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the most bullshit i've ever seen in one place

Discussion in 'General' started by weedzilla420, Apr 12, 2007.

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  1. #1 weedzilla420, Apr 12, 2007
    i just got done reading a yahoo news article that irritated me:
    http://news.yahoo.com/s/realclearpo...bcs_the_vie;_ylt=AqKYa5_QsZC8tqku40sT1CTMWM0F

    the author of the article is criticizing rosie o'donnel for her role in the 9/11 truth movement. the author tires to equate 9/11 truthers with holocaust deniers with the most ridiculous, round about logic i've ever seen. he also refers to 9/11 truthers as "laughable loons"

    he claims that 9/11 truthers "hate" america and its people. he makes several false claims in his article. he says that o'donnel cites studies and experts without citing any studies or experts. he says she is not qualified to make claims about structural engineering because she has no knowledge or experience in the field. she never purported that she did. she simply cited studies by qualified experts such as steven jones (top physics professor at byu) who i'm sure is much more qualified to make statements and develop theories on structural engineering the the author of the article.

    once again, the people against the movement launch attacks at the truthers. and once again, they do not attack, negate, or argue against one single, solitary argument the 9/11 truthers make, rather they launch personal attacks against the people themselves by branding them with insults such as "laughable loons". they are unable to attack any of the movement's arguments because they have no arguments against the irrefutable, damning, and incriminating information. so instead, they attempt to discredit these individuals by attacking them personally instead of the information in their arguments. they try to turn the mainstream public off by attacking the messenger, not the message.

    i believe the movement is gaining momentum moreso than it ever has before. a theatrical version of loose change narrated by charlie sheen will be released in theaters this coming fall.

    here is the full text of said article:
    Who's Next to Host ABC's The View -- David Duke? Steven Zak
    Tue Apr 10, 3:30 PM ET



    Deniers of 9/11 and of the Holocaust are two of a kind. It is a given that television networks put profits above pride, but ABC has reached a new low in its sponsorship of Rosie O'Donnell. The daytime talk show host recently joined the world of "truthers" --people who believe that 9/11 was an attack staged by this country's own government.

    ADVERTISEMENT


    On ABC's popular The View, O'Donnell lent her expert opinion that it is impossible for the World Trade Center's building 7 "to fall the way it fell without explosives being involved." To say otherwise, she added, "is beyond ignorant." (When she isn't offering instruction on the fine points of structural engineering, O'Donnell entertains by hanging upside-down from a rope.)

    If this all sounds like the howling of a rabid dog, O'Donnell isn't alone in the kennel. A recent poll from the Scripps Research Center found that more than a third of Americans believe that 9/11 was an "inside job." Those who actively promote the idea, though, are more than mere laughable loons. They bear resemblance to another particularly virulent conspiracy nut -- the Holocaust denier.

    It may be coincidence that O'Donnell's 9/11 denial has manifested itself in such close proximity to Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's "Holocaust conference" of last December, but she sounds a lot like many of its participants.

    Both profess interest in the pursuit of truth.

    Mahammad Ali Ramini, advisor to Ahmadinejad, announced that he would chair a committee to find "the truth on the genocide of Jews."

    O'Donnell says that she is merely "trying, as always, for a rigorous truth."

    And both profess total objectivity in that pursuit.

    Iranian Foreign Minister Manouchehr Mottaki made an offer to British Prime Minister Tony Blair to send "independent investigators" to visit former Nazi death camps -- people "who are not sympathetic" to the Nazis nor "to the Zionist regime."

    "I have begun doing exactly what this country, at its best, allows for me to do," wrote O'Donnell on her blog. "Inquire. Investigate."

    Yet for both, "truth" precedes "investigation."

    The Holocaust, Ahmadinejad said at the start of the "conference," is a "myth."

    The terrorist attack of 9/11, said O'Donnell at the mere outset of her "inquiry," "is impossible."

    Both make shameless use of fabricated math and science.

    "The number of victims at the Auschwitz concentration camp," said Australian Holocaust denier Frederick Toben, "could be about 2,007. The railroad to the camp did not have enough capacity to transfer large numbers of Jews."

    "I do believe that it's the first time in history that fire has ever melted steel," said O'Donnell. "It is physically impossible."

    And both cite "studies" or "experts" without actually citing any studies or experts.

    "All the studies and research carried out so far have proven that there is no reason to believe that the Holocaust ever occurred," said former Iranian interior minister and Hezbollah cofounder Ali Akbar Mohtashamipour.

    "Look at the films, get a physics expert in here from Yale, from Harvard, pick the school," said O'Donnell.

