Auto watering a no till setup?

Discussion in 'Growing Organic Marijuana' started by Moonnugs, Feb 11, 2016.

  1. I'm in the process of planning my first no tills and would like them to be setup on an auto watering system of some sort. Seems it would cut down on work while providing even moisture to my living soil. I also see that most no till setups get watered every couple days and I'd really like the flexibility to be able to occasionally leave it for 4-5 days or so without worry.


    The two systems people seem to use most are sips or blumats. They both seem to have advantages and disadvantages. I had a bunch of 5g smartpot sips set up with a gravity fed resevoir for a while so I'm more familiar with their use but I've never used them with large pots/beds or a no till style soil. Im gonna start with 20g pots for my no till experiment but I'd like to add 4x4 beds soon after. I think my ideal would be to just set up a 4x4 tray as a sip and then just put in a 4x4 fabric soil bed right on top. The problems I see with this is that once the bed is on top im never getting into that tray again and it could get funky. I also like to water in teas, aloe, coconut, ssts, fulvic, silica etc and I worry about it causing overwatering problems/leaching into the bin and causing more funk.


    I've never used blumats but I believe they would solve the problems with both topwatering in teas and funky lava rock.. However, they seem to have their own problems. I've read that they might not achieve as constant a level of moisture lower in the soil as a sip would. They also seem a lot more prone to mistakes than a sip and I've heard of issues with flooding, clogged tubes and calibration.


    I'd appreciate any input/discussion on how to best achieve the best and easiest watering system. Which would you recommend? Are there reliable workarounds to the problems I listed? Are there any other superior systems I might be overlooking?
     
  2. I don't have any experience personally but I know Coot swore by the Blumat setup.


    Perhaps Chunk will comment. I think he may have started using them as well.


    J
     
  3. #3 mosesnumb, Feb 12, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 12, 2016
    I make super size sips using lick tubs for cattle and 20 gal smart pots. I've never measured, but I bet it holds 5-10 gal of water under the pots. I can water every 6-7 days during flower.


    I also try to no-till. I have no complaints. Just let stuff dry out fairly well and don't go heavy on the teas. Make sure you have a way to fill the reservoir.
     
  4. Jerry, I am very interested in learning more about the blumats. They just seem more problem prone and expensive than sips. Hoping chunk, coots and/or whoever else might use them can explain how to make them work.


    Mooses, so do you ever move the 20s off to clean out the sip tubs or just keep on going? I assume you mean that you just let them dry up a bit when you want to top water in additions to avoid overwatering symptoms? No problems with teas, ssts etc pooling and getting funky in your tubs?




     
  5. #5 donothinggardening, Feb 12, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 12, 2016
  6. #6 Chunk, Feb 12, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 12, 2016


    Hiya Moonnugs,


    I just set up a Blumat watering last weekend so I'm probably not the best to give advice, but DNG's advice and link to Scooby's journal will help you immensely. I sought his advice a couple of weeks ago and he graciously re-posted pictures of his setup.


    If you go to the end of his journal and back up a few to several pages you can see his setup and the advice he gave me.




     
  7. heya moon [​IMG]


    check out the first page of my journal i talk about my blumat setup, also as chunk said i did a recap a few days ago here:
    https://forum.grasscity.com/organic-grow-journals/...


    personally i love blumats, i think if you set em up right and use only RO water you should never have problems, bar forgetting to refill your reservoir and letting everything dry out. but even then its an easy fix by just refilling the sensors with water and bleeding air out of the lines if it went dry that long (never happened to me).


    btw i went with blumats because i feel its easier to combine with teas, at least in my experience.


    feel free to ask if you need more info.

     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Hey scoobie. I've actually already read though most of your journal and it was part of what inspired me to research blumats further.


    So yours are running smoothly? Anything you would do different? Approx how much $ do you think it would cost to set up 8 20g pots? Also, I find ro water really wasteful, could I get by with just the smallboy filter I have?
     
  9. #9 A guy, Feb 12, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 12, 2016
    I'm going to be setting up an auto watering system on my girls too. I don't have any experience with the Blumat system but I'm going to use standard drip irrigation stuff which runs off of my household water service.


    I plan on using 4 1g/h emitters in each pot all connected to an adjustable hub then that to a central timer where I can tell it to run X minutes per time interval and adjust as necessary. I use these a lot in my regular outdoor garden and they are very inexpensive and easy to set up. This will just cover watering so every other day or so I'll pop in to feed and treat as needed by hand but it's important to give them some love in person anyway.
     
  10. I've been using fabric pot SIP's with organic soil for about 2 years and have never worried about any funk accumulating in the wicking media. I use 18"-24" plant saucers full of a mix of perlite/lava rock under 15 gallon fabric pots. The perlite isn't bright white anymore, but I think that is more of an aesthetic issue than anything. It certainly doesn't effect the plants or the soil. With full size plants, the trays never have standing water for very long, so it doesn't get funky either.
     
