It seems like today the word extremist brings up terror and images of Muslim terrorists. What makes them extremists? it's the fact that they are fundamentalists. They follow their fundamentals? So it's not that being an extremist is bad its that the fundamentals themselves are bad. So If I was an extremist of sleeping I'd probably be the most harmless being on the planet. Now if you put extremism in Christianity or Islam , you get jihad, the witch hunts , and the inquisition. So if we are to despise an extreme group of a religion that means we are disagreeing with the fundamental foundation of the religion and belief. inspired by this debate [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rW4xlg-XdzA&feature=endscreen&NR=1[/ame]
nope.... the fundamentals of Christianity is not to have witch hunts.... extremism is completely diff than fundamentalism..... for example, its said in the bible that only god will know when the world ends....for people that read the bible, that is a fundamental fact. now when u get extreme Christians saying the world is going to end because there are too many homosexuals in the world then that is not fundamentalism but in fact extremism. i dont think that u should throw entire religions undedr the bus because of extremists that probably have only glanced over the literature that they base thier argument from once and think that its tells them to discriminate and force your religion down other ppls throats
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8g59CkSrc4]WBC protest military funeral, Ottumwa, IA - YouTube[/ame] yeah these people arent bad people get rid of religion all together... you're all crazy.
They are extremists because their ideologies are far outside or beyond the norm. Extremism is not fundamentalism; it is the direct opposite of fundamentalism. Ayaan Hirsi Ali is deceitful and her arguments are extremely naive.
Say why and quote the time instead of saying she's naive like we're just suppose to take your word for it.
No, as others have said fundamentalism is not extremism, fundamentalism (which almost no one refers to themselves as, goes for extremists as well) are just people who try to follow the core values as they were many years ago, you can make an argument that the most open Christian is the most fundamental since Christianity wwas meant to be loving and tolerant, though at the same time Jehovah witnesses may be considered "more" fundamental to that particular open Christian I just spoke about because they follow the older traditions of the church, In both cases however, there is no need to commit violence to prove your point, that is not the case in extremism, Which is usually used as a reference to the most closed minded people who will stop at no cost to see their opinions pushed ahead. I guess you can go as far and say extremists are fundamentalist, but fundamentalist aren't necessarily extremists
There's no way Christianity is about love. moderates cherry pick that book like there's no tomorrow. The WBC are an example of a fine christian fundamental group ,which they adhere to the doctrine strictly , which also will be extreme , hence extremists. It's because the core christian values fell out of favor that lead to christian moderates ,this is why there's so many denominations, to fit the cultural context so the religious leaders can have control over the masses. The bible condones Slavery , sexism and stoning to those who pick up sticks on a sunday just to name a few. Now in todays modern world the christian community is slowly going to give up its homophobic values taught by the bible. killing gays Leviticus 20:13 NIV - killing people who leave the faith Deuteronomy 13:6-16 NIV - If your very own brother, or your son - Bible Gateway and some crazy guy using human shit as his cooking fuel. Ezekiel 4:1-15 NIV - Siege of Jerusalem Symbolized -
[quote name='"jayfoxpox"']There's no way Christianity is about love. moderates cherry pick that book like there's no tomorrow. The WBC are an example of a fine christian fundamental group ,which they adhere to the doctrine strictly , which also will be extreme , hence extremists. It's because the core christian values fell out of favor that lead to christian moderates ,this is why there's so many denominations, to fit the cultural context so the religious leaders can have control over the masses. The bible condones Slavery , sexism and stoning to those who pick up sticks on a sunday just to name a few. Now in todays modern world the christian community is slowly going to give up its homophobic values taught by the bible. killing gays Leviticus 20:13 NIV - killing people who leave the faith Deuteronomy 13:6-16 NIV - If your very own brother, or your son - Bible Gateway and some crazy guy using human shit as his cooking fuel. Ezekiel 4:1-15 NIV - Siege of Jerusalem Symbolized -[/quote] Those are just as much cherry picked, and from the old testament btw. Either way, the Bible says many things, why is following your particular post "more fundamental" then following other verses where Jesus is commanding pacifism? ???????? Luke 6:29 If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. Still, by the book Christians aren't extremists until they start killing people to prove their point, that's normal societies definition, if you want to call it something else idrc
So now we're lead to contradictions , proving that you're forced to cherry pick for your beliefs. Old testament is still the word of the same god in case you didn't notice. How can an all-powerful god just do an 180 degree turn on his policies lol.
Extremist is a non-word that lazy people use as a placeholder for actually thinking. They're fundamentalists. They're the same person as the Christians blowing up abortion clinics.
