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Importance of cannabinoids other than THC

Discussion in 'Seasoned Marijuana Users' started by Sykoaktiv, Jun 15, 2010.

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  1. #1 Sykoaktiv, Jun 15, 2010
    Hey guys.

    As you may know, most users of the herb these days only care about THC levels which has caused many seed companies to reduce other extremely important cannabinoids or even completely breed them out. I'm talking about cannabinoids such as CBD which are almost non existent in Western strains.

    CBD has some extremely good medicinal values which THC doesn't and so a lot of people are really missing out on a crucial part of what the herb can offer because of breeding CBD out. Same goes for other cannabinoids.

    Even when you look at the highs, other cannabinoids help here too. For example, everyone who complains about anxiety after smoking? That's caused by too little CBD in comparison to THC. If you look at history, you'll see that weed didn't use to cause things like anxiety, in fact it helped to cure anxiety. But nowadays, since all people seem to care about are THC levels, anxiety is extremely common since CBD is being reduced in order to increase THC.

    Basically what I'm saying is, each cannabinoid has it's own unique medicinal values. The high you get too will be MUCH better if there were equal proportions of THC to CBD, imagine a high where there are no negatives (like anxiety, paranoia, etc) and you'll know what I mean. You also won't see anti-drug groups going around saying weed causes anxiety and other psychotic illnesses if breeders didn't ruin the plant's original properties and allow CBD to exist (CBD is a strong antipsychotic). This craze for high THC levels which has caused strains to contain extremely low CBD levels has also really affected people who use it for medicinal purposes such as pain relief as CBD has better pain relief properties than THC, since these people would be VERY lucky to be able to find a strain with high CBD.

    I know this topic might sound like a rant, but to be honest I am extremely disappointed how breeders have ruined the plant's properties in terms of the high and medicinal value. I just hope more people realise that more THC doesn't mean a better high and that CBD and other cannabinoids play a role too and I hope we can, someday, get commercially available strains which give people the high the plant was meant to give. I would love to see breeders growing a strain with equal proportions of THC and CBD :smoking:.

    What do you guys think :)?
     
  2. #2 dmb718, Jun 15, 2010
    I think I'm way too high to reply to this thread with constant thought, therefore I'm inserting this comment to inform you that I will discuss this at a later, more sober point.
     
  3. #3 hoq, Jun 15, 2010
    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2cAFRAX3Gs]YouTube - Intravenous THC and cannabidiol experiment[/ame]
    I totally get where you're coming from, the video pretty much sums it up
     
  4. #4 Blunt, Jun 15, 2010
    More cannabinoids, more india.
    Less cannabinoids, more sativa.
     
  5. #5 jus10, Jun 15, 2010
    I was reading an article yesterday while high (and therefore forgot the website) but it basically discussed to usefulness of cannabinoids other than thc. Especially in the medical field. They were able to isolate the cannabinoid that makes a person sleepy and use it for insomnia patients.
     
  6. #6 Sykoaktiv, Jun 15, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 15, 2010

    Thing is man, even in Indica strains the CBD levels are being reduced in favour of THC by breeders. The extremely tiny amounts of CBD you get in indica strains these days are not what the plant naturally had.

    @hoq, I just watched that video man, good watch I must say. Thanks a lot for that. But wasn't the narrator supposed to say 'a mixture of THC and cannabidol (CBD)' and not 'a mixture of THC and cannabinoids'? Or did they include other cannabinoids in the mixture too?

    Also goes to show exactly how higher THC doesn't mean a better high, or even a more fun high. You could say that breeders are taking the 'happy' out of the 'happy herb' :(.
     
  7. #7 surfrat, Jun 15, 2010
    Really good video
    Hopefully shootin up for the MJ high doesnt become popular! haha no fun
     
  8. #8 Sykoaktiv, Jun 15, 2010
    Another sad thing is how most people think that weed has always caused things such as anxiety and that it is a property of the high.

