Organic tea to supplement a chem nute regime? Good idea?

Discussion in 'Growing Organic Marijuana' started by Gliese581g, Aug 14, 2011.

  1. Hey everyone,

    This may not be the most appropriate sub-forum for my question as I am using non-organic chems, but it seemed like the best place for getting an answer since the tea element pertains to organics. I'm not getting any responses in the absolute beginners forum.

    So yes, this is my first grow, which is being done in a soilless medium (sunshine #4) with advanced nutrients. Sunshine #4 consists of sphagnum peat moss, coarse perlite, organic starter nutrient charge, Gypsum and dolomitic limestone.

    I thought applying an occasional tea, in addition to my chem nute regime, might be helpful. I don't expect that I will ever use full-strength with the nutes.

    I have pasted the tea recipes I am considering below. Would they be beneficial in my situation or am I wasting $$$ / asking for nute burn?

    --------------------------
    Tea Recipes - *put all dry ingredients in a paint strainer bag or something similar, or just strain the slush out before using. all tea recipe ratios posted here are for use in a 5 gallon bucket of de-chlorinated water with airstone/s.

    Soil Prep Tea -
    1 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano

    -Just bubble this in your 5 gallon tea brewing bucket until all of the Peruvian Seabird Guano is dissolved. Then wet your soil mix.

    Seedling & Early Clone Tea - (Tea, Tea, Water, repeat)
    1 cup Earth Worm Castings
    1/2 cap unsulphured Molasses

    -Bubble this for atleast 24 hours before using.

    Vegetative Tea - (Tea, Tea, Water, repeat)
    1/3 cup Earth Worm Castings
    1/3 cup Mexican Bat Guano
    1/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano
    1 cap unsulphured Molasses

    -Bubble this for atleast 24 hours before using.

    Flowering Tea - (Tea, Tea, Tea, Water, repeat)
    2/3 cup Earth Worm Castings
    2/3 cup Indonesian Bat Guano
    2/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano
    1 cap unsulphured Molasses

    -Bubble this for atleast 24 hours before using.
     
  2. #2 Jellyman, Aug 14, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 14, 2011
    Fear of nutrient burn is so widespread that actual burn has become a rarity. For every one person that considerably burns their plants with too much fertilizer, ten other growers damage theirs with deficiencies in attempts to avoid burning.

    The veg tea could use just a little more K but it's not critical. Kelp & seaweed ferts have moderate amounts of Potassium.

    Your flowering tea has too much Nitrogen and far too little Potassium. Use half as much Peruvian & supplement with at least a seaweed fertilizer, or even better, a high-K ash. Try to get about as much K into the plants as P. Decrease N to nearly zero over roughly the first 2/3 of flowering. Plants with very leafy buds can get a little more.
     
  3. What kind of air pump and stone are you using??

    humic acids will help your nutrient absorption and 6lbs of DTE granular humic runs around 15$
     
  4. #4 Gliese581g, Aug 14, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 14, 2011
    Does this revised recipe (not mine) address the K concerns as well as the excess N in the flowering tea? Also, under the veg recipe the author says "@ 1-cup mix/5 gallons of water every 3rd watering." Is he saying I should dilute the tea once its made to one cup per 5 gallons or that the tea (with this level of castings/guano/kelp) should be brewed in 5 gallons of water and then used to water the plant with no diluting? I think he means the latter, but I'd rather be safe and ask.


    Seedlings less than 1 month old nutrient tea mix-
    5 TBS. Black Strap Molasses
    1-cup earthworm castings/5 gallons of water every 3rd watering

    Vegetative mix-
    1/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano (PSG)
    1/3 cup High N Bat Guano (Mexican)
    1/3 cup Earth Worm Castings (EWC)
    5 TBS. Maxi-crop 1-0-4 powdered kelp extract
    5 TBS. Liquid Karma (optional)
    5 TBS. Black Strap Molasses
    @ 1-cup mix/5 gallons of water every 3rd watering.

    Flowering nutrient tea mix:
    2/5 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano
    2/3 cup Earth Worm Castings
    2/3 cup High P Guano (Indonesian or Jamaican)
    5 TBS. Maxi-crop 1-0-4 powdered kelp extract or Liquid
    5 TBS. Black Strap Molasses
    Dilute as needed. Generally, 2 to 3 cups per 5 gallons of water @ every watering.
     
  5. that air pump won't do much for the AACT- you need a powerful pump to really get the oxygen pumping though there to get high numbers of micro-organisms in there.

    as far as your watering regimen, I have been adding the nutes into the medium and going water- only, I have experience with top dressing and with that much guano's you will have a thick layer of buildup on the top of your medium. It won't all reach your roots and every time you water it will give greater and greater quantities, especially if you continue top-dressing with guanos. IMO you should just add it in the media, same difference without the buildup cake on top. also, you only need some nitrogen in the first two weeks of bloom. the other six weeks can run with little nitrogen and adding any N dominant guano into the mix later than four weeks is most likely a mistake.
     
