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Sublingual Injection (Under the Tongue) Solvent Possibilities

Discussion in 'Weed Edibles' started by jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014.

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  1. #1 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 19, 2014
    Hello fellow cannabis enthusiasts,
     
         I wanted to post this thread because I enjoy trying to come up with innovative ways to enjoy the pleasures of cannabis. That being said, I have saved up a decent amount of kief (roughly a gram) that I would like to do more than just top my bowls with. I thought of all the ways many various drugs can be consumed and thought sublingually... I've never heard of anyone doing it before other than making complicated alcohol tinctures, but I figure there HAS to be a way to do it firecracker style. I'd like to hear your thoughts and opinions on how to go about doing this exactly. I am making this tonight, and if I get any responses I will take pictures.
     
    This forum is the basis of my experiment:
         http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/7-plants-plant-extracts/9623-sugar-beats-fat-print.html
         http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/7-plants-plant-extracts/9623-sugar-beats-fat-2-print.html
         http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/7-plants-plant-extracts/9623-sugar-beats-fat-3-print.html
    (Pages 2-3 most important)
    I am taking advice from both bfskinner and smokepole for what I'm creating.
     
    Essential Items and Equipment being used:
    -Kief (Exact Dosage TBD)
    -Pyrex Bowl (For Decarboxylation, also not essential but preferred as to just aluminum foil)
    -Aluminum Foil
    -Small Sauce Pan
    -Sugar and Water ( 3:1 Ratio, Unknown Quantities)
    -Various Measuring Utencils
         So far all I have done is decarboxylate my marijuana and placed it in the freezer for about 30 minutes and ground it up to receive my kief.
         At this point I would appreciate help on where to go from here. I plan on using the sauce pan to cook my sugar down to a syrup, but I don't want to place the kief in the pan directly. I plan on only making one dose due to the fact that I am limited on my supply of marijuana and I dislike wasting it.
         My idea is to cook the sugar down to a syrup, then pour a very small amount of it of it into a very small bowl then mix the decarboxylated kief into it, and maybe shortly keep that keated for 5 or so minutes, then refrigerate and let it form into a small solid to be placed under my tongue.
     
    Just poured alcohol over my kief (not pure kief)
    I felt it was unnecessary to use a strainer since the marijuana is very fine anyways.
     
    IMG_01561.JPG
     
    Placed the alcohol-soaked kief into the crock pot
     
    IMG_01571.JPG
     
    So basically at this point, what I've created is hash
     
    IMG_01581.JPG
     
    At this point can the hash be placed under the tongue since alcohol on its own can be injected sublingually?
     
    Here is another picture of it. It's still very slightly damp in the middle
    IMG_01611.JPG
     
    All around the edges it is very gooey, yellow to black in color
     
    IMG_01631.JPG
     
    The product looks finished to me.
     
    IMG_01651.JPG
    Sorry it's so blurry! couldn't for the life of me find a good angle :/
     
    So after placing it under my tongue, 20 minutes later I am happy to say I am feeling quite high. I began to feel effects at around 10 minutes, and I haven't eaten in about 3 hours. I have made firecrackers before with .25g of kief and not felt as strong of effects that I am now only 20 minutes in, and I only used .15g of kief!

     
  2. #2 Deepthree, Jan 19, 2014
    I don't think this would work because you need something with fat or alcohol in it for your body to absorb it. If you were to do what you said than mix with some strong alcohol like everclear it may work and it would make the everclear taste better Sent from my iPod touch using Grasscity Forum
     
