The Never-Ending Battles Of Newbeism

Discussion in 'Sick Plants and Problems' started by ahsanawilliamen, Jun 13, 2013.

  1. #1 ahsanawilliamen, Jun 13, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2013
    I have a Dutch Passions Strawberry Cough that is, as of today, 2 weeks and 3 days into flower. The sad part is she is looking a little rough. The fan leaves on the lower parts of the plant are yellowing drastically, the stems of the fan leaves are turning purple as well, and everyday I am picking up dead fan leaves off the soil. The fan leaves at the top have been losing color and even showing small brown spots. I am suspicious of this being a result of an Extreme Serene foliar feed that some leaves were unable to shake off or rinse off after any plain water foliar feed. I am currently growing in a 7 gallon smart pot aerated container. I am using Roots Organic Greenfields soil, and have started using the Roots Organic nutes in a feed, water, water schedule. I do check the ph of the run off, one of which during a nutrient feeding the ph was as low as 4.5! 
    This to me was not acceptable so I immediately flushed with water that was 6.5. Other times during the standard water feed, the runoff has been at 5.5. So, you can see as of lately I have not been able to lock in a good ph. I am not sure if the plant is sick because of nute burn, or if its a deficiency as a result of nutes being locked out in the random ph. To say the least I do need some help to get her back to healthy again. Any advice is greatly appreciated. 

    Lastly, one of the stems is flattened all the way to a top cola that looks like a peculiar siamese flower. Everything I have read on it seems to say its just a random mutation, but in that, I am concerned about making clones. Advice on this is equally appreciated. 

    Plenty of pics below. Thank you to anyone taking the time to help a fellow newb, I am trying the best to learn as much as I can, but deficiencies for me are hard to depict. I am not exactly colorblind, but close. 

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  2. You seem to have a nice setup and have done pretty well for a beginner. The plants are big. First I would say not to worry about a minor "mutation" if it is such. Some plants just do funny things. If it performs well and you want to clone it then I would certainly do so.
    I think your main problem is your pH. I would certainly correct that before you do anything else. You do not want to make it worse by adding stuff. Continue to flush and irrigate with properly adjusted pH water until you have a runoff around 6 (not lower than that). With such a low pH you're making most of the main nutrients unavailable. That's prob the reason for you deficiency symptoms.
    One thing you might consider is watering with pH 7 water or even just plain tap water (if it has high pH). My water has high pH with many of the base cations so it tends to buffer the soil against drops in pH. If I see my runoff is getting a pH that is too low then I will water with my tap water only. Get a second opinion before you attempt this but I use this method and it works for me. I say do this because you are in flower so it is imprtant that you fix the problem quickly. Hopefully somebody else will chime in.
  3. You're locking out about every nutrient except Zinc, Iron and Copper... do as Marshall9 suggest and flush with tap water, don't stop until ph runs out at 6.5/6.6/6.7/6.8
  4. Thank you for the compliment marshall9. Its a lot better than the closet set up I had previously, I can at least say that much lol. Though I gave in and spoiled myself a little getting a gorilla tent, overall i spent about 400$. Thank you as well mmman, I agree with you both, I think I have locked her out by not paying close enough attention to the ph in the runoff. I always ph the water around 6.3 but I have a feeling the roots organic nutes run pretty hot. So in the future, when I mix the nutes, I will try leaving them sitting out a full 24 hours to see if that will help. Of course I will wait till I resolve this problem to do so. I will flush her today with the precise ph as you have suggested. Wish me luck fellas. If you feel like cruising around my side of GC, or checking up on this grow, stop by and drop a line. I will soon be posting a new grow journal with the new gear I have and my first attempt at clones, as well as a thread for the product review on the gorilla grow tent and customer service I received through shipping. Thanks again guys I appreciate the help.
  5. Update: 
    Just a moment ago I flushed her with tap water I left sitting over night (I hear this helps evaporate the chlorine in the water) and made it 6.6 with some ph down. Frustratingly, the result of the run off was 5.5! I know for sure my meter isn't off cause I calibrated it just before testing the water. The city water here is very alkalotic sometimes with a ph of 8.8-9.0 straight out of the tap. I plan in a moment to flush her again, but should I try it with a higher ph possibly around 7.0-7.3? Would anyone else condone this? Should I be concerned about feeding her the tap without allowing the water sit overnight to evaporate the chlorine?
    Thanks again for the help and advice blades. 
  6. Don't worry about ph'ing your water you use first, simply shoot tap water through until it reads 6.5 at run-off, then continue to run properly ph'ed water of 6.5 through that you've used your commercial ph down until you're sure it's corrected and balanced.
  7. I went through the flush, but for the life of me could not reach anything above 5.6! I spent over 3 hours flushing her with tap water thats as high as 9.2. It was a rigorous flush, that paradoxically turned redundant; I at least poured 40 gallons through the 7 gallon container she is in, having the container elevated, letting it run out constantly. I am beyond discouraged at this point, and not sure what the next step is to take. I plan to run to the local hydrostore tomorrow morning, to see if they can help me with this locked ph. Do you guys have any suggestions for anything I should pick up to raise the run off? I heard lime can help if the ph is being stubborn, but I have never ran into this problem before, so at this point I am just guessing. After reading over many forums looking for similar situations such as mine, I have yet to of found a solution.
    I am weary of getting advice from the growstore, because I more than often end up walking out with shit I dont need. Sorry to make you guys babysit the newb but I'm at a loss if this isn't fixed the best way possible as soon as possible. Thanks for sticking around and helping out. Its currently quite obvious there is more to learn, and I have always been told this is a good thing, but I haven't been put in my place in a while so its hitting me where it hurts (my ego). I need to work on this green thumb. 
    Any suggestions will help greatly so I can at least know where to start. Again, thank you for the help. 
  8. Only option you have at this point is to get some help if you can and get her into some fresh soil. If you can get her into a larger tub to wash away the toxins, then replant. Sorry I am out of options also.
  9. I began to reflect after my last post and I remembered one dude I was helping that had to flush 60 gallons through his plant before his was corrected... you might try more water before you give up, if so please let me know.
  10. #10 ahsanawilliamen, Jun 14, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2013
    I will definitely try that method this evening. At this point I will almost try anything. Before I went to the growstore this morning, I took a good hard look over my girl and found what seemed to look like a small amount of powdery mildew on some of the fan leaves! As if I didn't already have enough problems as she sits. I shamefully sighed to myself for the lack of better attention she deserves to be payed. I have epically failed this go around to say the least, and I feel like a terrible farmer.  
    I took a trip to the growstore and spoke with the owner for sometime over my plethora of dilemmas. Apparently, one is very limited to the various foliar products available at the store when one is two weeks into flower. For the mild mildew problem I was suggested a bottle of NPK Industries Power Wash, and was told to spray her during lights out a couple of hours before the lights go on. I was also recommended a bottle of Botanicare Clearex for the ph issue to hopefully wash away any built ups that may have occurred through out the fluctuating ph I have had thus far. I am crossing my fingers that these two products help with the serious issues she has.
    I will give an update tonight and let you know how the applications went. Thanks again for the advice and concerns. I don't have any personal friends that can help with growing- at least none that are up to par in horticultural knowledge. So thank you for your attention and help with my grow. Not to pull on any heart strings but it really does help more than most would think. 
    Wish me luck fellow blades. 