    The worlds of deniers O'Donnell and Ahmadinejad intersected more overtly when the former defended the latter's hostage taking of 15 British sailors and Royal Marines who, O'Donnell ruled by fiat, "went into Iranian waters and they were seized by the Iranians." O'Donnell added her expression of sympathy for mass murderers the world over: "Don't fear the terrorists. They're mothers and fathers."

    Only one with the most sinister sentiments toward the country that gave her so much for so little could express such warm regard for its most determined enemies. And therein lies the real similarity between Holocaust deniers and 9/11 deniers. The "theories" of both, which could otherwise only be explained as serious psychopathology, are but expressions of venom and bile. The former hate Jews (and, often, the United States). The latter hate the United States (and, often, Jews).

    White House press secretary Tony Snow's description of Ahmadinejad's conference as "a platform of hatred," then, applies as well to the current incarnation of The View.

    Which leads to this question: If ratings were strong, would ABC allow, say, David Duke to host a show on which he preached his doubts about the Holocaust and his fondness for Nazis? Stay tuned and the answer will soon be revealed -- by whether and how fast the network pulls the plug on O'Donnell.
     
  2. #2 JollyRoger227, Apr 12, 2007
    Personally, I think there's a BIG difference between denying the holocaust and doubting a government that lies to you daily.

    People really are ridiculous in this country
     
  3. #3 Qoric, Apr 12, 2007
    Republican blabber doesn't really matter what they say anymore i have generally assumed w/e they say to be wrong and most the time i'm right o'donnel is probally right.
     
  4. #4 20fan, Apr 12, 2007
    Truthers? This 9/11 conspiricy shit is all about discrediting the war. What would happen if a person in say Iran put out a story with conspiricy claims like this? He would get his head chopped off! Be glad you live in a country that allows you to say and believe this crap without reprisals. Let me ask you this. Who are we fighting in Iraq? Have you ever been to Iraq? Have you ever been to the Middle East? Do you think that the jews have a right to exist on this planet? Where do you get your information? I have always been told, "believe nothing you hear, and only 1/2 of what you see. You make comments about shit you read on the internet. My son is in Iraq (2nd tour). I choose to believe what he and his fellow soldiers tell me over anything else. Not what some chicken shit reporter hiding in a fortified bunker pissing his pants says. Do you know where CNN, ABC, CBS, etc. get their news stories? I'll tell you, they buy them from Iraqi citizens. They do not report on what they have seen, unless it's after the fact. If you were a poor Iraqi, and you wanted $. Don't you think the juicier the story, the more chance that CNN reporter is going to buy your's over the others? I do not think ANYBODY, fat ass O'donnel, Micheal Moore, Sean Penn, etc. has any right to make any kind of claim whatsover. They are not there. They do not see what is actually happening. I think for the sake of the men and women that are there, serving this country, People need to Shut the Fuck up! They need our support, not conspiricy theories. I am neither a republican or democrat. I was in Bahrain in '90 and '91. Those people there are totally fucked in the head. We found weapons of mass destruction (Chemical weapons) then. If you want to know where they were this last time. Try Syria. I don't like our young men and women dying either. I don't like the way this war is being handled. It may just be Vietnam all over. Our soldiers have to be fired upon before returning fire. That usually means 1 or more end up dead. Fuck that, you want this war to end? You want our men and women to quit dying over there. Then stop reading all the made up fairy tale shit and seek the truth. Go to patdollard.com and watch real interviews, with real American soldiers that are there, in the middle of this shit storm. Fuck these pussy ass reporters. Just about a week ago some pansy ass reporter sent out an untrue report that Iran fired at 1 of our ships. All of us that have to drive to work had to pay for that assholes mistake. Oil jumped 8% because of a false report. I doubt you care, but I'll give you my idea on how to bring this war to an end. GO TO FUCKING WAR!!! I mean real war. Not this pussy ass laid back shit. Shoot 1st, ask questions later. These people do not understand reasoning. They understand violence. Most of them have never had to think for themselves. War is hell. It's time to clean house. Bush's biggest mistake is trying to please too many people. Which he needs to be smart enough to understand he can't do. Fuck pleasing everybody. It's time to show what we are capable of. America is already the Asshole of the world. We are not going to change that. Think about when you were in H.S. There was probably some baddass mean SOB that nobody stood up to, they were nice to him, but they hated that Bastard. They hated him, because he could destroy them at any time. Accept it, that is what America is. We are the most powerful nation on the planet. We are hated for that more than anything. It's so bad here, yet everybody wants to be here. If you think that our government attcked the Towers, you need to think about taking a THC break. Come back to reallity. This is a fucked up world we live in, I don't see any major changes coming anytime soon. Our government did NOT attack it's own people! Do you know 100% the source of your information? Ever notice how these reports come from a reliable source? Who is this source? How do we know he/she is reliable? We don't, so stop giving these assholes credit. There is no proof! It's not proof,just because some asshole claims it to be. Since it is unreasonable that you would be able to go to Iraq, and see for yourself what is going on. Again, I urge you to go to PATDOLLARD.COM and listen to the men and women that are there. Listen to how they have been interviewed by some jackass reporter, and then they read the story written by that jackass reporter and none of it is true. Come on, you have to know that most of these reporters are just looking for fame. They will do whatever, say whatever to get the spotlight. You obviously swear by the internet for your information. I'm sure you saw the video of that dumb reporter bitch in the canoe. REPORTING on the terrible flooding. Then those guys come walking by and the water isn't even knee deep. The story was juicier if you needed a boat to get around. How about just reporting 1st hand TRUTH? Seriously, all you people that believe all these conspiricy THEORIES, need to wake up. Even if you do not support the President, You have to support our men and women that are over there. I know this is old, but FREEDOM ISN"T FREE!!! You want to live in a free society, but you don't want to pay the toll. I get it, it's easier, and much more interesting to sit on your ass and be spoon fed bullshit, rather than seek the truth on your own. The only way to do that, is do it on you own and in person. Not sitting in front of a TV or CPU. Just think about how much time you are wasting studying this conspiricy shit. You should LOVE your country, and spend more time thinking for yourself, not what some dickhead trying to be famous says. Funny thing is. If president Bush got on TV right now and said " America, from this day forward, Marijuana is 100% legal to grow, and smoke. " He would probably be your hero. I have found that most people that fall for these conspiricies think they are going against the norm.They are rebels. They are actually rebels without a clue that are apt to believe anything. Did you know that driving across bridges causes your brain to be pulled down towards the top of your spinal cord leading to tumors? Yeah, I just made that up, but if I posted it on the internet and added an MD or PHD to my name, Thousands of people would never cross a bridge again in a car. See what I'm getting at. The shit is made up. Quit believing it, because all you do is hurt our soldier's moral, and probably make some asshole rich.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. #5 What'sThatSmell, Apr 12, 2007
    What a bitch.

