The Tea Party Scapegoat

Discussion in 'Politics' started by aaronman, Aug 8, 2011.

  1. Just thought this could use another posting...

     
  2. we need everyone to become democrats, then all will be perfect in the world.
     
  3. Economic Libertarians (that are American) are at a disadvantage when it comes to internet forum debates because so many non-Americans rely on the U.S. economy, namely our military. So if we go the way of Ron Paul they will have to fend for themselves. Just go on any mainstream political forum and you guys will notice many who are the most anti-tea party/fiscal conservatism aren't even Americans but live in a country supported by America's economy...
     

  4. Can you really be only Economic libertarian? How could you be economically libertarian but not socially libertarian? Doesnt seem like it would be possible?
     
  5. What is it?
     

  6. With social issues we put the scale on 'social conservative' and 'social liberal'. The reason we do this is say we have virtually no taxes, just enough to keep the government and military operating. That is an economically libertarian society. But say the vast majority are religious conservatives, they will be more likely to support various social laws.

    So you are correct that you can't be 100% economically libertarian without being 100% socially liberal. But you are never going to get an entire society (especially over 100's of million people) to be 100% socially liberal and therefore you can never have a society that is 100% economically libertarian.

    I am not a 100% social liberal though. I like some order in my neighborhood. But hey that's the beauty of state's rights if I live in a highly socially conservative state we can decide to have our laws match the degree of our social conservatism without imposing our culture on the rest of the nation.... Likewise, California can be free to soar into the depths of hell in which it aspires.



    The 25 Rules of Disinformation
     
  7. just out of curiosity..

    what branch of government has the tea party been in charge of over the last 50 years or so that put us into this situation?
     
  8. So let me get this straight...

    Congress displays a terrific inability to come to a budget compromise, not in a small way because of Republican/Tea Party intransigence on generating any new revenues, the markets start to do poorly at the tail-end of the debacle, S&P downgrades US debt citing said inflexibility but... The Tea Party and their "no taxes" mantra shouldn't create any ire?

    Whatever you're smoking, Aaronman, I'd like some of that. :bongin:
     
  9. You can get more revenues by lower taxes and letting the oil companys drill again in the gulf. just a couple of ideas offf the top of my head.:D

    Oh and repeal Obamacare :hello:

    edit: Harry ried and the democrats i n the senate have not even proposed a budget in two years. :eek:
    maybe start by producing a budget before blamming others.
     
  10. Debt Downgrade: Why Congress and S&P Deserve Each Other - The Curious Capitalist - TIME.com

    Jeff Madrick: S&P Downgrade Brought On by Republican Obstructionism



    S&P did not downgrade us citing inflexibility of the tea party, maybe you should stop reading HuffPo?

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/documents/spratingreport_080611.pdf

    "THe downgrade reflects our opinion that the fiscal consolidation plan that congress and the administration recently agreed to falls short of what, in our view, would be necessary to stabilize the government's medium-term debt dynamics.

    More broadly, the downgrade reflects our view that the effectiveness, stability and predictability of American policymaking institutions have weakened at a time of ongoing fiscal and economic challenges to a degree more than we envisioned.

    Since then we have changed our view of the difficulties in bridging the gulf between the political parties over fiscal policy, which makes us pessimistic about the capacity of Congress and the Administration to be able to leverage their agreement this week into a broader fiscal consolidation plan that stabilizes the government's debt dynamics anytime soon."


    I interpret that as, "Congress didn't do shit to allay our concerns about US debt."


    You'll notice all the liberal articles attacking the tea party also attack S&P for being untrustworthy (see huffpo above), which is the same thing the white house is doing... so they just look like angry schizos. If you people were at all honest you would agree with S&P and recognize that they have been carrying water for the US government for far too long.

    Unless you honestly think we are AAA+? :laughing:
     
  11. Yes, things were going swimmingly UNTIL the tea party. LOL

    It couldn't have been the $5.2 Trillion in new debt and not a cut to anything over the past 4 years. It couldn't have been new entitlements from Bush, Medicare Part D, and Obama with "Obamacare". Nope, it's all the Tea Party's fault....

    Keep the blinders on. I've got my popcorn...
     

