I realized the other day that I actually am a christian in the sense that I follow the direct teachings of Christ (or whoever actually originated said teachings). I believe in sacrifice, tolerance, and reserving judgement for whomever actually deserves to judge others (if such a person exists). And if I could actually do it I would lead a life as similar to his as possible (I'd try to avoid the crucifiction part, naturally). But are these prerequisites enough to make me a Christian? I don't believe in any of the traditional gods and I never take anything at face value. I'm only 99% sure of even my most solid beliefs (being that everything around me may not be all there is). Moreover I'm very wary of anything in the bible (to the chagrin of Cottons I'm sure ). Even if it contains the words of god it's been filtered through the hand of man through thousands of years. The dead sea scrolls are obviously different than the new testiment, as an example. Also the bible teaches many things that I can't believe in, nor do I believe that Christ or any benevolent being would support them. Perhaps I should start a 'disbelievers christian sect'. I can't work with the catholics as most of them would be turned off by my skeptical nature, plus I've had many bad experiences with catholics, they seem to like the concept of "Let he who casts the first stone be obsolved on Sunday when he tells a guy in a box about it." I can't work well with any of the fundementalists as they can only seem to reason to a point ("Yes there's evidence to support evolution but it's not in the bible so it must not be true."). I guess I'm just disapointed that such a great man (whether or not he existed) has been turned into a multitude of ceramic martyrs nailed up to ceramic crosses, forever cursed to stare down from his bloodied perch upon people who use his name and glorify his plight without thought of what he actually wished to achieve. Perhaps I can help resurrect his true spirit through faith in his ways and the rest of the "christians" can keep sinning and giving big ol' ceramic Jesus a nod once a week to make it okay. Now that the rant's over; can I legitimately call myself a christian?
not all catholics think like that. that shit goes with every denomination and religion, dont try to single that shit out. the man above knows who i really am, i aint gonna change my shit
What's your point? I wasn't trying to stereotype any group. just giving a quick opinion on people I've actually known. And you didn't answer my question (the reason I made this thread)
While I'm not personally a christian in the sense of belieiving the Bible, I think I'm in the same boat as you. I take the Bible as it is and choose what from it I feel is right, for I cannot and refuse to believe that someone who was as pure as Jesus could actually advocate the ostricizing of a people because of their religion/sexual prefrence/etc. I think that if he did exist, and the Bible truley is his word, there is always that x factor on what exactly has been changed through time and the many different people who have had the opportunity to change the word. I cannot group myself with anyone, wether that's socially or religiously, because I feel that if I do, that I will almost lose my ability to see outside of that sect. While this is just a personal belief, it has affected my life greatly. I have no "classification" due to this and I feel it helps me keep an open mind. While I do not attend Church anymore, I feel that I am quite sure based on what I've learned to give the foundation for what a christian is, at least in my Episcopal teachings. I feel that a Christian is someone who has love for all man-kind, does not take things for their face value and has an inquisitive mind, and helps those in need. Now, if you meet these criteria, then I would say, yes, you are a Christian. But this is simply my thoughts and when I look at them, they would simply make you a decent person, which a true Christian/Jew/Muslim/Buddist/Taoist/Hindu/etc. would be because all of their religions teach love. (sorry if this doesn't make much sense, im not great at explaining my thoughts when im )
Technically, a Christian is someone who: 1.) Recognizes that they're not perfect and have sinned. 2.) Recognizes that this sin separates them from God (perfection can't be in communion with inperfection, so because we're inperfect, there's a schism between us and God). 3.) Because of this separation, if we die without being reconciled back to God, we spend eternity still separated from God in Hell. 4.) Realizes that Jesus died to bridge this separation, and accepts His gift of Eternal life. As for the Old Testament having a different message than the New Testament... That's totally false, althought it is easy to make such a mistake. Jesus actually quoted from the Old Testament very frequently. I won't get into the specifics as to how the OT and the NT are complimentary... I'd have to go into Dispensationalism, and a lot of other theology that would probably bore most of you. There is a lot of violence in the Old Testament. This was in large part due to Israel's disobedience. All the sacrifices done in the Old Testament were actually a picure of the sacrifice Christ would make on the cross. The Jews (for the most part) mis-understood the teachings on their Messiah. They thought He would come victoriously to set up His kingdom on the earth, when, in actuality, He was to come to shed His blood as the sacrifice for the sin of the world, and to bring reconcile us back to God. "For unto us a child is born, unt us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David,a nd upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgement and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this." - Isaiah 9:6, 7. All of Isaiah 53 is about the coming Messiah and what will happen to him... "Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all. He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth. He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken. And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand. He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knwledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities. Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; becaus ehe hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors." - Isaiah 53 When Jesus was shown in His glory on the mount of transfiguration, Elijah and Moses were also seen with Him. Jesus being in the center of the two. This shows how the Old Testament (The Law, represented by Moses, and the Prophets, represented by Elijah) points to Christ. You will find a picture of Christ's death in every book of the Bible... Old and New Testaments alike. So, a Christian isn't just someone who agree's with Christ's teachings. A Christian is someone who has accepted Christ's gift of eternal life. Someone who believes the Bible to be the Word of God (not just bits and pieces of it). You're funny LOL! The dead sea scrolls aren't that different than the New Testament, and I'd like for you to give me examples of stuff in the Bible that Christ wouldn't agree with.
No Krazi I don't think you are a christian in the traditional sense, I believe you have more in common with the Humanitarians than the modern church. I have no doubt that religion is a divisive force, just like any opinion it's a personal thing, much like politics it cannot unite only divide because of the very nature of people, elitism is elitism no matter how you wrap it up. The Catholics believe they are right, the Jews believe they are the "chosen" the born agains think everyone else has got it wrong, to me it's all just bullshit. I view the bible in the same way as I view Aessops Fables, moralistic stories to show what it takes to create a peaceful society. I have no doubt that if everyone followed one religion it would be the end of certain problems but then you would have to eliminate all human emotions too.
i cant reply to your post because i didnt answer that? why are you asking people over a forum if youre a christian? you gotta take a vote to see or what
You have to believe jesus died for your sins to be a christian. I don't consider myself a christian. I mean the book says everyone else is going to hell except people who believe christ died for their sins...I'm not going to buy into that. Aesops fables is one of my favorite books. hhhhmm i think I can think of a few conflicting idea's between the old testament and new ..How about Eye for an eye and turn the other cheek. Turn the other cheek is another reason I couldn't get behind christianity..if somebody punches me I'm not going to turn and let him punch me again! I think it's funny because there are actually things that the catholic church refuses to allow into the bible..go to any search engine and look up "Book of Thomas" it has a passage in it where jesus denounces organized religion such as catholicism and christianity by saying "God is in you" religion is a multi billion dollar business that preys off of fear of death...count me out.. Edit : I realize I said catholic church but I don't think you will find the book of thomas in christianity either...I mean after all it's the same book.
The confliction between eye for an eye and turn the other cheek isn't really a confliction when you keep them in context. Eye for an eye is referring in judicial matters (ie, murderers get the death penalty, etc.). Turn the other cheek is for personal conflicts (ie, someone lies to you, forgive them, someone does something to hurt you, forgive them, etc.). Eye for an eye still goes... but it's for things that would have to be brought before the high priests or king (ie, anything settled judicially).
To be a christian you must accpet christ as your personal savior. You dont have to be a bible thumper, but you must know the teachings of the bible and try to live your life by it. Christianity is a forgiving religion, meaning you confess your sins and all is forgivin. I dont like the fact people are making money off christ. The ceramic jesus' tome are kinda sacreligious. But everyone views them differently.