Good to know rumple, thanks for the info. Any advice on how to cover a 4' x 4' ScroG with LED lighting? How many watts, what nm's, etc...?
cant find much on what the best LED lights are, just need a good one or a few good ones for the space I have and get good growth out of.
I've pretty much decided that the LED technology has not yet caught, and certainly has not surpassed HID's yet. Keyword Yet. I think it sounds very promising, it just isn't there yet. One good sign of this is that even the best of stories, seem to be just that, stories. Now they may be true stories but.................There are no real scientific studies from reputable institutions out there. There also seems to be a wide range of what lighting people use with LED's. Every story is different. Some stories, maybe most are bogus, while a few are actually good stories and some one did with LED's. But, I've yet to hear of anyone getting the quantity with LED's that is attainable with HID's. And the extreme lack in quantity is not made up for the possible, yet minimal, higher quality. Out of many people, many websites, many articles, this is what I have found to be likely of the LED technology so far. Wish someone would prove me wrong and some day the technology will finally allow that.
? LED technology is booming. I don't think there's any question as to their efficiency being superior, since you can effectively produce only the spectrums needed for growing and do away with that which simply wastes power. Sure, there isn't much info here on the forums because the majority of members here seem to only go with the HID or CFL, but that doesn't mean anything about LED technology. As for the lack in quantity, I believe the ones you refer to must not be using enough power. The PAR efficiency of LEDs, based on power consumed, is definitely superior to that of HID systems. HIDs waste a LOT of power.
http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2001/ast09apr_1/ NASA has been using them since 2001. Quite sure the technology is up to par lol
Wrong!!! Just because NASA uses something doesn't mean it's the best? That is an idiot statement. NASA is experimenting with LED lighting for growing, that does not mean they have perfected it. There is also the fact that there is not one conclusive study proving that LED's grow a larger quantity or better quality crop of cannabis. I defy anyone to show me proof that LED's grow a bigger or better crop of cannabis than HID's do! You cannot prove this to me because it is not possible yet. Keyword there being "Yet". I have spent countless hours, days, weeks, and months compiling information on the use of LED's for growing cannabis and other plants. I've researched scientific studies by reputable places such as NASA and Universities. No one can provide me with definitive proof through research, studies, and actual grows, that show LED's do better than HID's. In fact almost all have proven otherwise. All the research that I've been able to compile tells me that LED's don't grow near the quantity as HID's but in some cases the aroma and quality is better. But the increase in quality is so minimal that it is barely worth mentioning and if I can grow a pound per plant with HID's, (Which I do), but the quality with HID's is so "minimally" less than the quality that I can grow per plant with LED's that the reduction in quantity from a pound per plant with HID's to a few ounces with LED's completely negates the minimal increase in quality. Two hits from the HID crop gets you high, 1 3/4 hits from the LED crop gets you high, so yes LED quality is better, but not enough better to make up for the difference of a pound per plant with HID's to the three ounces per plant with LED's. I would shut my mouth and become a believer if anyone could show me definitive proof that LED's are better than HID's. But the simple fact is, that they can't! Put up or shut up I say. Prove it to me, don't just talk big talk. Show me studies that prove LED's grow more quantity and better quality on a continual basis. You can't! LED's reduce the electric bill and the heat. So what! My ventilation takes care of the heat and when HID's produce a pound per plant and LED's produce three ounces per plant, I easily pay for the extra cost in electricity and have much more money left over than with LED's. Please someone PROVE me wrong please. And I mean prove it. Not just come on here and say you think LED's are better or you have a friend who says LED's are better, or some vague BS story. There is also the fact that if LED's were better Why isn't everyone using them? When the gas powered engine came along the steam powered engine was set aside immediately, this has not been the case with LED's and HID's. I believe the technology will advance and some day LED's will outperform HID's but they are not even close as of now. And that is based on hours, days, weeks, and months of digging up everything I can find on LED's. Please, Please, someone prove me wrong with actual data and facts, not just what you say or think.
Well..that "idiot statement" you just put in my mouth was never said, and I am certainly not saying something is great just because of NASA. I do however believe that their scientific practices are far more precise and controlled than almost everyone floating around here on growing forums. Even then, I simply stated that the technology is most certainly up to par, which it is, and that NASA has been using them since at least 2001. And have you not been around since the whole incandescent vs fluorescent thing came about? Do you realize how long it's taken them to get the public to buy into it enough to actually start seeing CFL's on the shelf? And now, in the US at least, they are trying to make the incandescent disappear from the shelves completely. And you know what's beginning to show up now? Yep, LEDs. Reason being? Efficiency. That efficiency not only translates to lumens, the light that is useful for us humans, but also to photo synthetically active radiation, or PAR. Look up some studies on the PAR of LEDs vs HPS or MH. This is what you are after. If you can't find any, I'll do some searching later when I'm more awake. Just coming off of a night shift myself.
