White Widow Grow- Generic Potting Soil vs. Miricle Grow

Discussion in 'Growing Marijuana Indoors' started by SmknVTEC, Sep 24, 2007.

  1. High Folks.

    Those of you who know me know that I am against Miricle Grow Soil with time release ferts because my first two grows were ruined by that and similar soils [see PGAMG in my sig]. Many people argue and say that inexperienced growers screw up their own grows and MG is just an innocent bystander.

    Well, I now have almost five years of indoor soil growing experience so, I figure I should give it another try to prove what I already know.

    I will be starting off with four White Widow seeds from Gypsy Nirvana. There will be three in my generic potting soil that I have used ever since the initial disasters and one of the beloved $10 seeds will be wasted ahem used in the name of science, in MG vegetable and flower soil that "feeds up to three months".

    First thing I noticed was how clumpy and heavy the MG Soil is compared to the other soil. This is why drainage is often a problem and I have opted to NOT use additional perlite because a lot of peeps starting off don't know or want to use it.

    Secondly, by doing a run-off test from the initial watering prior to putting in the seed, I noticed that the three pots with generic soil gave a run-off pH between 6.5-6.8. That was with nothing added to my tap water which by the way is at about 7.15 pH. The MG pot however was giving me a reading of 7.2. This was strange and counter-intuitive to me because chemical nutes should lower the pH not raise it; at least in theory.

    So right off the bat, before I even put the seed in, I had to add the pH downer to get it to 6.5. It actually took me a few pitchers of water to lower it because the shit would just not lower. So, it basically accomplished a flush before I even got the seed in which was admittedly frustrating because it would just not lower. The last pitcher of water I gave it was pH at about 6.0.

    Third thing was I only saw a few tiny little fert balls so picking them out in an attempt to stop over fertilizing I think would be a waste. The soil itself must have fertilizer as well.

    Other stats:
    8" pots to start followed by three gallon pots to finish.
    400 watt MH for veg 400 watt Hortilux HPS for flower
    About one month for veg 18/6 [no 24/7 to start because using MH instead of CFL]
    Fox Farm three pack [organic] for food
    One female will be dedicated as a cloning mother

    As we all know WW is probably the most sensitive strain to fertilizer so if this soil works on these it will work for anything. As a footnote, I had a few WW's that got hungry at week two of life so I fed them then and they were fine. This is also early for feeding and I never have needed to feed that early. Maybe it was the MH light I used for the first time?

    Anyway, I won't feed the one in MG until it needs it which will probably between mid flowering to never.

    Stay tuned for pictures and I will put them in the soil after clicking this reply button.
  2. Germination complete.
    400 watt MH fired up 18/6.
  3. Im watching
  4. Cool welcome gonejah17.
    I think today would be about day 7 and interestingly the seedlings seem a little stretched. I wonder if it is the MH. I usually just start with the hortilux hps which is 55,000 lumens vs. the 400 mh's 36,000 lumens. I wonder if the HPS is better for them especially with the extra blue that the hortuilux bulb has.

    No matter I will keep them under the MH for now and get pics up tomorrow of the plants.

    I also have some basil and peppers rooting in my aeroponic cloner which is a pain because the pH does fluctuate some.

    Oh and the Miricle grow plant still looks normal. I give it another two weeks before it gets burnt. Maybe me watching and adjusting the pH will keep her green. We will see.
  5. yeah I bet that HPS will be better, especially one with some blue . . .

    Ive been wondering the same thing, I.E. if I should switch to HPS for veg. its a tricky think lol this color spetrum vs lumen output situation:p
  6. Yo, smknv, I say that you posted something about WW being real sensitive to soil.

    Well, I got a 3 week WW seedling that just recently started turning really yellow, but it still looks healthy otherwise. It is in Ocean Forest soil, and it's under a 400W HPS set on 24-0. I'll switch to 18-6 this weekend, I just dont have my grow area light proof enough yet, so it would be pointless to have the light switching off every night.


    Do you have any expert ideas of what it could be? or should I just sit tight and wait?


    Sorry for the off-topic question tho, I've read the thread, and it should be real interesting to see what happens. I'm kinda running that experiment right now too :), not with my WW plant tho.
  7. Hey sloppy. Hard to tell just yet. It's either starting N deficiency [unlikely with that soil] or nute toxicity [more likely with the soil]. Lets wait a bit and see if any necrosis starts on the leaves.

    The MG soil I have does not have those yellow fert balls. Just thought I would mention that.
  8. Almost 2 weeks old here and they look pretty good.
    The MG plant was off on pH at 7.2 run-off and 7.15 soil. I adjusted it back into range.
    All other three in generic soil hold pH of about 6.8 w/no adjustments.
    MG soil plant is the one in foreground [front].

    Attached Files:

  9. lookin good vtec

    yo can u post a pic of the ph tester u use man I just got this BUNK ass one and I need to get one that works now
  10. This is a good experiment :) Im very interested to see how the MG soil will affect the grow as I have heard alot about how it shouldnt be used in soil grows. Seeing the result of this test with my own eyes is something I look forward too :)

    Keep it up bro!