  6. The new recipes are better. Maxicrop is an excellent fertilizer but it adds a little more N, making the Peruvian Guano almost obsolete. You could throw some in at the start of 12/12 but for most of flowering, the little N in the Worm Castings, High-P Guano, and Maxicrop should provide plenty of N altogether.
     
  7. Great. I will axe the peruvian guano out of the flowering tea entirely. Should I take it out of the veg tea too?
     
  8. #10 matthewjohn, Sep 17, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 17, 2011
    Hey all... just a heads-up about COMPOST TEA and Chemical Nutrients;

    "Since chemical fertilizers kill the soil microorganisims (bacteria, fungi, protozoa) and chase away larger animals (beneficial nematodes, worms, etc.), the system we espouse is an organic one, free of chemicals." Teaming with Microbes--book (get the revised edition)

    Pouring (actively aerated) compost tea (AACT) on a soil garden maintained by salt-based nutrients, is like pouring out moist earthworms onto the Bonnieville Salt Flats and watching them wither in OSOMOTIC HELL without any sunlight influence. The high salt content of the soil/water causes the moisture to be sucked out of the worm. Worms and soil microbes are freshwater creatures, not salt-water creatures.

    The value of the COMPOST TEA is that if properly brewed, 65-85 degrees, huge amounts of air bubbled into it, is that its HUGE population of BACTERIA and FUNGI are simply....

    BAGS OF ORGANIC NUTRIENTS, recently broken down and absorbed, READY TO BE DIGESTED
    and BROKEN APART into the PIECES by the next level of CONSUMERS (protoza, nematodes, ETC.)
    and in a form and location READILY AVAILABLE TO PLANT ROOT HAIRS.

    The STORY goes on, plants even develop root exudes (like perspiration) which attract the
    BENEFICIAL MICROORGANISMS which live in the vicinity of those root hairs. AMAZING!!!

    Furthermore, ORGANIC GROWERS don't flush. ALL THOSE MICROBES facilitate the CURING
    PROCESS, so it burns to grey colored ash, never harsh, and smooth YUMMY TASTE.

    YEP, all those expensive MYCORRHIZAE additives go to waste when you kill off the FUNGI and their HYPHAE (root hairs) by adding Chemical Nutrients. (WOW--They didn't say that on the label or at the GROW store.)

    (In fact, they sold me the whole batch of salt-based FERTS along with the POWDERED FUNGI SPORES!)
     
  9. I appreciate the tips on the recipes. Wondering how one of these teas would do with coco as my substrate? And what does bubbling consist of? I assumed it was just bubbling your nutrient mix in a reservoir for a period of time, but I just wasn't to sure.
     
  10. MatthewJ couldnt have said it better. You will just be wasting your time and money by applying AACT to your soil and babies. BIMS, and Microbes are extremely sensitive to any man made chemical. Look at it this way. When you get a bad cut or scrape what do you do? You add a chemical like alcohol or bandage spray and so on to kill the germs. This is basically what you are doing to the microbes in your soil. If you want to start making the cross over to organics start small. Get a good organic grow medium , heck you could just get some jiffy, ewc and some perlite and use that if you wanted to(which is super cheap) then buy a small bag of alfalfa and kelp meal and you are set. No kidding.. Just try one plant first and see how it goes. Unless you are like me and dive into project full throttle and do the whole shebang and all! What it all bowls down to is you CAN NOT grow a plant thats half organic and half chemical. Its impossible. Organics isnt just using organic nutes or addmendments it more growing your soil and growing microbes to sustain your babies. This is impossible to do with even a small amount of chemicals. There are plenty of A-list Organic Pros on the city who will be way more than happy to help you! Have a great day!
     
  11. Nice subject, Im a FULL THROTTLE JUMPER also so I did not know which other to start with beside ewc, So I started buying a new amendment every paycheck bro.

    I have grown some JackFlash tlo, & the bag apeal and taste.....AMAZING !!..

    I love learning about microbes and how to get you soil top notch.. Keep it GreeNThumB bro.
     
  12. To be fair, giant pumpkin growers are now using a combination of synthetics and organics to achieve record breaking pumpkins (1,725 lbs is the current record I believe). I think that there is more research needed to be sure, but I do think the amount of microbes killed off by chemical salts is exaggerated. Some would argue any microbial loss is too much, but the ability to feed plants directly with ionic nutrients may allow a person to grow a larger plant than organics alone.

    That being said, I choose not to use chemicals myself for environmental and ethical reasons. My plants are healthy and happy without them. I just know people who are currently doing both with good success.

    Good luck! (oh and keep in mind that the recipes listed above are all "nutrient" teas not "aerated compost teas").
     

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