  3. #3 Neegabutt, Jan 19, 2014
    Hey man, really motivated by your passion! THC and other cannabinoids are lipid (fat) soluble meaning fats will rip them from their housing and hold on tight. Alcohol and citrus can also extract these cannabinoids, flavonoids, terpenes etc. Decarbing is a terrific idea, but I'm not too sure the sugar solvent will be successful in extracting like you want. Alcohol or green dragon tinctures actually aren't complicated at all. In fact, an alcohol tincture can be made without any heat at all! My recommendation for your personal goals would be a coconut oil as your solvent. It's 100% fat (it's actually a solid at room temperature) so it fits the lipid-solubility characteristic of the cannabinoids very well. Technically this is the most thorough extraction available. You can then mix this very potent coconut oil with your sugary solvent, or even with honey to make it sweet. You can bake with it, you can drop it sublingually as is. If you make it with concentrates like kief, a single drop under your tongue could put you in space!Check out BadKatSmiles sticky, she has all sorts of recipes that include kief and have research to back up the extraction claims. PS put a little olive oil in your warm, liquid state coco oil to keep it liquid when it cools down. Sent from my iPhone using Grasscity Forum
     
  4. #4 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    Wow, thanks so much for your guys' input!
    bfskinner claims that marijuana can be dissolved into a sugar/water syrup mixture at a very high heat, but I am reluctant to believe this claim.
     
    penisface  :laughing: I don't have any coconut oil, but i do have vegetable oil and olive oil. I don't know much about the difference between all of these oils, but I do hear good things about coconut oil. You say alcohol or green dragon tinctures aren't complicated to make and can be created without a heat source, and go on to say you personally recommend a coconut oil as your solvent, but oil is fat-based, not alcohol-based, correct? Therefore, in using coconut oil as my solvent wouldn't I need to heat the oil first, or because I decarboxylized my marijuana is it unnecessary?
     
  5. #5 Neegabutt, Jan 19, 2014
    Correct! Coconut oil doesn't contain alcohol and will need some sort of heat for extraction. Green dragon you can Just decarb, add to alcohol, and let sit for a couple weeks while shaking daily. You're gonna want to use the fattiest oil you have available to you. You could probably google a list of oils sorted by fat content. Coconut, palm, olive all are pretty fatty. BKS sticky thread has info on the best solvents. Decarbing is to convert the acidic cannabinoids into psychoactive cannabinoids and can literally increase potency up to 10x. Extracting is removing those desirable, converted, psychoactive cannabinoids into your solvent. alcohol will extract slowly without heat, vegetable based oils will need heat in order to grab those cannabinoids. Look up the vaporization temps of cannabinoids. Stay under this temp or they will be vaporized and lost into the air. Decarbed weed and coconut oil cooked at 250F for 45 minutes would yield you a really potent oil. Definitely check that sticky though it has more than you'd ever wanna know about the subject Sent from my iPhone using Grasscity Forum
     
  6. #6 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    Very interesting. I have no heat source available to cook the oils at a measurable temperature; I was lucky enough to decarb my marijuana stealthily while making a pizza  :p  I could take a crock pot and pour water into it to keep it at a steady temperature, but that seems mighty difficult. I should be able to do this to create my syrup, though. I've been searching around on the web, and found that isopropyl alcohol can soak up 95% of the cannabinoids in less than a minute. Since I'm only using enough kief for a single dose, I figure I can let the kief soak in the isopropyl alcohol for a short amount of time then let it evaporate (with such a small amount of kief and alcohol I figure it should be able to evaporate fully within an hour, if not less) Would this leave me with a tincture I could put into a syrup and take sublingually? Would the syrup even be necessary at this point? I want to make sure it has the fast onset that sublingual injection is supposed to create.
     
  7. #7 Neegabutt, Jan 19, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2014
    That's a terrific idea bro. I'm in the same boat - can't bake at home. YES, a crockpot is a very very viable method to do this extraction. It's really good at finicky glycerin extractions. You can put room temp water in it, let it heat up, and use it as a double boiler with the alcohol and weed in a jar. You can put straight coconut oil or glycerine with weed into the crockpot and it will work. Unfortunately the heat has to be pretty precise so invest in a candy thermometer if you decide to use heat. Or an oven thermometer to verify that temp if it's an oven or toaster oven.That would be mighty easy to do it cold like you said. However I might recommend a little longer than a few minutes. There's a bunch of cold GD on here, I think wild will or psychedelic Sam has a nice recipe. Yes you'd be able to strain the trichome husks and let the alcohol evaporate until you have a really potent tinc. Sent from my iPhone using Grasscity ForumEdit: for a single dose a shot glass would be a perfect container. Just seal it and shake it some. After that you can take it straight or mix it with sweet but keep in mind it's gonna be pretty hot under your tongue from the ever clear haha. You also don't have to strain if that makes it easier, especially with kief
     