    In a way, you can't blame them, since the breeding out of CBD and other cannabinoids in favour of THC has got so worse that almost all of the weed available causes anxiety and other undesirable effects which unmodified plants do not cause and these people consider this to be what weed is, in turn causing a lot of misinformation to be spread which can be used by anti cannabis groups to their advantage, since it's almost impossible for people to buy weed that has the true properties of the plant any more.
     
  9. #9 FindingTim, Jun 15, 2010
    I agree that the non-THC chemicals get overlooked.

    One thing I love about weed is how different the experience is based on the strain of weed. I have had so many different types of highs I can't begin to describe specific experiences. This is contrary to alcohol, where the experience almost always produces similar effects (though I've read that people with a predisposition for alcoholism have predictable reactions to drinking)

    I assume that different types of highs are influenced more so by various other cannabinoids than THC.

    If THC was all that mattered, then there would be less variations in highs. I would love to know how kush strains differ from other types of weed, as my experiences with kush are superior and noticeably clear-headed.
     
  10. #10 Sykoaktiv, Jun 15, 2010
    You won't be seeing those different highs in the future if breeders continue to mess up the plants man :(.

    I was expecting more interest in the topic too, but unfortunately I guess not many people care :(.
     
  11. #11 objektiv, Oct 2, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2010
    Hey sykoaktiv:
    (Please excuse any type-os, my back is killing me, and I'm typing fast).
    I couldn't agree with you more, re; sentiments on the perversion of marijuana's original value and purpose through SENSELESS crossbreeding to boost the psychoactive effects to the point of lunacy.
    Let me elaborate:
    I am 46. I smoked recreationally from about 1981 through 1986. I am from Florida, where we got (and grew) huge amounts of pot. Brown pot, which we routinely called "Columbian," was just dissapearing, and being replaced by green sensimillia. The Green pot was usually stronger, but very pleasant, and the old brown or gold stuff was kind of harsh to the taste, but a beautiful high, relaxed, calm, just the thing one would seek in pot.

    But by even 1983, some friends and I noticed that certain strains were beginning to get us uneasy. I'd tell a friend, "this stuf that they say is from India, I swear I'm just getting anxious from it." My friend would shoot back;"Exactly! I thought it was just me being paranoid!" At that time we had no idea that pot was already being ruined by traffickers who only cared about profits, and dumb users who wanted to get blasted, and who had too little sense to realize that they were baking their brains and tweaking their nervous systems. (Bitter? oh, just a bit.) It's like "Supersizing" an awful fast food meal...like 4,000 calories is rally good for you...yeah, if you want diabetes and a heart attack!

    Fast forward to early 1987...I just decided all at once, that I was done with weed, because I could see a clear trend in the previous years, whence pot went from wonderful, to OK, to a source of needles anxiety and physical arousal, to the point of accentuating bodily pain.
    I had, and still have no doubt whatever, that pot had been overbred into a super drug. Let's face it, people can easily breed in or out any charicteristics in plants, animals or people, that they desire. Dumb stoners like to pretend that pot is just the best thing in the universe, and hurl senseles ad hominems at sensible , objective analysis, meanwhile using awful english , and even worse reasoning. And medical pot dispensaries are often owned and staffed by people as scrupulous and smart as a typical used car salesman. In other words, it's all about the money, and they don't even care about medicinal value. They sell to people who mainly want to get high legally, and these unfortunates like to get blasted, or their brains are insensitive, so it doesn't make a difference if they're huffing glue, or smoking weed. You see their attitudes on innumerable pot sites...which often advertise products using slutty half-naked models covered in weed, looking dumb and wasted. What a turn-on, huh? It's like selling cheap malt liquor in 48 oz. bottles , on the premise that it gets you wasted. Pure crap, for dumb consumers. Truth hurts!

    So growers, and users have ruined this.
    I have looked into MM, because I am in totally legit need of pain relief, and it bums me out that the general marketplace is so ignorant and uncaring.
    (But look what people do with ostensibly democratic political systems...vote in whores and traitors, or never participate, then complain when their country goes to hell). Bitter? Yes.

