TL;DR the current MM system hurts patients because recreational weed is not legal and doctors cannot oversee the process People seeking medical marijuana should be overseen by a doctor, and people who want to seek out recreational marijuana should be able to get whatever the fuck they want. No person that is actually seeking recreational marijuana is going to want to be overseen by a doctor, so it allows all of the people who want to use it recreationally do so without clogging up the actual program. If we have just MM, then the 'medical' aspect loses very much of it's legitimacy in lots of states where the program is a joke (California, formerly Oregon, Washington, and Colorado). How can patients get the best possible care when most dispensaries obviously cater to recreational users,(half their clientele just wants legal weed what do you expect), no doctor is overseeing their treatment, and the staff is not qualified to give medical advice beyond "Indicas help you eat and sleep bro"? Stop lying to yourself you just like using a substance to get intoxicated like 90% of the people that live in planet earth. Your substance of choice just happens to have some medical properties and is convenient to use that as an excuse. It also happens to be extremely, I mean VERY extremely forgiving to people to get addicted, which also contributes to denial(hence the 'marijuana isn't addictive at all, cures aids, cancer and pretty much every disease to have ever existed' crowd). Controversial opinion on a marijuana based forum. No I am not saying you don't need medical marijuana. I am just saying most people who claim to don't. Been seeing this a lot lately of people smoking because they _________ Can't eat Can't sleep Back pain Anxiety Depression Back pain aside, you know every single one of these issues textbook marijuana withdrawal? There is literally no other substance on this planet that can both help people eat & sleep that is as safe as marijuana. On the other hand having trouble eating and sleeping, anxiety, depression are extremely common symptoms of a daily toker not smoking. As for anxiety and depression literally almost any drug will make you not feel that way when ingested. This isn't unique to marijuana, it just seems like it because it's the only drug most people here use. As for the back pain marijuana isn't a really efficient pain killer compared to a lot of drugs Edited - ICG. I think most people who claim to need medical marijuana are in full on denial that they are really just either dependent or don't want any stigma associated with getting high so they claim they need it for medical reasons. I mean, look at medical marijuana in itself it's a joke. You literally walk into a doctors office and claim to have back pain and you get a card. Every single medication you are prescribed and buy has an exact dose or combination of other drugs for a specific ailment so that the drug is most efficient. You don't take 180 mg of ibuprofen one day, and 210 mg the next day. you know why? Because you ingest a measured out dose. Medical Marijuana has been completely overrun by people wanting to legally get high. There is nothing wrong with this, but since it's called 'medical' marijuana the people wanting to get high and the people that actually need marijuana are mixed into the same crowd. The bar for getting your card in some states like California has been set so fucking low it's a god damn mystery who is actually benefiting from medical marijuana. The dispensaries gear their advertising to recreational users for fuck sake. Edited-ICG If the medical marijuana industry was really about providing medicine to people, raw marijuana wouldn't even be for sale. I have nothing against ingesting marijuana by smoking it but that's just not the best way to take medicine. Taking medicine is about consistency and you have none of that when you ingest marijuana by smoking it. Each plants potency will vary. Every plant will have a slightly different THC/CBD ratio, it's a plant for christ sake. And then you smoke it and you are ingesting a different amount of THC/CBD each time. There is no consistency here. And it's hard to tell how much of each substance(THC, CBD etc) is the best dose for whatever ailment because there is almost no research being done on it (being a scheduled 1 substance makes it pretty hard to research) People on here talk about greedy 'big pharma' and how bad they are. Guess what, the medical marijuana industry isn't that great either. Why is a industry that is supposed to be so focused on providing medicine to people not focused on actually trying to provide medicine? So pretty much my point is, the sooner we legalize recreational marijuana the sooner we will be able properly research medical marijuana to the people who REALLY need it. Because proper research isn't crossing two strains to make a new one and selling it to 9 stoners and the stoners saying "oh yeah got me real stoned helped a lot" like they do with every other fucking strain lmao..Until recreational marijuana is legally available all these clinical trails and research is going to be bogged down by people who just want it for recreational use. Stoners in denial about whether or not they really need medical marijuana and are fucking the people who really need it.
If recreational was legal people wouldn't have to make up illnesses or symptoms . Most people are just trying not to go to prison , and if all it takes is saying you can't sleep to be eligible so be it .
Simple possession never results in prison time unless you live in a state which possession is a felony (in which case first offenses are misdemeanors) Further more in states that have medical marijuana possession is usually a civil infraction It's a legitimate issue of people actually thinking they need medical marijuana. I mean Rick Simpson oil is killing people "derp this guy told me it's gonna cure my cancer fuck my chemotherapy" and then it doesn't.
You didn't read the thread. Marijuana is a damn safe drug but that doesn't mean it's helping [insert possible medical issue here]
Not a good painkiller? you must be kidding "Cancer pain results from inflammation, invasion of bone or other pain-sensitive structures, or nerve injury. When cancer pain is severe and persistent, it is often resistant to treatment with opioids. Two studies examined the effects of oral delta-9-THC on cancer pain. The first, a double-blind placebo-controlled study involving ten patients, measured both pain intensity and pain relief.[41] It was reported that 15 mg and 20 mg doses of the cannabinoid delta-9-THC were associated with substantial analgesic effects, with antiemetic effects and appetite stimulation. In a follow-up, single-dose study involving 36 patients, it was reported that 10 mg doses of delta-9-THC produced analgesic effects during a 7-hour observation period that were comparable to 60 mg doses of codeine, and 20 mg doses of delta-9-THC induced effects equivalent to 120 mg doses of codeine.[42] Higher doses of THC were found to be more sedative than codeine." source: Cannabis and Cannabinoids
You could have made your point without "Other Drug" references. Contrary to your belief, there has been a lot of research conducted. Well kids, I just hit 3,000 pages of links in my List and tomorrow is 4/20! So...