    Quick Update: The bottle of Power Wash I was recommended ended up being the wrong type of solution I needed for the minor mildew problem. I was supposed to pick up a bottle of PM Wash, made specifically to resolve mold and mildews. I can apply this through out any stage of growth from what I have read and what I was told. Again, cross your fingers and wish me luck.
  11. #11 Jackson55, Jun 14, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 14, 2013
    mmman you are an idiot. every problem people have you say its ph. PH lock out is the answer that people give when they don't really know whats wrong. 
    All you do is promote over watering while leading beginners to believe ph is so important. more important then over watering, more important then too much nutes. more important then anything. When people have deficiencies it's most likely the roots not ph.
    To tell some one to change there soil at this stage is idiotic. His plant's aren't that bad. In fact i think they look good and my recommendation is to do exactly what you have been. Your too close to the end. All plants in soil have to be flush regularly to prevent build up. Doing it for the sake of ph run off is stupid and just promotes over watering. If you  keep watering that 7 gallon pot when it doesn't need water then when you get to the end of flowering your roots will be so bad that when you flush for taste of smoke the plant will be so screwed up it wont use up the nutes inside and your smoke will taste bad.
    Stop and think about what you are doing on this site. I looked and every single reply you have is that it is a ph problem. You are delusional.
  12. #12 ahsanawilliamen, Jun 15, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2013
    Mmman are you just gonna sit back and take that condescending tone from Jackson55? Haha Im being facetious if you cant read MY tone. Calm down lads, I didn't post my sickly lady for us to argue over her, I think she deserves a little more respect than that. I have multiple issues with her, that in an hour I will be sweating away over. I hate to disagree with you Jackson, but if I flushed her abundantly last night with a tap of 9.2 and the run off would not budge from 5.6, I believe I do have a ph problem. Which is not the only problem I have. PM is another problem I ran into this morning. I don't think its a coincidence of interest to often suggest to others to check ph or flush, its a common mistake most beginners make, and very easy to overlook if not paid close attention to.
    The leaves sure do seem like they are showing deficiencies though I could be wrong. I am only two weeks into flower and from my experience I usually don't see the fan leaves sacrifice so much so early. Again I could be wrong, if so please do point me in the right direction vs pointing fingers. Lets stay on target to help each other, show some love, and refrain from name calling. 
    Jackson do you have any suggestions with what I should do next? I did buy some Clearex and some PM Wash, both of which I will be applying to her tonight in an attempt to keep her kosher. If there is anything missing feel free to let me know. If you feel this is a bad decision let me know asap as well. Would you suggest any other methods to clear things up? 
    Thanks in advance. 
  13. They definetely don't have nute burn. 
    As far as the black spots go. I don't know. I do know that when I use to foliar feed that the spots were light brown not black, and they were round. Maybe its some disease or pest. I don't know. It's not PH HaHa
    If you have been ph'ing your water and nutes when you feed then I doubt it's PH. If it is a deficiency it is far more likely to be the roots not doing so well or you need to up the nutes a little. If you use ro water then you have to ad some cal mag.
    The pots you are using are very big. Did you think you did a good job of watering only when they needed it? At this point I don't think there is much you can do for the light green leafs except decide for your self if you have been giving it the right amount of nutes and if you have a good root system from only water when you absolutely need to. They don't look droopy like a plant that has been over watered so I would say you need to up the nutes a little.
    You do have to flush regularly to prevent nut build up but that PPM not PH
    You really do have to worry about your roots 10 more then you ph.
  14. Well I flushed with the Clearex last night, as well as a foliar feed with the PM Wash and to my surprise both sufficed. The ph went from 5.5 to 6.3, and after trimming her a bit, and applying the wash she seems fine. Lights go on tonight at 8 so here in a bit, I will know for certain. I trimmed the leaves that were infected the most with pm by putting sandwich bags over the leaves before I clipped them. After a long day of reading yesterday, I found that this was the best procedure to take to keep from spreading more spores throughout my tent. 
    When I moved her to the bathroom for the flush, I had my wife help me with a heavy clean of the entire room. Swept, moped, and moved out any extra furniture within the room. We also thoroughly wiped the tent down from top to bottom with bleach while leaving the carbon scrubber running- to keep the smell from effecting us and the plant.
    So for now, Id say most of my issues have been taken care of, though I don't want to speak to soon. I will post again if I see a lack of improvement, although in that case I may cut my loses, and start over with some White Russian. I hear that strain is known for its disease resistances, though I could be wrong about this. 
    Till next time. 
  15. hurt my brain reading some of that, but now I'm hooked on the story
    I want to see some current pics of this plant
  16. Thanks for keeping the interest Flatulist. I'll post some pics here shortly of her current shape. I still have a question if anyone has an answer from experience. I wonder if I should feed her some nutrients soon? I suspect that after the redundant flush-that wouldn't go up from 5.5-that my soil has very little nutrients left. So basically, I want to get her some food if a good flush will make her hungry. Other than that I hope I'm pretty squared away.
    I do worry about this PM becoming an issue for any future plants though. I'm not sure what the best procedures are to take in order to completely eradicate the spores but I am willing to go to any measure to prevent it. Being the newb I am, I'm sort of worried about powdery mildew and it being a health issue, because I know nothing about it. Nor have a found any good advice forum searching, but I will keep looking till I find an answer. (TBC...)
  17. The first two pictures are when she got her first flush and before I did any trimming, before using clearex. 
    Pictures 3-10 are of the powdery mildew I believe to have, these pictures I took before any trimming, and before any PM wash was applied. Some pictures you may see what looks like a liquid substance, when wiped dry it turns into a salty feeling white powder residue left on the leaf. When sprayed with PM Wash, it comes right off, and when the foliar dries its no longer there. 
    The last remaining pictures are pictures I took today. You'll see some trimming I did at the bottom to give it better air circulation through out the plant. I also took these pictures during lights off so they might not be as great. I'll add more for lights on in case anyone wants to see a better quality picture. 