    Seriously, if you believe the government blew up the World Trade Center towers, whatever.
    But if you call people who believe terrorists smashed into the towers ignorant, well that's just making yourself out to be an ass.
     
  6. #6 Livingalife, Apr 12, 2007
    20fan I get what your saying but Iraq War is a conspiracy for economic oil profits. Come on 2nd largest oil reserve 20 Trillion dollars!
     
  7. #7 skaman, Apr 12, 2007
    America now goes into stupid wars such as Iraq, and Vietnam because we made such stupid mistakes in the past. We tried to practice isolationism and let the world fucking fight itself but we learned in WWI and WWII that staying isolationist is fucking dumb. If America would have took sides in the early stages of WWI millions of lives could have been spared, but we fucking waited until somebody got on our bad side to do anything. Same with WWII, so many dead people for nothing.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. #8 emagdnim13, Apr 12, 2007
    I don't believe one way or the other on this 9/11 stuff.

    Bush is a flat out crook, so I expect ANYTHING from him.


    As for comparing 9/11 hoax believers with Holocaust deniers.....it's just fucking stupid. But Donald Rumsfeld already covered this one a while ago, saying those who oppose the war are no better than the Nazi sympathizers of WWII.
     
  9. #9 Livingalife, Apr 12, 2007
    +Rep, thats how its been and how these foreign policies have happened. Also I can only laugh at the reason for war. Free the Iraqi people and get rid of Saddam. Well the people loved Saddam and he did some bad stuff, but not as bad as other dictators in other countries. We get rid of Saddam and guess what were still there to keep the country stable. Yeah ok, republicans and Bush are assholes for keeping us there.http://www.aljazeera.com/me.asp?service_ID=11372 Death toll BULLSHIT!
     
  10. #10 emagdnim13, Apr 12, 2007
    When will people learn to accept the views of others.

    You don't have to believe them, or really like them, but you HAVE to accept their right to their own views.
     
  11. #11 zale, Apr 12, 2007
    all i needed to stop reading:
    until this caught my eye


    just from reading the above quotes i can tell you that whatever news censorship already does occur, it is clearly not enough for these two horrid things to be found in one article.
     
