We Are Observers of Reality

Discussion in 'Philosophy' started by batenswitch, Nov 20, 2011.

  1. #1 batenswitch, Nov 20, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2011
    Some ideas I recently read/thought about I thought I'd share:

    Forget about everything you identify "yourself" with (name, profession, etc), realize that it all comes down to a single awareness of reality as it happens around you (some refer to this as ego-death or ego-loss). Every living creature shares the same capacity to experience reality as everyone else, i.e. they all experience it, it just so happens that we're biologically capable of observing the experience of reality (rather than just living it). In accordance with science and the deterministic nature of the universe, reality unfolds and "we" are merely observing it. This may suggest a kind of symbolic or spiritual or literal unified consciousness or awareness throughout existence--so it may be totally symbolic or it may be a non-physical life giving force that we are biologically suited to recognize. We can only speculate.

    So whatever the "truth" may be hardly matters, as reality exists only as we perceive it.
  2. I understood the rest, but this bit (bold) is confusing me. What exactly do you mean by "it," and "symbolic?"

    You are right that reality really only exists as we percieve it. But if you die, It still continues. If life is totally extinguished, it still continues. Therefore, even if we don't percieve it, it still exists.

    So i watched a movie called pi, and it made me think. Mathematics is a way we have of observing reality, of making sense out of it. And it is the truth. We can represent everything that happens through it. If we were to create, say, a mathematical simulation of the universe, of all the objects and interactions, we would see patterns everywhere. Galaxies influence galaxies, stars influence stars, planets influence moons. Every breath of wind, every wave, leaves a pattern of numbers.
    Cause and effect is what i'm saying.
    And you could say that it is all part of a plan. A plan set in motion when the universe began. And if not a plan, an outside observer, with mathematics, could calculate everything that ever happened, and will happen. with complete certainty.

    But then we insert life into the picture. You could calculate the reactions of a creature to any given situation, using it's past experiences, it's past reactions, it's genes, or whatever, but not with complete certainty. Every living thing (and humans in particular) has the capacity of choice.

    And if we insert these choices into our simulation, we see waves, ripples, new patterns. every involuntary movement has consequences far beyond it's original intent. Maybe there is an answer. I say we shouldn't ever know what it is.

    Anyway, reality may exist only as we percieve it, but it goes on existing whether or not you are there to see it. But us percieving it and reacting to it has an effect.
  3. #3 batenswitch, Nov 20, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2011
    I was referring to the unified awareness of reality that all living creatures share.

    We can't know something exists without perceiving it. There's no way for YOU to know that reality exists after your death.

    My point was the assertion of determinism in nature and that all "we" can do is sit back and observe. To think otherwise implies that our brain can bend the laws of physics to fit our "free will"

    I suppose I also wanted to get across the idea of ego-death and it's apparent uniqueness to the human species (because our brain let's us). The ability to think, who am I REALLY?
  4. For that matter, I can't know anything exists at all, other than my conscious self. To me, if I am to live in this world, I have to assume that reality will continue with or without me present.

    Can't our brains bend the laws of physics to suit our free will? Is it not true that, By observing an event, we change the outcome of that event?

    Lets assume we do share some kind of unified conscious with all beings.
    What would the consequences be of humans, a creature which can not only percieve but also observe, and experience "ego-death?"
  5. I don't see how you can observe something properly from inside it. I think that while it's true that we observe the universe in part, it's not the case that we acually ever become aware of it all.
  6. In the truest sense you can't know anything exists save that you experience. Obviously it's not realistic so we pretend otherwise but it's still true.

    Speaking scientifically, no our brains can't bend the laws of physics, because they are the laws of physics. You must either say our thoughts/decisions are the inevitable effect of some cause, or our thoughts are located outside of physical reality in some supernatural state.

  7. Yeah I agree, it's unknowable, but we're talking about the nature of consciousness.
  8. Do you believe that there is a supervenient relationship between the "nature of our consciousness" and the physical structure and function of the brain?
  9. Is that a Doctor Who avatar!? :smoke:
  10. You're just begging the question in the direction of physicalist explanations of the mind. Your premise that, "We all experience reality the same" has to actually be argued for.

  11. You could say that in as much as "experience" is related to the taking in of information, that the physical similarities that all brains share imparts a degree of sameness across all of us. But then you'd have to argue with the guy who insists that because of perspectivism, similarities in functional roles of brains doesn't mean that we all experience reality the same after all.
  12. We are biased observers of reality.
  13. That's just it. We were meant to THINK; not to know.

  14. Who's claiming to know anything here? lol :smoke:
  15. except that the contentious point is that experience is the same thing as "information"

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