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  18. #18 ahsanawilliamen, Jun 20, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2013
    PM is being kept at bay with the Pm wash, but I have to apply it every day or two. I just gave it a feed of General organics nute line yesterday, but before feeding the ph read 4.5 after the mix. I had the exact same problem with the roots organic, which I believe is what caused my run off to be so low. I fed with 1 1/2 gallons of nutes and topped it off with plain 7.0 water. The run off in doing this was 5.7. Which I believe is still a little low and would be happier if it was at 6. Has anyone else ran into similar issues? 
    I just dont understand how the ph can be so low when adding nutrients? 
    Upon reading over 60 pages on a single thread  about PM, Eagle20EW was suggested, and that supposedly completely eradicates the powdery mildew. But after reading all the way through of course you can only apply during vegetation, and the chemical application requires of you to wear extensive clothing as well as gloves, eye gear, and respirator. I have somewhat of a conscience when it comes to spraying harmful chems on my plants, with that being said, I am not quite sure what other options I have left in order to completely fix and remove this disease? What else can you apply during flower?

    I have some current pics. One or two with the powdery mildew build up on a few leaves, some PM that is closer to the buds then I would like for it to be. Not really sure if I should just break this grow down and start a new? Or if I should try and stick this out? Currently its sort of discouraging, and I would like to make sure the spores will not be carried into my next grow. According to others this shit is hard to get rid of, even after a thorough cleansing of tent and room. This is a colossal debacle. 

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