Who cares...just buy what you think is best based on reading and your cash. Are LEDs the best..no..is any light. Its your money. You can grow with such a wide range of light sources its silly. LEDs do work but youll pay alot more then say going with HID. The LED panels I have one was 500, the other was 1000 bucks...got it half off by participating in there growers program so regularly 1999. Could I have made my set up considerably less expensive by going HID..sure thats what my LED set up replaced. Am I happy yes...and thats all that matters.
Yea, the main cost in LEDs right now is the assembly of the fixture. The diodes can be found for absurdly cheap, and if you're a DIYer they are fairly easy to assemble yourself. They have been dropping in price recently, and will continue to do so. With the prices the way they are right now, I believe it is certainly a "do it how you want" scenario . I do think that they will get cheap enough to become a more efficient means of growing, given a bit more time. But yea I agree 100%, do what you want. Both HID and LED setups will make plants very happy as far as lighting is concerned.
Agreed. LED Vs whatever lighting is a silly argument. Most of the mainstream lighting schemes out there will grow a plant. All that varies is how well and how much. Take Plasma Lighting and Induction lighting schemes...primo lights but are over 2-3k a piece right now in some cases. Comes down to supply/demand and some breakthroughs to make the tech cheaper that will determine the outcome. Whats funny is we argue this subject to death when whoever it is should get kudos to the fact there even growing. The vast majority of people spend a fortune obtaining there herb via the fool down the street. Be it LED, HID, CFL whatever you use congrats that your growing should be offered! Not scorn because you dared to use a LED and grow Autos under that LED. Now I just need to create my moonshine and make biodiseal and will be even better off when the system breaks down!
yea if I knew I could successfully use HID I would, but its just impossible because of the heat. hell the heat I've gotta deal with with these cfls was/is a pain in the ass, gotta keep my door open when lights are on and even then I gotta keep my window open so cold air can come in. but since its only cold here like 2 months out of the year if I'm lucky its sort of a waste.
LEDs still produce heat. The ones where they say they do not are the low wattage models. I have a 800w LED panel and a 200w LED Panel. The 800w pumps out as much heat as any HID light, the 200w one if I did not have a inline fan on it it would be to hot...on that one though just have the fan on the lowest setting. The 800w fan I have the fan on medium to medium high. Thats been one of the biggest things about LEDs is there bold statements..not everyone makes them but trying to say a 200w LED out performs a 600w LED is misleading. Watts still matter. There just is less heat but as you up the wattage you push more juice..more juice = more heat. Simple science there. Now if I had my LEDs in a open area rather then a tent or some sort of box where the exhaust was on top and not interacting with the box/tents air then I do not think I would require a fan with either light other then a simple desktop fan. Unfortunately the materials used in anything reflective tend to trap in heat and a inline fan is required.
What's your problem bro? One you don't make a case to stand on for yourself, where is your evidence and why are YOU not conducting it yourself, you appear to just sit here on your high horse with no credibility spewing hate to people just trying to help you. I think you missed the point of GC, you should take your negative crap elsewhere. MXGrower has been growing (very successfully) for years with LED's. If you want a quantifiable answer for your negative ramblings how about you conduct a little research and go check it out. Rant OFF: I am about to make the switch to LED for many reasons, mostly because of my limited ability to dissipate heat from my grow area. I have been hearing good things about the Black Star Chrome series from Gotham Hydro, I plan on buying one panel to start and expanding to several more from there. The trick with LED's is coverage, you need ample coverage to ensure an even, healthy canopy. If you plan to switch to LED's I suggest you find a couple that look good and look into their beam angles and nm wavelength. I am not gonna sit here and claim to be an expert but there are obvious pros and cons to this system, most obvious pro would be energy efficiency, and in some peoples eyes equally important is that they run cool. The biggest barrier to LEDs is probably their biggest con, Price, followed by penetration. No matter how you look at it, it is more productive to come to your own reasoning after an ample amount of research, don't just trust that guy on GC just because he thinks he knows what he's talking about.
2 of these: 240W x Double Lens 8x3W CREE LED CHIP Perfect light Penetration size S or 720W x Double Lens 8x3W Cree Chip High Power Stronger light Penetration size XXL will do great for the space you have. I am using them myself. Plants are growing very fast and healthy.
LED's right now are getting reasonable....The pricing is fair i paid 1200 for mine. 3 watt chip accual power draw is 580 watts, i love it...i use it in a 4x4 tent..My room is way cooler and i it get 15% more growth than HPS. im not fighting the heat nor the cold...