question about suicide...

Discussion in 'Philosophy' started by Papageorgio, May 7, 2011.

  1. Do you think one has the right to prevent another from committing suicide, either through physical restraint or other means?
  2. #2 ArgoSG, May 7, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: May 7, 2011
    Depends on the circumstances. Why are they committing suicide? All you have to do to answer this question with "yes", is admit to the fact that we can be wrong about what we want to do; dying being one of those things. It's possible to be so delusional that you just don't know better.

    Of course, these situations are far away from cases where someone is killing themselves for good reasons, like the suffering associated with terminal disease. In which case it would probably be morally wrong to prevent them from ending their 'life', which at this point is simply a euphemism for suffering.

    The areas in between these two extreme examples are where it gets really difficult. One could simply be mistaken about how much they are suffering, or have a unreasonably low bar for it. Suppose someone was a bit too narcissistic, and after losing half of the pinky on the left hand, decided they wouldn't want to continue living in such an imperfect way despite our advances in cosmetic surgery. You can pepper this example to make the call even harder to make. Suppose this person was the best pianist in the world and would never be able to play the same way again? Etc.
  3. if a friend was committing suicide for a stupid reason then yes i would hold that mofucker down and be like bitch you aint going nowhere
  4. delusional... that's a whole other thread-worthy question... what determines whether a person is "delusional" or not? assuming it's impossible to experience another persons emotions and/or thought processes...

    i guess it boils down to what would justify suicide... some would argue it's completely unjustifiable under any circumstance, others would most certainly disagree...

    i personally don't know either, that's why i ask lol. :smoke:
  5. i would probably do the exact same thing.

    but if i saw a stranger holding a gun to their head preparing to pull the trigger i don't feel i would have the right to stop them. while witnessing a suicide would be disturbing to say the least, i can't imagine it would be any better to attempt to intervene and then fail anyways...
  6. If you can prevent someone's suicide you should do it.

    Unless they have a terminal illness that causes a great deal of pain. Then suicide is an act of mercy.
  7. Several things determine whether a person is delusional or not, among strength of convictions and how starkly the beliefs oppose consensus. The more resistant someone is to evidence against their belief, the more delusional they are said to be.

    Suppose your friend came to you, gripping a few double A batteries, and seriously declared he was a machine, and not a human being. He insists he needs the batteries as his power source, otherwise he will be shut down. If you take his batteries away(much to his struggle and opposition), and he still insists he is a robot, it's safe to say you're more than a little sure that he is delusional. He can go on at this point to square reality with his already firmly held beliefs; he's employing his new solar technology , or this is merely his emergency power generator , while demanding his batteries back , and so on.

    In psychiatry, delusions are categorized two ways: plausible and implausible delusions. Someone can believe the government has wire-tapped their phone lines and consider their computer completely compromised; after all, this is undoubtedly true for some people at this very moment. On the other hand, someone who seriously believes they are Legolas, son of Thranduil, King of the Woodland Realm of Northern Mirkwood holds a belief that could never come to pass in reality. Notice that you don't need perfect mind reading technology to say when someone is clearly delusional. It's just a matter of evaluating the beliefs they hold, and how strongly they hold them despite evidence of the contrary.
  8. No...

  9. No. :(
  10. It's hard to say...cause we all experience life subjectively(Through the eyes of one self)
    If you want to prevent someone from killing themselves, go for it. If not, then don't.

    It all comes down to both "me" and "you". Do as you do. Cause that's the way life is...

  11. I think it would be best to devise :)devious:) a means so that they can initiate the process without carrying it through. For example, if someone is about to jump from a roof, it would be best if we could suddenly pull up a net over the ground as they leave the ledge. If they still want to die after that, I would not stand in their way and I would not expect prevention attempts to do anything except intensify their desire to do so... in other words: it's gonna happen, so why draw it out?