    Luckily, I have spoken to (some providers of MM) who claim to know the percentage of Indica to Sativa in their various legal strains...they are not currently testing THC to canibinoid ratios, but it is hopefully on the way.
    I can see that today's pot is radically different from what it was 25 years ago, but I'm holding out hope that there are legitimate, intelligent and scrupulous growers and MM providers who give a damn about quality of life and a useful, therapeutic buzz, instead of mind-racing, adrenaline, trippy wastoid weed. It's a shame that younger folks and rock-stupid older ones don't care about all that.
    Anyway, you're 100% right on. Pot needs to be scaled back to a mellow substance.
    I need pain relief, badly. Medicines are dangerous and expensive. I'd sure love to find useful pot. Let me know if you find a strain with a healthy thc/ cbd ratio, and if you know the strain...if it's medically available, it could be a Godsend!

    PS: While I would have confidently said that weed was very, very safe in 1981, I would not say that today. People say " there are no documented cases of DEATH from pot intoxication." Excuse me, but, that's no endorsement of safety, merely of non-lethality. I have no doubt that due to the radically boosted psychoactive properties of today's THC-soaked pot, that more people are experiencing brief or permanent psychosis and needless anxiety due to smoking. Strong drugs will tip the scales of unstable brains. This is just a senseless trend, and in a few years, we WILL see the sad results; a generation of young adults with a good deal more psychiatric disorders due to smoking brain-melting weed. All that talk about twenty centuries of safe pot use is being rendered moot by the simple fact that pot is not what it was twenty thousand years ago, or even ten years ago.
    And I don't care if the unshakeable pot proponent is wearing a Bob Marley T-shirt, drives a Prius, and shops at organic health food stores...they are blindly supporting the same sorts of Agribusiness practices that breed the nutrition out of food, for the sake of high yields. Ironic? Yes. Funny? No. Hopefully sense will prevail, and MM- which has long been overdue- will expand, and not fall prey to the claims of the anti-pot crowd...which ironically now have a legit complaint to bear.
     
  12. #12 Nelra, Oct 2, 2010
    I agree with your point in general Objektiv, but i think that this phenomena is obviously VERY area/location specific. I know exactly the type of herb you describe, since that's mostly all I smoked when I started. Having searched for a while for a better connect I found that the whole 'superpot' thing is so grower-specific that it really comes to the fact that these are just the new class of weed that is mass produced, a new schwag perhaps. I now know a few people who grow from their own genetics that they've been working on for decades and you can feel the organicness (for lack of a better term) of the high.

    And this might sound stupid to you, but if you have the option of growing, try getting some mids seeds and see what you can do with them. I've never gotten anything but a body high and pain numbing effect from mids. It seems quite unlikely that anyone would put much effort in isolating THC production from low to medium quality brick.

    Good luck with your hunt...
     
  13. #13 morange, Oct 2, 2010
    I agree with you completely, people seem to not understand the high doesn't come from just THC. A 15% THC flower could produce a better high than a 20% THC flower, the same way more trichomes doesn't instantly mean more THC and cannabinoids.

    I have social anxiety and generalized anxiety disorder so it is a real hassle for me to find bud that I can smoke without adding anxiety, which is why I tend to stick to Indica strains. Besides medicinal reasons, why would people want to weed out the cannabinoids that add layers to the high and make it more unique. That is the whole reason why different strains have different highs because of the varying THC to cannabinoid ratios, and just upping the THC is moving it towards one direction where there are so many possibilities.
     
  14. #14 Bedorf1, Oct 2, 2010
    a perfect plant for you would be cannatonic by resin seeds, its got 6.9% CBD and 6.2% THC making it the only plant with a 1:1 ratio of thc/cbd, its a very good medical strain
     
  15. #15 objektiv, Oct 3, 2010
    Many thanks to Nelra, Morange and Bed...see, I don't even have to be high to forget names. Ok, Bedorf1.
    Anyway, I appreciate your experience, and especially that you didn't jump me for being so ...um, bitter about the situation.

    All your comment and suggestions are useful, and give me optimism.

