Technically, I was running 1500 watts over that plant. I had a thousand over each tray, with one in the middle. All in all, 3k watts in with 2, 2' x 4' grow trays. The plant in the picture was on the outside edge of one of my trays though...which has the least amount of coverage. And as far as a free light, I'm not offering that to anyone else, yet everyone would ask me if I did it. He can have the same offer listed on my site (50% off) for a MH/HPS grow test, and I'll do the discount up front to make it easier. As far as a free light though, I wouldn't consider it unless I get it back after the grow. I don't believe in having your cake and eating it too, especially when you're so pessimistic about LED's, and act like the best grower out there. It's not my job to prove to Rumple that LED's work, and outperform HID, by giving him a free light to test. Seriously, 4 out of 5 current growers share his attitude... The ones who are actually interested in getting better results, are the ones who are already trying LED's...like yourself Irish. If he wants a light to test that he doesn't have to pay for (not playing by the same rules as everyone else), then he won't get to keep it. If he wants to act like everyone else, he can do the 50% up front.
I don't think you can compare 1 plant from a grow where you had 3000watts going to a single plant. Thats not even close to a thorough test. I say let rumple do the test and he'll return the light when he's done. Hell, I guarantee if it gives him good results he'll buy it.
If Rumple agrees to that, I have no problems doing it. And as far as the comparison, it's pretty damn good. I took a plant on the outside corner of my grow space (ie: the farthest point away from any of my 1000's), and snapped a picture of it. If I wanted to show you the best, I would have taken a picture of the plants directly underneath 2, 1000W lights.
I dont remember saying I was a better grower. Why so defensive? So you made them nice bud with HIDs. We have all seen amazing results from HIDs, just nothing more then mediocre from LEDs. You missed my point and made it personal. We are all waiting to see something other then cool charts and long facts lists from LED sales. Have not seen any amazing buds like the ones you grew with 3000 watts of HID lights. God of weed growing? Did I say that? I grow two plants in a broom closet to give my beautiful wife some relief from her glaucoma. Ok thats just being mean. You said I needed to run a 1000W light in a 2'x4'. I showed you my results using half that much light in a 2'x4' space and gave details. How could I do it in a way that was more humble for you? I don't think I need more light and I can back it up. It was dialog. Are you telling me I am not using enough light in a 2'x4' closet? I am telling you what I see with LED results so far. If doing this without pulling punches is pessimistic, then I will have to live with that comment. But I am in every LED grow thread for a reason. I want it to be true. As much as you even more perhaps. Both nice buds. Yours looks much bigger, great work: I was hoping that bud was grown with LEDs. That would have shut me up fast.
I will grow my next cycle with any lamp you want to send (don't mess around, send the 318). If it out performs my hid, then I will buy two of them (just to be safe). No need to return anything and I will be glad to pay full price. I will send it back if it fails because I already have a clone light. Next cycle starts October 3rd.
if u get good results off of that 318w i will buy 2 of them and so will my friends. so ur saying if it will beat ur 400w hid, u will by 2? should'nt be a problem if it = to a 1000w hps. you realy dont belive in leds at all do u?
No, thats not what I said. If they have a better product, then I want it. Hell I want two of um. I want a bakup and some overkill. Please give me a reason to belive. I want to believe but no one can show real results (just messed up lettuce). Don't get her all mad at me again dude.
i am sorry i am stoned as hell. i was just playing. shit man u might be able to change this whole led thing forever. we all know u can grow like a champ. IMOP. but was for real on if it dose go good for u i will buy two of them and my friends will buy them for sure.
From the other results I have seen, I'm not so sure the outcome will be favorable for LEDs. But I have been wrong lots of times before. Would love to be wrong about this one.
i would love for u to be wrong to! or maybe not because i would be broke from buying all kinds of leds.lol. but for real if i can see anyone do a led grow i would want it to be u.
You know Rumple, you're right, I did come off a bit strong in that last post. It's just that your second post into this thread was more of a "I'm a know it all, and I'll tell you what your light can or can't do." with statements like this: "Your overpriced LED lamp can't out perform a 400W HID. And to compare it to a 1000W is laughable. The debate should be: What works better CFLs or LEDs." This is just one quote, but all in all, the majority of your post was provoking. When provoked, I don't play nice all the time. 1 of my 126W units compares to a 400W, not a 1000W. 3 of them, placed together like you saw in the pictures, compares to slightly over a 1000W. And instead of telling me what I can't do, why not keep an open mind, and say "I'd be interested to see your LED outperform a 400W". If you go to the indoor growing forums, you'll see I have a grow going currently with tomatoes (yep, have to be able to list it on my commercial site), and a 126W vs a 400W Hortilux Blue MH. The LED is growing at nearly twice the rate. As far as sending you a free light, I've never met you, I don't know you, and the first interaction I had with you on this forum was not positive. Now you're asking me to send you an $1100 product, and trust you with it...? Yes, you have lots of posts, but so did I years ago on various forums, before I got tired of them. I guess after a few years off, I decided to come back. It would be fun to give you the light, but quite honestly, my budget's already shot for the month, as I sent two of those units to a Pro who writes books you probably read when you first started growing. He'll be using 2, 318W against a 600W HPS, so I don't really need two guys doing virtually the same test. The best I can offer you is my cost on the light, and a full refund once your grow is finished. If you want more after that, screw the refund and I'll send you another.