I appreciate the alternative point of view, however wrong I think you are. You are still viewing it as 'drug' it seems. Peoples perception of a stigma is peoples problem, not the plants and in some peoples life the medicinal properties are essential in maintaining a liveable life. As far as doses, that is a strange concept in a way. Doses are vital for substances that have upper and lower tolerances, but cannabinoids the body can handle at any dose, so specific dose requirements arent necessary. Cannabinoids mimic endogenous chemicals, of which many people are actually deficient in. It'd be like slamming people for hormone replacement therapy, all you are doing is supplementing the chemicals that should be there in the first place. As far as doctors handing out cards like candy... That is a reflection of the idiotic prohibition against the will of the people. If coffee/caffeine was prohibited, people would make shit up to be able to consume it. Saying people just want it to get intoxicated is silly, surely some fit that description, but that is not your place to judge. It can be as simply as stress relief after a long days work to chronic pain management from debilitating physical conditions. If we could make our own bodies increase its production of endogenous cannabinoids would that be a problem? Hyperventilation is a natural intoxicant that feels pretty damn good if done correctly...
I had all of those problems before I started smoking. They go away when I smoke. When I don't smoke they come back. Sent from my iPhone using Grasscity Forum
I never said marijuana didn't have medical properties. I just said they are overstated Right so getting intoxicated, not sure were I said I was judging, matter of fact here is my exact quote: " you just like using a substance to get intoxicated like 90% of the people that live in planet earth". Doses are vital for administering an effect amount of any drug in the medical field. What do you mean "upper and lower tolerances"? Are you trying to say you don't gain tolerance to marijuana, it can't be overdosed on, or that the dose becomes irrelevant after a certain amount? Either way doses are completely relevant. The more you ingest a drug the faster you build a tolerance thus it becomes less effective. Agreed. Oh marijuana isn't a drug it's a plant, right alcohol isn't a drug it's a drink coffee isn't a drug it's a bean
While I do believe that cannabis has saved a lot of people's lives, I have to nonetheless agree that the majority of medicinal marijuana users would have been just as well off buying it from a dealer. Mark my word - Medicinal marijuana is your BIGGEST deterrent to legalization.
It has opened a lot of older folks eyes on the benefits. Ca medical was a negative in some eyes, but tighter qualifications and word of mouth helped immensely.
you made it sound like stoners with anxiety/depression are only suffering because of mj withdrawal but that wasn't the case with me. don't forget stomach pain either. it does wonders for that and tons of other things
there are benefits the issue is finding benefits when the whole program has been infiltrated. Great, a lot still point to withdrawals as their issue.
I never said marijuana didn't have medical properties. I just said they are overstated i didnt say you said it had no benefits, i read it multiple times, not just the TLDR Right so getting intoxicated, not sure were I said I was judging, matter of fact here is my exact quote: " you just like using a substance to get intoxicated like 90% of the people that live in planet earth". i should have said 'unfounded opinion' instead of 'judge' Doses are vital for administering an effect amount of any drug in the medical field. What do you mean "upper and lower tolerances"? Are you trying to say you don't gain tolerance to marijuana, it can't be overdosed on, or that the dose becomes irrelevant after a certain amount? Either way doses are completely relevant. The more you ingest a drug the faster you build a tolerance thus it becomes less effective. the prominent cannabinoids have biphasic properties, low doses can have opposite effects of higher doses, but a dose is a concept for a single chemical, cannabis is a complex cocktail of cannabinoids, terpenes, alkaloids etc. Just as our bodies are unique chemical cocktails. Yes the dose does become irrelevant at high amounts pharmacologically speaking. Just like vitamin B's, past a certain amount you just excrete them, i.e. waste. As far as tolerance, that applies to the psychoactive component but idk if it applies to the pharmacological conponent. Anyway, so the perfect dose (even if we could tailor every single bioactive compound in cannabis) is entirely dependent on your current state of being. Your bodies chemistry is constantly changing Agreed. Oh marijuana isn't a drug it's a plant, right alcohol isn't a drug it's a drink coffee isn't a drug it's a bean That depends how you define drug. Cannabis is a plant that contains so-called drugs. Alcohol is a so-called drug. Coffee is a bean that contains so-called drugs. Drug is such a useless term really. Good discussion though, much appreciated
http://podcasts.joerogan.net/podcasts/dr-carl-hart This might give you a new perspective, about drugs, addiction, withdrawal etc. It surely challenged my assumptions.
It all depends of the type of pain, and tbh I find it much easier to "forget" I'm hurt when I'm high. The pain is still there but being functionnal is much easier overall, especially if you're dealing with joint pain. It helps TREMENDOUSLY the people with arthritis, wich is a big % of the middle aged population. The fact you cannot overdose on weed makes it a safe drug, even safer than tylenol or much other regular painkillers you could get easily over the counter.
This thread isn't over whether or not marijuana has medical properties it's about the fact that most people who claim to need medical marijuana... I agree that weed is pretty safe but I wouldn't say safer than most over the counters just because you can't overdose. I mean it's hard to say weed is more dangerous purely because it intoxicates you in some form without sounding reefer madness, but it does change your state of mind and perception of reality. Also you have the whole dependence/addiction aspect.