    I guess the first surprise, however, (Nelra), is that someone is out there finding "schwag," or even mild medicinal stuff at dispensaries. Wherever I've checked, dispensary owners act as if my experience is unheard of. ( I know better, but it bothers me that they are simply defending profits, not wanting to admit imperfection). It's silly, because they act as though having some mild strains about would drive away their stoner customers (that percentage which has no real medical need, but wants pot). The dispensary people are in this case acting phobic of the idea that people would say they have weak stuff. It's doubly ridiculous, because every time they get an older, or more sensitive person who reacts badly to strong pot, and never returns, they're helping to spread the word that pot is no good for a lot of medicinal customers...talk about greed getting in the way of profits. If everybody knew that "nice" weed was readily available, the pain cases would pour into dispensaries.

    OK, on to constructive matters:
    Dear Bedorf1: Thanks so much for the suggestion of Cannatonic...I do believe I've read of this strain. I will ask some dispensaries if they can get it. Thanks also for the stats on the 1:1 THC/CBD ration (I'd sure love it if dispensaries would get chemical assays on their products, so they can do more than say "just keep trying strains 'till you like it." That's like a paint company telling you to buy unlabeled paint to see which mystery color suits you....moronic and lazy, not to mention irresponsible.

    Dear Morange:
    I sympathize with your predicament of having anxiety and trying to find some tame, pleasant strains...any luck? Do you know the names of these strains? Have you found that Indica-dominant strains are pleasant? BTW, Dr. Allan Frankel has given general blog information (not medical advice), that Sativas, paridoxically, may be the better strains for a non-trippy buzz...I understand the premise, that meds sometimes cause paridoxical effects, but I am dubious, despite the good doctor's expertise and care.

    Dear Nelra:
    Thanks for mentioning that you've found well-behaved strains. I only wish I could grow, and with a MM card, I'd be legal to do so, but I haven't got a secure place to do it. I have heard that in my state, dispensaries or "caregivers" can and will grow for cardholders...I'd say that if MM works for me, that is the obviously best longterm solution. Your suggestion is MUCH appreciated.
    God, I'd love to ease my pain, and be blissfully relaxed, pleasantly hazed and in control, like the salad days of , say 1982. Such a superior substance , pot, so benneficial. Any other suggestions for what strains to look for, or any other advice are appreciated!

    So nice to know that there are some smart guys and girls out there afterall!

    Thanks to you all.:wave:
     
  16. #16 morange, Oct 3, 2010
    Yes, fortunately I am lucky enough to know a number of reliable dealers and growers, so I almost always have at least 8 strains available at a time. I have found Afghan Kush, OG Kush (indica phenotype) is quite helpful for anxiety, along with various skunk hybrids. I also get access to a lot of unknown indica dominant strains that almost always help. A few sativa strains that help anxiety for me are Jilly Bean and Blue Dream and Diesel / Sour Diesel.
     
  17. #17 nvd420, Oct 3, 2010
    Yeah, now that I've had the chance to compare MM strains that have been tested I have to agree. The highest tested thc% I've had was a 24.4% Jack's Haze. Don't get me wrong it was some good bud, but, I wouldn't call it any "stonger" per se than other strains I've had in the 10-20% department. The myth that thc% somehow voodoo equates to something akin of alcohol proof is just that, a myth. While a high thc count is a good thing, the difference between 10% and 25% is no where near as drastic as most people would believe. With that said I agree breeding plants just to raise thc is something of a futile effort. I haven't had a chance to try high CBD MM yet (although I do have access to it) , but, I would assume the same thing runs true that it all has to balance out and not be too heavy on either side. 1:1 ratio sounds a little drastic to me, but I guess I can't knock it till I've tried it.
     
  18. #18 Bunnyrabbitz, Oct 3, 2010
    Very intresting. :smoke:
     
  19. #19 tvoss, Oct 3, 2010
    yea i agree, they actually do this to mostly all of our foods and stuff. they give them chemicals and shit to make it grow and taste better, or to bring out the colours. it really sucks....
     
  20. #20 Deleted member 170731, Oct 3, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 19, 2022
    .
     
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