malt vs extract barley wtf

2cent420 · Jun 11, 2021

So i have been using crushed malt barley seems to work....
And go back to my mushrooms and agar slides and notice that i use malt extract for slides...

This is a sugar replacement in beer brewing. Its the malt barley at maximum enzyme point mashed and starches extracted it tastes like pure sugar tho is not a sugar but the barleys enzymes..

Is that better to use in the plants also? Is that what coot was on about when his friend said hey ive got that in a bag ?
Always confused me thst bit but i think im figuring out is was this??

Was it and is it better than my malt barley crushed grains ?

Does the malt extract make whiskey too? Lol

Dried malts extract, light, 500 g, 5,99 €

Vs
Beerworks Maris Otter (Crushed Pale Malt) 500g

Studies show malt extract facilitates the growth of probiotic cultures which are microbes lacto etc thats why ibgot sm in shroom rooms.

Jim[Clackamas]: Well exactly, I attended the San Francisco Baking Institute in preparation to open or accurately and not so accurate called Artisan bakeries and what they call lean dough which means just the four elements; yeast, salt, flour and water for baguettes and things. They will also add what is called malt or diastatic malt, and so I would buy that from a bakery supply house and never really understood or really cared much what diastatic meant.

So one day out of sheer boredom I decided to look it up and then I realized, oh this is just barley malt and diastatic means that means that the enzymes weren't killed like it is, like barley extract is not diastatic, it’s non-diastatic. Doesn't mean it doesn’t have any value, I mean the sugar’s in there and some other things, okay, so then I was with Tim Wilson and I were talking back and forth online, and I asked him about yeast this used commercial yeast for bread baking and which is a single celled fungi, so we add diastatic malt to our bread to enhance the activity of the yeast.

So I'm thinking well what if we put sprouted barley, at this point I still didn't understand you could just go buy this stuff, you know at a brew store. So I go over to Bob's Red Mill and get organic barley, raw you know and then I - that's all malt means, you let it sprout or germinate really, you don't really you don’t grow a tap root of all.

And then one day a friend who fancies himself to be beer master said; why don’t you just go buy malted barley at the brew store? They make this stuff? Yeah.

So I went and bought it and the rest is history I started adding it and other people, the first thing that I saw, besides the increase in resin set, is that we were cutting off several percentage points off the flowering period. One of the advantages that I have probably a lot of people don't, is that I've been growing the same - not strain, the same plant through cuts mother cut, mother cut, for 33 years so that when I test something I can immediately know what is standard and what change there is good or bad right.

Tad: That's a huge benefit it's essentially your control, your genetic control so…

Jim: Right, exactly because - so many people like say well, so I want to try, fill in the blank, whatever it is, and this time I'm going to use this seed or cut. Okay, well that's cool but it has nothing to do with research. So immediately I saw that I was finishing 15% faster and then other people who used different methods of determining when it's finished started putting - and I never I never even discussed it because I wasn't sure but then there were just too many people posting that, yeah I mean I'm seeing 15-20% reduction but the main thing that I saw is the increase in the girth and what I would call that tensile strength of the branches. I was having to use far less support in the later stages of flowering from the flowers being so heavy.

But the resin cell is off the chart and some of the fellas, especially at Instagram that I couldn't believe how much they were adding. I mean I'm really cautious as you know but some of these guys are adding like 5-pounds a week, you know on two hundred gallon pots the outdoor of the Boys of Summer, I said are you sure? I mean it's kind of seems insane I'm out, but now that I've been adding it to my worm bin I can't believe the amount of biology activity with not just the worms but the other organisms that we find in a healthy worm bin, you know the shredders and this and that.

Unfortunately, because of what happens when you try to bottle, and I've approached a lot of brewers, and first all brewers only care about one enzyme; amylase, that’s it. But in barley we have urease, protease, phosphatase, there’s a total of eight. I post it so many times I almost type it automatically without even reading it. Because I know from bread baking if you use too much malt or diastatic malt as they call it, that all of a sudden you lose your structure and your structure is what? Well it's gluten. What's gluten? Protein.

Now I learned that it’s the protease, too high level of the protease weakens the structure of the gluten so therefore you're not getting what bakers call the inside of the bread, the outside is called the crumb right, the inside is called the - I'm sorry, the outside is called the crust and the inside they refer to it as the crumb, bakers will talk about, well how's the crumb on that flour, as an example right?