    I have read much about suicide survivors who are not so suicidal after their attempt, even in some cases when their life is significantly worsened by it.

    Otherwise, I find it irresponsible not to at least reason with such a person, but I doubt any more aggressive action would be helpful. If we exert control over them, we are likely just going to justify the attempt. For all we know, this person might be seeking suicide because they have failed to control anything else about their life.

  12. Yes, one has the right to actively prevent one from committing suicide, if you know you are able to stop this person from entertaining suicidal thoughts, or if you are unsure of yours or other's abilities of stopping this person from entertaining suicidal thoughts. In both cases you have the right to prevent this person from engaging in suicide.
    The moment you realize you aren't capable of changing this person's mind, you have lost your right to intervene with that person's wishes.
  13. To people who said they have the right to prevent suicidal man, let me tell you this.

    If you're going to interfere, you better be ready to die with him.

    Coz if I was trying to commit suicide and you interfered, I will shoot you first, and then it would be much easier to shoot myself.

  14. If I died for you, it will be because I cared about you, not because I thought I knew better.
  15. #15 Renegade Angel, May 7, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 15, 2016
    Yes; under certain circumstances.

    I feel like if I can help/solve/alleviate/change what is causing them to want to kill themselves, then I will do so. But if it's some type of mental illness and they're going through pain, I'd still want them to exhaust all of their options before making a final decision.

    But some people, for whatever reason deem it "selfish" to commit suicide. That it's selfish because of the pain brought upon those left on earth. That's very wrong. I won't go into specifics, but when I felt down, no one even bothered to appropriately acknowledge what I was going through mentally.

    I had one friend, I hardly ever went out, my social skills went down hill, I wasn't doing the best in school, I quit two jobs in the span of 4 months, I was depressed and apathetic. It was clear as hell to me that I was going through something, and after years, yes years, of bringing it up, asking to see psychiatrists, all my Mom could say was "There's morning wrong with you" and use religion as a method to cure my "demons" (negative thoughts). Even my grandma and Aunt who claim to love and care for me so greatly show almost no concern or even a acknowledge my behavior.

    So as far as I'm concerned, if I wanted to kill myself, I'd expect no one to stop me. They weren't there when I needed them emotionally, so what gives them the right to try and stop me from doing something that I feel will end my suffering?

    I'd help anyone who was suicidal, but I wouldn't want anyone to stop ME.
  16. let's not confuse martyrdom for murder...

    if you were to get shot and killed by a delusional person with a gun because you attempted to talk them out of suicide, i wouldn't really call that "dying for someone".

    if you were to say "well if you're gonna kill yourself, let me kill myself first." that might be considered dying for someone. if you were to grab onto a person jumping off a ledge in an attempt to stop them, and then in mid air position yourself in a way that would break their fall and increase their chances of survival, i would consider that dying for someone.

    but that's just my opinion.

  17. I think I understand your point. There is a fine line between dying for another's life and dying for your own belief of the importance or value of another's life.
    However, in your example of breaking somebody's fall, in essence, "dying for them," it is untrue that you have saved their life in the long-term, for chances are they will go about attempting suicide again, drawing upon your death as yet another reason for them to discontinue life.
    But suppose you died while attempting to dissolve mentally this person's inner problem or conflict, in turn removing the will to end their life. Although attempting this with a highly delusional person is stupid and naive to begin with, I would agree that this is, more so than the other example, the scenario that would truly be considered as you "dying for" that particular person. You died while trying to increase their true chances of survival.
    Now I'm not saying I'd put myself in a position where GGrass could shoot me. Lol. In that post I was only expressing my compassion towards another human life.
  18. I would tell them that suicide would not end their suffering. :eek:
  19. What if their current life is summarized by the words "Pain, piss, and shit factory"?(love your user title btw)

    Anyway, I feel tempted to accuse the people who responded that it's never ok to prevent someone from taking their life of being just a tad unimaginative.
  20. Life is suffering man :)

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