind of speaking as if, hypothetically, the situation was simply a matter of voluntary interaction between an employer, an illegal immigrant, and a citizen, without the current outside influencing factors such as minimum wage laws, working condition laws, workday duration laws, etc.. In which case, it would be the citizens fault if he was not hired over the illegal.
I believe the process should be simplified greatly, but certainly not granting everyone citizenship. Also, stop acting like illegals will do tons of shit regular citizens won't, trust me people will do the dirtiest and hardest of jobs, just not for below minimum wage. And seriously people think they really bring product costs down? They just bring more profit for the folks in charge instead of passing down the savings.
[quote name='"HighMtnSkier"']When discussing illegal immigration, you must first ask why do they want to come here in the first place? "Free" education, healthcare, tax less jobs are all magnets to attract undocumented immigrants. Remove the magnets, and create a realistic and obtainable path to citizenship is what's needed.[/quote] Get rid of minimum wage laws and immigration is solved
[quote name='"HighMtnSkier"'] No argument there. Minimum wage laws = compulsory unemployment.[/quote] Pretty much all.wage laws meant to protect us actually hurt us. In my state you are required by law to pay overtime to employees who work more then 8 hours a day or 40 hours a week. This encourages employers to hire only part timers. This means people have to get 2 jobs to make ends.meat. but employers prefer open availibility making it very hard to keep a second job. On top of all that the total ammount of work hours availible goes down. So the working.class as a whole makes even less money. The government is fucking retarded...