So if you use too much diastatic malt, the protease is accelerating the breakdown of the gluten, the protein which provides a structure to the bread. Now in our soils that wouldn’t be an issue and what I can attest to is that not one person in my circle - and I don't read too much online because people will mix it with, you know ammonia because somebody told them to do it, and you know that malt didn't work, it burned my plants, oh okay, it wasn't the ammonia right, just it was the barley. But we're seeing incredible acceleration like after you transplant your rooted cuts and just sprinkle maybe like a half a teaspoon of barley on top and just water it in; that alone will accelerate the root growth to get them ready for transplanting faster depending on your system of rooting.

Tad: Jim can you explain a little bit more about why these, what enzymes do you and why they're important what started what the barley is doing here you think is doing that's making it so beneficial to soils?

Jim: In part the amylase of course, what'’s amylase though, that's your saliva. Is uber levels of amylase it starts breaking down sugars right? Carbohydrates and the simple sugars, well that's what plants use, and protease, proteins, urease, urea and then phosphatase which since that's a popular discussion especially in that cannabis boards, you know phosphorus, real or imagined, that one should really get them excited because these things - if you, the description used by biologists is that enzymes are catalysts and so chitinase for example, chitinase is important because chitin in itself doesn't really do much in the soil.

Chitin is a polysaccharide, it's in a acetyl form of a glucosamine, it's what, if you had surgery either external or an oral surgery, they'll seal you up with chitin and here's another instant connection to the - Albert Hofmann the man who isolated several compounds in ALD52 and LSD25 and later - when he was at his Sandoz labs, well at the age of twenty two if you can imagine this he graduates with a Doctorate in Chemistry or Biology, it doesn't matter.

He was the one who figured out the molecular - not formula, but structure of chitin and it was a big deal in 1922. So he was like this, he was I mean this genius. So he really understood the complexities of these and that's what for example it's grown on rye ergo, a mold and so in our soils they accelerate - the chitin as the bacteria try to deconstruct this polysaccharide it creates chitinase and if chitinase, it gives us the benefits, so that's what deconstructs the shells of insects as an example. There's also topics that, listeners might be interested in this, that chitinase salicylic acid pathway which is one of the several pathways that plants have as a defense system, the SAR, the systemic acquired resistance and there's other there's ethylene salicylic, salicylic acid is a key component in several of the pathways which is why we've also been a big advocate of using quality Aloe Vera materials.

So when we add the barley to - and I really, strongly, if people are going to do a worm bin please add all the barley you can because it will really accelerate the conversion of manure into vermicompost. And that's another reason to use fulvic acid because Dr. Faust, he has an interesting description of all the fulvic acids, so enzymes are a catalyst and then he wrote that fulvic acid, pure fulvic acid is a catalyst of catalysts and a reason to do according to the directions because his products are professional, don't start high dosing, if you want to see Jurassic Park plants start high dosing with fulvic acid and that’s what you might not be able to flush out either, do you use barley
Click to expand...

2cent420 · Jun 13, 2021

2cent420 said:

So i have been using crushed malt barley seems to work....
And go back to my mushrooms and agar slides and notice that i use malt extract for slides...

This is a sugar replacement in beer brewing. Its the malt barley at maximum enzyme point mashed and starches extracted it tastes like pure sugar tho is not a sugar but the barleys enzymes..

Is that better to use in the plants also? Is that what coot was on about when his friend said hey ive got that in a bag ?
Always confused me thst bit but i think im figuring out is was this??

Was it and is it better than my malt barley crushed grains ?

Does the malt extract make whiskey too? Lol

Dried malts extract, light, 500 g, 5,99 €

Vs
Beerworks Maris Otter (Crushed Pale Malt) 500g

Studies show malt extract facilitates the growth of probiotic cultures which are microbes lacto etc thats why ibgot sm in shroom rooms.
Click to expand...

@Sc00byD00bie heya brother any joy on this one . I have both i use the grain but it seems the sweet extract is what wr use thw grain for mi us the work need doje by microbes readily avalible to somewhat ?

Sc00byD00bie · Jun 13, 2021

2cent420 said:

@Sc00byD00bie heya brother any joy on this one . I have both i use the grain but it seems the sweet extract is what wr use thw grain for mi us the work need doje by microbes readily avalible to somewhat ?
Click to expand...

AFAIK the freshly ground barely grain has the most amount of enzymes. I never used extract nor do I know anyone who does. If you have access to whole grain I would use that.

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