  8. #8 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    Okay, great! I'll begin by letting my kief sit in in alcohol within a crock pot (just plugged it in). Because water has a boiling point of 212F I should be able to guesstimate what the temperature is at depending on how much the water simmers/boils (I've never used a crock pot, so I don't know what the hell I'm doing lol). So in theory, as long as I keep it under boiling I should be able to evaporate the alcohol quicker at a steadier rate I believe.
     
  9. #9 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    I'm adding pictures to my opening thread now as I go through this process.
    The alcohol seems to be soaking up the goods much better than butter. The color of the liquid is golden yellow right now.
     
  10. #10 Neegabutt, Jan 19, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2014
    Nice initiative man im hyped to see results so quickly haha. I cant tell since Im not there but is that moist with alcohol still or is it dry? I feel like if it has some alcohol in it, it should absorb sublingually. Alcohol vapes at 173 F so you can only really extract cannabs up to that temp without boiling down your solvent volume. how long did it cook before you started to notice it reducing? from what ive heard the cold extraction takes a couple days to weeks to take it to its full potential. unless you let it stew cold for that long, make sure that stuff gets a good 20 minutes at what you feel is closest to 160-170F. thats pretty standard for an alcohol extract
    i used a candy thermometer which you can get at a walmart or target for cheap and it is critical sometimes to get it to the right temp for the right time. i did a small portion like you too and i didnt realize my thermometer bulb would barely reach the solution haha so be careful with that.
     
    but if it did cook for a little while then i hope your test leaves you stoned as nuts! congrats on the stealth of the operation, i definitely relate there.
     
    WOAH time out. i just noticed something. did you say you used isopropyl alcohol? thats not for consumption i dont think man, you need food grade ethanol alcohol such as everclear 190 or 141 proof vodka, or any alcohol over 70 proof should work.
     
  11. #11 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    Yes, I did use isopropyl alcohol lol
    I do realize it's toxic to consume, but in such a small amount it shouldn't really harm me at all, right? Or is that just stupid of me to think...
     
  12. #12 Deepthree, Jan 19, 2014
    You should be fine with the isopropyl as long as it's in a small amount. I just looked it up online and it says that 8.5 ounces is a leathal dose so I'd imagine you should be fine but I don't advise swallowing it. Sent from my iPod touch using Grasscity Forum
     
  13. #13 Neegabutt, Jan 19, 2014
    That's a good point, maybe if you just let it absorb under your tongue then spit the rest out it would be safe. Olive oil would work really well in the set up you have now too.
     
  14. #14 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    Thanks for chiming in again, Deepthree! And I think that's what I'll do, just not swallow it.
    I'm starting to get more of a resin-like substance, but not quite as sticky. I'll post pictures when it's finished.
     
  15. #15 Deepthree, Jan 19, 2014
    You may want to add some normal alcohol like rum or vodka the highest percentage you can find just so it's more liquidy and easier to take Sent from my iPod touch using Grasscity Forum
     
  16. #16 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    So if I were to put in olive oil at this point could that be absorbed under my tongue? I feel like it would go to my stomach rather than straight to my bloodstream.
     
  17. #17 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    I would truly love to use a high volume ethanol, however, there is no hard liquor in my house :(
     
  18. #18 kiefsmoker420, Jan 19, 2014
    I use my tincture sublingualy and it works, it's easy to make it justs takes a while to makeSent from my iPhone using Grasscity Forum
     
  19. #19 jwhardy21, Jan 19, 2014
    Do you use ethanol as your solvent?
     
  20. #20 kiefsmoker420, Jan 19, 2014
    Yeah I used 70 proof rum but something stronger like vodka would be better also I only soaked it for 10 days I'm letting my next batch sit longerSent from my iPhone using Grasscity Forum
     
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