[quote name='"jayfoxpox"']So now we're lead to contradictions , proving that you're forced to cherry pick for your beliefs. Old testament is still the word of the same god in case you didn't notice. How can an all-powerful god just do an 180 degree turn on his policies lol.[/quote] You are cherry picking if I am. Do you not comprehend bud? If there are violent Scriptures along with others commanding pacifism, and you only chose the violent while I only chose the pacifism. How am i only cherry picking while you aren't, do you understand? Were both doing the same thing, a peaceful fundamentalist is just as equal as a mean one in terms of who actually is, "fundamental" A Christian is a follower of Christ. Christ never commanded Christians to follow the old testament and Judaism. Some do some don't. It isn't a requirement ffrom the mouth of jesus
The father and the Christ is the same person. It's the trinity . I'm pointing out the blatantly obvious violent nature of the christian God. You see it takes just a one verse to show how imperfect the Christian God is and it takes one verse to show how unloving he is. If you knew a person's history of crimes of mercilessly kiling people then after, preaches we should love one another ......... there's something wrong with this picture. It must be awfully convenient to toss away the old testament as if your own God's advice can become obsolete. Then when convenient you use some of the stuff that you like like say the 10 commandments? And what makes matters worse is that the 10 commandments christiens use are'nt even the 10 commandments at all.
Fundamentalists would debate that the "heaven and earth shall pass away ...." passage says otherwise. The point is there's justification for pretty much anything in the religious texts of Abrahamic religions, which ones people choose to follow and which they choose to ignore speaks volumes. It also completely destroys all of the religion's credibility but whatever, if it works it works. Any God. Look at how much suffering and pain there is in life. If any God(s) exist then they are 100% malevolent.
[quote name='"jayfoxpox"']The father and the Christ is the same person. It's the trinity . I'm pointing out the blatantly obvious violent nature of the christian God. You see it takes just a one verse to show how imperfect the Christian God is and it takes one verse to show how unloving he is. If you knew a person's history of crimes of mercilessly kiling people then after, preaches we should love one another ......... there's something wrong with this picture. It must be awfully convenient to toss away the old testament as if your own God's advice can become obsolete. Then when convenient you use some of the stuff that you like like say the 10 commandments? And what makes matters worse is that the 10 commandments christiens use are'nt even the 10 commandments at all.[/quote] Oh really bud, when did I use the 10 commandments? Matter afact, your whole response has nothing to do with me or what I said. Which is that you cherry pick for violence as much as I do for peace. Your argument isn't somehow stronger, were both in the saner position. But just saying, thee old testament speaks nothing about a Trinity, and once again to be a Christian by the most basic definition is to believe Jesus is God. Just because your Christian doesn't mean you have to follow the OT, some do some don't, why are the ones that claim they do more important than the ones that don't? Stop generalizing
[quote name='"gedio"'] Fundamentalists would debate that the "heaven and earth shall pass away ...." passage says otherwise. The point is there's justification for pretty much anything in the religious texts of Abrahamic religions, which ones people choose to follow and which they choose to ignore speaks volumes. It also completely destroys all of the religion's credibility but whatever, if it works it works. Any God. Look at how much suffering and pain there is in life. If any God(s) exist then they are 100% malevolent.[/quote] Exactly, so idont get why Christians who solely follow peaceful Scriptures, are considered not "real" Christians to many athesist I speak to, but ones who are very close minded are the examples always used when speaking on Christianity
Fundamentalists follow the core values and stick literally to what has been told to them. Extremists use core values to validate their own beliefs. That's it.
You just agreeds that any extremist is considered a fundamentalists Christian. I'm stating an example that the overwhelming majority of Christians follow ( 10 commandments). It seems you missed my point. How can a God be considered loving when there's so many examples in the bible of him killing people without mercy for petty reasons? Then all of the sudden he comes in human form and acts all gentle? I'll admit I specifically chose these verses to demonstrate how evil the christian God and how crazy the teachings are ,but now that means you can't say Christianity was meant to be loving and tolerant when clearly he commanded these awful deeds.
[quote name='"jayfoxpox"'] You just agreeds that any extremist is considered a fundamentalists Christian. I'm stating an example that the overwhelming majority of Christians follow ( 10 commandments). It seems you missed my point. How can a God be considered loving when there's so many examples in the bible of him killing people without mercy for petty reasons? Then all of the sudden he comes in human form and acts all gentle? I'll admit I specifically chose these verses to demonstrate how evil the christian God and how crazy the teachings are ,but now that means you can't say Christianity was meant to be loving and tolerant when clearly he commanded these awful deeds.[/quote] I said in my very first post that basically all extremists are fundamentalist but not all fundamentalist are extremists. You cant give the OT more validation over the NT when discussing the reason Christianity was created, Jesus does say in the Bible that he isn't here to do away with the old laws, but to restate the true intentions of God. It is reasoned by many Christians I know, that the OT and Judaism were the absolute truth once upon a time, but that man corrupted it over time. That's what Christians usually say in response to Jewish criticism, and its actually the same logic Muslims use when validating their faith.
These people are bad, but as the OP said, they are good in that they point out the ridiculousness of religion at its core. I actually prefer fundamentalists who stick to the ridiculousness of their religions over New Age spiritualists who try to interpret everything as metaphor and revise religion to be something universally important. I'd rather people represent the truth of their religion than bring out the yoga beads and try to slither religion into modern science and society.