  12. #12 Liquidtruth, Apr 13, 2007

    To believe the towers fell because terrorists crashed planes into them is ignorant.
     
  13. #13 GotoAKellerShow, Apr 13, 2007
    I just want to know one thing; How did the towers fall down so perfectly straight all the way to the ground? I mean fuck the footage of it is all the proof i need. I was like 13 when it happend and i remember thinking it seemed alittle strange thr way they fell. It wasnt untl years later when I started to piece things together. Also before the "new world order"(hah) I was hanging around my friends older brother that was a memebr of a white sepremist group and he was real drunk and kept assuring us something big was about to happen that will change our country forever. About 6 months later loand behold. It wasnt until years later i remembered him saying that...dunno he could just been fucked up

    Until someone crediable can explain the straight picture perfect falls of the towers to me i wont be a "conspiracy nut"

    also I can guarentee i love America more then the guy who wrote this article. but i wouldnt expect him to understand
     
  14. #14 Rasta_Man, Apr 13, 2007
    http://www.debunking911.com/firsttime.htm
     
  15. #15 Project_Pot, Apr 13, 2007
    wow they think rosie is so unamerican,

    THEY ARE CRITICIZING HER CONSTITUTIONIAL RIGHT OF FREEDOM OF SPEECH,

    but you have to remember there is freedom of press.
     
  16. #16 Project_Pot, Apr 13, 2007
    + rep rasta man debunking911 has some good info
     
  17. #17 Liquidtruth, Apr 13, 2007
  18. #18 Livingalife, Apr 13, 2007
    Heat was not hot enough to melt the steel and where did that site get those blueprints. From what I know you can't get blueprints of the WTC towers anymore. Also they had all the rummage shipped to China when the NYC firemen wanted it investigated for bombs or whatever (they heard them as the towers fell) and never let them. Also why does the mass media blame someone we never heard of? Was it really Osama? Also why would some sunni muslim just admit to the world superpower "I planned the attacks", knowing there gonna come with bombs?
    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=3ee_1172878327
    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=8e1_1173720912
    Heres some evidence of it being blown up in the lower levels.
    Livingalife- What does a country do to get a war going for profit? It attacks itself to unite the people to get it done. Look at Hitler uniting his people for WWII.
    Can't explain how mad I was and how I wanted to blow some people up after that:cool:
    Tell you the truth. We don't even need to read a conspiracy theory were still in Iraq after the missions been done. I think that explains something.
     
  19. #19 Crackajacks, Apr 13, 2007
    Lets see some sources

    As for Jones being a qualified source, here is what an actual qualified source thinks of it. Its also one of his colleagues.

    Dear Editor,

    After reading in the Daily Herald the presentations made by Professor Steven E. Jones (BYU Physics) to students at UVSC and BYU, I feel obligated to reply to his "Conspiracy Theory" relating to the terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center (9/11/01).

    I have studied the summary of the report by FEMA, The American Society of Civil Engineers and several other professional engineering organizations. These experts have given in detail the effects on the Towers by the impact of the commercial aircraft. I have also read Professor Jones' (referred to) 42 page unpublished report. In my understanding of structural design and the properties of structural steel I find Professor Jones' thesis that planted explosives (rather than fire from the planes) caused the collapse of the Towers, very unreliable.

    The structural design of the towers was unique in that the supporting steel structure consisted of closely spaced columns in the walls of all four sides. The resulting structure was similar to a tube. When the aircraft impacted the towers at speeds of about 500 plus mph, many steel columns were immediately severed and others rendered weak by the following fires. The fires critically damaged the floors systems. Structural steel will begin to lose strength when heated to temperatures above 1000 degrees Fahrenheit. Steel bridge girders are bent to conform to the curved roadway by spot heating flanges between 800 and 1000 degrees Fahrenheit. It is easy to comprehend the loss of carrying capacity of all the structural steel due to the raging fires fed by the jet's fuel as well as aircraft and building contents.

    Before one (especially students) supports such a conspiracy theory, they should investigate all details of the theory. To me a practicing structural engineer of 57 continuous years (1941-1998), Professor Jones' presentations are very disturbing.

    D. Allan Firmage

    Professor Emeritus, Civil Engineering, BYU
    http://www.debunking911.com/jones.htm
     
  20. #20 Adicted2aa, Apr 13, 2007
    Actually they're criticizing her speech. They aren't saying she doesn't have a right to say it, just that saying it is stupid. The difference between the two leads to a lot of confusion with people accusing anyone who calls an idea dumb a facist. I exagerate of course.
     
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