I'd like to open a discussion about keeping males over long periods of time for breeding purposes. example: -start seeds and sex plants -flower males to determine potency, growing habits, flavor, etc -then decide which pollen to use, flower males again to make pollen -cross those seeds back to the original male (multiple times perhaps) How do you keep this male alive for that long when they usually auto-flower? Is it simply a matter of making cuttings every couple months?
I always take cuttings from males throughout the grow, as I elminate males from my selections, I also eliminate the matching cuts as well. I then collect my pollen and vacuum seal it with rice and store it in the refrigerator until I need it. Males do not auto-flower; if kept under 20/4 or 24/0 light cycles they usually remain in veg. They are often the first to flower once switched to 12/12, but they will remain in veg just a female will. It is common for even female mothers to shows pistols and signs of preflowering over prolonged veg. cycles, and males are no different.
not that long. less mentioned the refrigerator...IMO, this is no good, as cellular decay will still occur gradually. If left out in the open, pollen will lose viability quickly (anywhere from 24-168hrs, most likely). If refrigerated, it will last a little longer, but if frozen, it will last substantially longer, as cellular development / decay is at a minimum (assuming a consistent, non-interrupted freeze). as was mentioned, storing in rice (or any dessicant) is advantageous. moisture is your enemy in pollen storage the rest, Ill just agree with less on. the "autoflowering" of males is no different than females, in my experience. if youre encountering a plant that shouldnt auto, but seems to be, prune the plants growth periodically, to keep the growth at a lowered state of maturity. Also, pruning of the root ball will reduce the maturation of the plant, and works for long-term plants to restore vigor
I never freeze it b/c I often use it within a couple months or so. I also keep my selected males going in clone form so I have access to fresh pollen whenever I want. If you keep your fathers in veg, you can take a cutting and place it right into 12/12 b/c we are not concerned with size and/or yield, just collecting pollen. A male cutting placed into 12/12 right from cut will begin to pop pods in about 7-10 days. I give them about 2 weeks after showing roots, and pollen can be collected. Ther are no space issues this way. To isolate the males I use thse small food service containers which only hold one cut and put small holes in the lid for ventilation and keep them covered. I have never had a problem withthem pollnatng the female cuts this way.
I have, many times, seen pollen used out of the fridge after a year. Mosture IS the enemy and I use dissicants to controll it. But I am very sure the DRY pollen will last at least 1 year in the fridge asuming proper proceedure is followed. There seems to be some difference in opinion in the freezing thing. some say that 38degrees in fine for long term and that even if you think you are keeping pollen good and dry, you will still lose some to rupture due to sub freezing temp. If I thought I would store for 2 years or more I would freeze, but for one season.....nope, fridge it is 36-38 degrees. Oh and I collect on glass and let dry for 3 days then into dissicant and in the fridge, do you think that I am losing some of my pollen from drying too long??....any other problems with this proceedure. I am thinking that I will start using LESS's method soon I realy liked the simple approach he laid out for me.
Your point? Why even bother posting in a section of the forum which you obviously have no knowledge in? If you read the section decription you would know it has nothng to do with the general and/or relationship sections of the forum. G45: Thanks for the compliment. I have been using my method of collection and storage of pollen for many years and have never once had any problems.
I have not had any problems myself, however, the method you described seems much more efficient for me and I am greatfull for the knowledge you share with me. I am a ETS grower because of my "GUERILLA" status and most of my techniques are never even disscused in forums anywhere. I have destroyed plants that a lot of folks would love to have. My males are very important to me as I love to exploit recessive traits and have found great benifit in what some call MUTATIONS. over the past 10 - 15years I have developed a love for cubing and back crossing. It is very difficult to find a quality sorce of info that I can use in this area, as you know the diversity and lack of a basic understanding of "PLANT" genetics is polution to the researcher. The next person that tries to explain any of this to me by starting a paragraph with something about my siblings or parents will likely push me over the edge. And that LESS is why I read all your posts with great respect.[/QUOTE]
Thanks a lot for the info guys. This is certainly a less-discussed topic and I greatly appreciate the sharing of knowledge.
Thank LESS for it buddy he worked very hard to make this sub-forum happen, I would love to see it as its own forum soon. Breeders are the backbone of MJ. +rep to ya for a good question and good attitude. Wish I could -rep that joker a few posts back, the subject matter in threds like this needs to be taken seriously, I hope that thoughtless, uneducated replies are posted elsewhere and this forum can maintain its integrity. We can still have fun without the childish input.
It was not much work. We have a great group of MODS which grow and watch over the grow section; it would have happened eventually; my request just made it happen a little quicker. Other GC members get upset b/c I neg rep and/or report ignorant, and/or outright stupid post which have NOTHING to do with growing/breeding, and everything to do with being childish, immature, and THINKING they are a comedian. I really do not care if a person wants to be an ass; just keep it out of the grow sections b/c for the most part, people are here to learn, and/or get help with a grow project or breeding project. Breeders are the back bone of marijuana. I get much shit from members who just think they are all that(you know who you are), yet could not tell you anything about the strain they are bragging so much about. Furthermore they support Dutch seed companies which would not be anything if not for strains created in the United States. I personally work hard on very single strain I work with. I have made some good advancements over the years in a few of my crosses, and want to make even more advances in the future. Topics like this are often overlooked b/c most believe you can just throw some pollen and have a new hybrid. I truly appreciate all the kind words I get from members serious about growing, and/or breeding. If my posts helps one grower achieve success in their grow. If my info helps a grower decide which strain fit their needs. If just one single person feels I helped them in any way pertaining to growing/breeding than I feel my time on this forum was well spent, and my effort was worth my time. United States growers/breeders need to stick together as best they can b/c I honestly believe we will see change soon which will open up a market for our hard work. The Dutch fucked us, our genetics, and are fucking new growers everyday with watered down trains and substandard breeding practices. I was in Holland in 1982 and quite honestly, they had nothing impressive IMO. I was there again for the summer of 84 & 85, a big improvement but only b/c they began to acquire our genetics for their projects. Dronkers and Reedeker still speak of how amazed they were of the strains bought to them from US growers/breeders. Knowledge is power. A good grower has learned, a great grower never stops. The same can be said for breeders as well. We have many good growers here on GC; but how many are truly great growers?
u guys seem to be very well informed and i would like to get your advice i just got seeds from nirvana AK48-wight widow - master kush - ice - Bubblelicious i intend to breed one of these to my death star wich is 60/40 Indica / strava im looking to increase bud size the death star has a very nice potent tight bud but they only yield 4 to 5 OZ's under ideal conditions ty for your time
Whats wrong with 4-5 ozs? if you think you need more than that you can get it but you might lose potency/flavor in the cross, if you got a plant you really like just clone for a while and figure it out, make it your baby and really get to know it, how it reacts, if you can cop a 4-5oz plant regularly and good potency/taste your in good shape buddy.
don't get me wrong i am very happy with my death star strain iv grown this same lady for 3 years from clone iv never had any seeds i was given 3 clones to start with i would just like to get a male from the seeds i mention then save the pollen long term to bread a heaver yielding death star hear is a photo this bud will dry to be 2'' around i would like to double this in time
you gotta separate the pollen from the plant matter if not it can be a problem, read LESS's collection method it works well. I have leaned the males above a piece of glass and let the pollen fall onto the glass then scrape it up with a razor and put it in a paper envelope (like the coke heads make) then I put the envelope into some dry rice in a small plastic container and refridgerate. be sure to use lots of rice. when you get an envelope out use it very soon as it will deteriorate quickly.