  11. ya, I've always been warned to steer clear of mg likes its the narcos. But I've never seen why, thanks for dedicating a brave solider V.
  12. i'm growing in mg time release potting soil whats wrong with it. my plants are all a nice healthy green. i just started flowering:D
  13. some will say that the amount of nutrients released from time-release fert. will burn or even kill a pot plant, especially when it's very young. Once a plant gets older I would think its less susceptible to this. SmknVTECH says that HID lights will make the time-release release over a very short time periods, killing plants. But it has been successfully used before, it WILL work, just maybe with poorer results.

  14. got any pics of ur MG plants man????
  15. Smkn, I'm happy to see a side-by-side from a knowledgeable grower. I'm curious what the results will be.

    There are a lot of horror stories about MG time-release, but there are a lot of horror stories about EVERY aspect of growing. It's like an MJ-episode of Myth Busters!

    I'll definitely keep an eye on this.
  16. chemical fertilizers suck. even if they don't kill your plants, they kill it's flavor.

    everything your plants eat can affect it's flavor. i won't touch bloodmeal anymore after getting leaflet trim that tasted like rust. blech!

    even in concentrations below recommendations, my powdered fertilyzer gave previous plants a particularly nasty burning metallic/chemical flavor.

    i'm inclined to go with the authour of the cannibible claiming the best weed is organic and even hydroponic doesn't quite taste right with any strain except chem dawg

  17. Here ya go buddy.
    It is the Hanna digital with pH, PPM, EC anmd temp guage. Waterproof too. It was pricey at $R1490-160 but if you skip the other features and go just for pH, it comes way down.

    Welcome milsy. MG time release with yellow fert balls does burn seedlings. It is especially bad for beginner growers as well. Maybe I can make it work since I am closely monitoring pH.

    Yup it can sometimes be bad.

    Drop some pics with details on these plants if you can.

    It does release it faster, that inconjunction with the fact that weed can handle only a fraction of the fertilizer that vegetables can, makes it a poor choice. And this stuff retains water. I was struggling to get the pH in check by adding more and more water and the sioil could not drain it out very well. I stopped at good enough because I was worried to over water.

    Ha thanks myth buster brought to you by VTEC.

    I agree. My stuff grown with non-ferted soil but chemical nutes has a slight chemical harshness/taste to it. Can't wait to try the organic ferts on these.

    Attached Files:

  18. THANKS SO MUCH VTEC for hittin me with the PH meter info. Ive had no luck with mine and need to get a reliable one. I was lookion at the BIG DOG HANNA but too expensive, thanks again homie, helpful as always :D:D

    Ur plants chillin???

    Interesting and helpfull to a newbie, would you expect Water Soluble All Purpose MG Plant Food to affect the taste as well?? Probably, huh?? I switched from Organic FF Grow Big to "WSAPMGPF" per recommendation here on GC but didnt think about it affecting the taste - so thanks thats good info man . . . . I think Ill be going organic if the taste isnt quite right with the MG.

    And I LOVE CHEMDAWG!!!!!!
  19. aside from my bias of chemicals affecting taste (don't grow near train trackes either unless you want weed that tastes like oil! i just think that nature knows best.

    think of foods YOU eat... which tastes better...
    frozen foods or foods made fresh with good ingredients?
    imitation flavoring or the real thing (artificial sugar is downright NASTY!)
    a box of chocolate chip cookies with preservatives etc. or home made ones?

    if you don't like eating chemicals, then why would you want to smoke them?

    i like the idea of giving plants the best quality organic ingredients to make them happy along with lots of love.

    i worked with a guy that had that philosophy that did his own grows with off the shelf hyponex potting soil and his very own nutrient rich food compost.

    not counting the few strains i've smoked that had specific flavors like the yummy red pepper flavor of kali mist, it was some of the tastiest weed i ever had. it just tasted so clean and fresh.

    i actually think that THAT'S why dogs can track people by their odors. they aren't smelling anything genetically related, they're just smelling the chemicals from all of the different things one person ate that another didn't.

    i know from personal experience that i quit liking beef in the 80s when all of a sudden it had a livery iron taste only to find out a few years later that farmers were feeding leftover cow meat back to them (that's where mad cow disease comes from BTW... it's the cow version of guru laughing sickness) and a buddy i used to work with from kansas city used to rave how much better their local corn fed beef tastes than what the rest of the country is used to. one movie also has a brief scene mentioning how delicious japanese soy fed beef is too.

    you really are what you eat.
  20. Here they are at 17 days. Terrible pics sorry gotta run soon.
    pH had to be adjusted on 3 plants, 2 regular soil and of course the MG soil. I also fed today because I saw some spots that look like they were hungry. MG PLANT not fed. Better pics next week when I get back.

    EDIT Forgot to mention that from Friday to Monday, they will be put under 4 27 watt CFL's; 2 6500K and 2 2700k .

    Attached Files:

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