By the way, these plants are about 3 weeks into bloom, under solely LED. There are 4, 126W units above a 4' x 2' tray. Once finished, they should resemble much like your pictures and mine.
the biggest problem growers have with leds, is they buy the wrong ones... like "oh ima buy this black-light and grow pot! ...yeah!" hps cfls, leds, hid- who cares? whatever works for the grower. i have seen good results with them all. but the final product isn't just a result of light. - and we all know it. *every grow condition is different. it isn't fair to compare plants grown in different conditions with different nutes, cycles, training, etc... and say that it all comes from light... cmon guys (and gal)...
Lighting is primarily responsible for growth rate and yield. Yes, there are lots of other factors: hydro vs dirt, air temp, whether or not they use CO2, mylar etc... That's the main reason I do side-by-side grow tests, with all conditions the same except for the light. Same nutes, same air, same temp, same mylar, same systems, etc... That way, you get an unbiased result, that shows you exactly what the difference is light to light. I'd say second to light, what controls yield is heat/atmospheric CO2, and lastly, nutes. I've used lots of nutes from a lot of different companies, and found that most of them work pretty comparably. There are products out there that indeed give you a higher quality yield (like Advanced Connoisseur), but you also pay out the ass for them, and I haven't noticed an increase in yield using them. Anyhow, you bring up a valid point, and it's kinda weird that no one else has brought it up yet.
i think light plays a big role but the most important in yeild is the grower! you cant just find any hid grow on the fourms and compair them to leds. it has to be the same grower growing both with leds and hid. the brian is the best yeilding tool their is. you cant compare any light to and other light because some joe smith was using a 400w hid and some other guy using leds beat his yeild. every grower, strain, nutes, conditions are not the same.
In my experience with teaching others how to grow, it takes most people at least 2 years before they get any good at growing, regularly (although yes, some are naturals). It takes longer for them to become great at it. The grower can be the biggest variable in the equation, depending on who's comparing to who. For example, I find that Rumple and I are fairly comparable when it comes to results. He produces about a 1lbs per 400W, and I do about 2.5 - 3lbs per 1000W. His yield and my yield are virtually the same, with completely different methods. If you compared our results to someone who's only been growing for a year, you'd see that even though they may have the same equipment, method, and/or conditions, their yield might be less than half. Anyhow, it's another good point to bring up Irish, which is why the only good test results come from the kind we'll hopefully be doing soon.
I feel most of us have a right to be a bit skeptical of any LED manufacture's claims or hosted comparison (given the track record). It does not suprise me at all that you would not sanction an un-biased test of your lamps by me. When money is involved like that, it is hard for me and others to trust your claims, pictures, or facts. It has to be grass roots real growers(no pun intended). Not a lot you can do or say will turn the tide of skepticism. Please don't take it as a personel attack. You are growing in the same size grow area I do. Except you use $1500 in lights that consume more electricity then mine. Ok, I know the down side to your strategy, can you tell me the up side to that again? If you think I am being hard on you, well you should see how I feel about CO2 Boost Buckets or the CO2 green pads. Hard questions and head strong opinions don't mean unfriendly feelings by me at all.
[quote name=' If you think I am being hard on you, well you should see how I feel about CO2 Boost Buckets or the CO2 green pads..[/QUOTE'] thats funny because my friend vought one of those co2 boost tanks and spent i dont know like $150 on it.. it didnt do shit. in about 1 month he took it out and threw it away. all i could do if tell him i told u so those thing are a joke.
Irishboy you and your friends buy more high end junk.... Makes me wish I lived down the street from you, so I could sell you all my crap for top dollar. I wish I had though of that CO2 Boost. Total crap, but what a great way to separate knuckleheads from their money. ***Honest, I don't have the heart to steal from the dumb***
Quite honestly, I haven't seen any LED retailers post any grow tests on their own site, or elsewhere. Shouldn't the company who makes the light, have some experience testing it? And if your light does what it says, shouldn't you be able to show that? So don't give me shit for posting an actual test, done by a professional, for people to see. I don't need to sanction an unbiased test by you, as I have a different one already scheduled, with someone who is far more famous than you. I appreciate again, the fact that you think you're the end decider on what works and what doesn't with growing, as somehow you feel entitled to free lights (again, the "god" like attitude). Believe what you want, everyone else does. The pics I posted earlier tonight weren't my grow...but I guess that's not "grassroots" enough for you, since the owners don't even belong to a forum. But it's all good, because in the next week the grow tests will begin, via customers who have already paid for test units. They're your grassroot guys, and will be posting on this site, so keep an eye out. I grow using (2), 2' x 4' trays, each spaced 1 foot apart from each other. Once the plants are in bloom, the total canopy space occupies 5' x 6'. I ran 3, 1000W lights in that area. I run LED now. And yes, I had $1500 in lights (although they cost me a lot less since I owned a hydro store), over 30 square feet. You said your space was 8 square feet. So ya, I ran a lot more energy than you, and produced a lot more than you, as I had far more than 2 plants, in over 3x the space. I really don't care how you feel about either of them. I run a fuzzy-logic controlled, tank-operated CO2 system at 1500ppm, not some ghetto bucket full of cow shit. CO2 allows for plants to endure more stress (ie: higher temperatures), and higher resin production. It also makes a difference in size, but so does strain.