  11. #11 Sc00byD00bie, Feb 13, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 13, 2016
    just started my third round and so far they have run without a hitch.


    as for water, here is the thing. the drip line the goes through the sensors in the soil is only 3mm wide, which means if you have hard water lines could get clogged from mineral build up, especially since they are so narrow at 3mm. i just use RO water because my city water is kind of hard and i dont want to worry about cleaning the lines, ever. if you have relatively soft water or dont mind cleaning the lines once a year then id say its safe to use tap.


    picture.jpg you can see in this photo (not mine from google) the drip line is very thin. this guy had a root crawl into it and clog it. this is also something you should know can happen. roots can venture into the drip line and clog it.
    happened to me once but since i learned a little trick. you stick a plastic fork in the soil and prop the drip line between the prongs so its in the air and no sitting on the soil floor.

    post-840219-0-74878300-1429780630.jpg




    would i do anything different? if i had a faucet nearby with soft water id prefer to not use reservoirs at all and just use the pressure reducer blumat makes and hook the faucet straight to the feed line.


    as for setup id say you should go with 2 sensors or a sensor and slave in each pot. going with slaves should reduce your costs. they also makes kits so i would compare prices of buying individual parts or a kit.

     
  12. #12 Moonnugs, Feb 16, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 16, 2016
    Donothing, thanks. That's what I hoped to hear. The sips definitely seem simpler/cheaper and if funk/top watering occasionally isn't a problem they're a definite possibity. I also just saw a buildasoil video where he dropped some grokashi into the water tray to keep it from going anaerobic which might help.


    On the other hand scoobie is making a good case for the blumats too and they seem to have their own advantages. Sounds like either could work and I'm not much closer to a decision...


    Does anyone out there have experience with both systems and reasons why one is better than the other?
     
  13. i use both.
    sips for my mother plants, because i dont give them teas. blumats in the flower bed, calibrated slightly on the drier side which allows me to top drench whenever i want.


    sip is low cost, super low maintenance, easy to set up.
    blumat is more expensive, especially if you need many sensors. needs more fiddling with the setup.
    both will give great results and save you tons of time once you set them up.

     
  14. #14 SoloToker, Feb 17, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 17, 2016
    I run both like sc00by. I don't really keep moms, mine are constantly being cloned and chopped, but I keep those in 2 gallon fabric pot SIPs. I give them teas at least once a week I'd say. Perlite isn't white anymore, but there's no smells, nothing appears to be "growing" in it, so I don't worry about it.

    My 15 gallon no till flowering pots are on blumats. They've been set up for a couple years now. The soil is so dialed in i hardly do anything to it anymore. I give them teas, but rarely. I usually don't think about it because the blumats and worms keep everything happy.

    One of the big things to consider when choosing between the 2 systems is maneuverability. Most SIP you can pick up and move. Blumats take more planning if you need to be able to move stuff. My no tills don't move at all. I drop a clone in and harvest a few months later. The moms are always being moved as they grow and get cloned.

    Solo
     
  15. Can someone please build an undercurrent auto fill SIP with primary and backup reservoirs that constantly cycle water thru the system. There's a great holding pan at keco.com that comes in several sizes, on rollers, that allow for easy moveability. I'm thinking perlite filled fabric pillows that sit in the holding pan, cycling water thru 1/4 inch flex hose or similar.

    Sent from my XT1585 using Grasscity Forum mobile app
     
  16. I tried this, sorta. The key point that you dialed in on is containing the perlite. I didn't think about that. I tried just a filter at the overflow, but it clogged too easily. Pillows might work. Nice idea.

    Solo
     
  17. #17 picasso1850, Feb 17, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 17, 2016
    Build it for us solo! I'll send you a few trays and knit the pillows for ya! I think lava rocks would work pillowless too but I like the pillow idea as it allows you to easily swap out pillows when roots penetrate during a grow
     
  18. #18 SoloToker, Feb 17, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 17, 2016
    Build it for you? It's so simple. Look up a flood and drain table on youtube. Then look up an auto top off system for hydro systems ( for the reservoir). Boom, you're done. The real kicker for me would be trying to explain to someone why I needed pillow cases made of landscaping fabric...I can't sew lol.

    Solo
     
  19. lava rock or hydroton and some mesh screen to hold them. but why would you want an undercurrent in your sip tray?
    a second reservoir is great though i have one connected to a float valve in my sip tray.

     
  20. More thinking from a DO perspective. Constant flowing water like a babbling Brook for my girls ;)

    Sent from my XT1585 using Grasscity Forum mobile app
     

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