  12. As long as congress has another option, they will not start spending less. Simple as that.

    If perhaps congress has demonstrated it knows how to live within its means, then the tea party would have less weight to their argument. However thats not the case. Therefore inflexibilty is neccesary. Inflexibility its not DOING harm in itself, its allowing the consequences to occur.

    I can't believe people even consider raising taxes as a viable solution. By all means, remove the bullshit loopholes and bullshit crony exemptions, but if you look to raise taxes, they are just going to raise them in a way that allows corporations to pass the cost on to you.

    Even as you and others trash tea party congressmen, they are not giving in to the other members of congress who would rather raise your taxes, devalue you money, and dig their way further into debt as a "solution" to the sickness spreading through the United States government.

    Just the fact that the rest of the establishment is bashing them should be a red flag they are doing whats right
     

  13. Sen. Paul Statement on Misplaced Blame for U.S. Downgrade Rand Paul | United States Senator

    Sen. Paul Statement on Misplaced Blame for U.S. Downgrade

    Aug 8, 2011

     

  14. True Story. :smoke:
     
  15. $2T+/year in tax revenue isn't enough. They need moarrr nao!!1!one!!11!

    Let's ignore the largest tax on the poor: inflation. Let's ignore the millionaires and billionaires receiving $~3000/month from SS. Let's ignore the rampant fraud in Social Security, especially with regards to disabilities. Let's ignore the wars overseas. Let's ignore drug prohibiton. The tea party has been around for ~3 years and everything was going so well before that; therefore, it must be their fault.















    :rolleyes:
     
  16. I can't stand the Tea Party. Half of them are purely religious psychopaths and the other half are ignorant assholes like my uncle with nothing better to do than to spew indoctrinating bullshit.
    /endrantwithterriblegeneralisations

    Honestly, I don't like how they mix church and state or how they like to "condemn" people for having differing views. A lot of them act all for the constitution, but then turn around and say weird stuff like freedom of religion was only meant for Protestants. :rolleyes:
     
  17. Maybe you should read more of S&P's rationale; here's an excerpt that effectively proves my point:

    "The political brinksmanship of recent months highlights what we see as
    America's governance and policymaking becoming less stable, less effective,
    and less predictable than what we previously believed. The statutory debt
    ceiling and the threat of default have become political bargaining chips in
    the debate over fiscal policy
    . Despite this year's wide-ranging debate, in our
    view, the differences between political parties have proven to be
    extraordinarily difficult to bridge, and, as we see it, the resulting
    agreement fell well short of the comprehensive fiscal consolidation program
    that some proponents had envisaged until quite recently. Republicans and
    Democrats have only been able to agree to relatively modest savings on
    discretionary spending while delegating to the Select Committee decisions on
    more comprehensive measures. It appears that for now, new revenues have
    dropped down on the menu of policy options
    ."

    strawman.jpg

    But inflexibility demonstrably is doing harm; forget S&P, the global community has less faith in US debt as a direct result of what's happened in the last week. Don't believe me? Look at the numbers! The stock market is tanking now! At the very least what went on in congress vis a vis these debates was a catalyst to the market turmoil we're seeing now.

    As far as corporations passing on the costs, income taxes could be raised on individuals making $1mil+ a year. If necessary exemptions could be made for businesses filing as individuals. There's no reason for a product to cost more if the inputs haven't changed; the owner's personal incomes should not reasonably change that.
     
  18. #19 aaronman, Aug 8, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 8, 2011


    So you don't think they downgraded us because of how shitty our finances are?

    Whatever. Even if you want to ignore the rest of their report and pretend that politics is the main reason they downgraded the US (which it clearly isn't), why is all the blame being placed on the tea party? They are only a minority.

    A deal was finally made without tea party support, and S&P said the deal doesn't go far enough. So blame the tea party??? :confused:


    The retards in the global markets are jumping ship because of the S&P downgrade, not because 20 or so freshmen Republicans want to see spending cuts and a balanced budget without any new taxes. How is a default any different from raising the debt ceiling, anyways? :rolleyes:
     
  19. The US isn't crumbling because of a lack of tax revenue. The premise is silly.

    How much tax money is used by bureacracy, the wars overseas, and the drug war? How would raising taxes fix any of these systemic issues? Why should national politicians, who receive lifetime pensions, care about saving money and using what they already get efficiently?
     

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