If God is omnipotent, then He had the power to create the universe. If God is omniscient, then He has the wisdom to know everything that is going to happen. But Omniscience and Omnipotence are incompatible you see? If God is really omniscient, then He knows everything that is going to happen in the universe, and He can't change it since He knows everything that will happen. But how can God be omnipotent if He can't change what will already happen in the universe? If God is omniscient, He must know the future. But that means if He knows the future (which means it must be set in stone) He must not be free to change it-therefore He's not omnipotent, because He lacks power over the future.
What if god is aware of an infinite number of possible futures and is capable of choosing which future occurs?
To retain the quality of omniscient he would have to the future he himself chooses before he makes that choice this would also point out that he has no free will , which if free will is even theoretically possible , would be falling short of being omnipotent.
since you brought it up.... [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ih6f-0T2Ow0]Sam Harris Speech on Free Will Given in Vancouver to the Bon Mot Book Club - YouTube[/ame]
If he knew what he's going to change beforehand , could he had truly made another change to divert off his own plan? If he made the change he would surprise himself due to it being unexpected , but since he has to be all knowing he has to know the change in so ,which the change would be expected . The act of being surprise is from incongruence of what happened and what's through is supposed to happen. So he could never really make a change in his plan if he knew exactly how it's going to pan out.
But then He is not omnipotent, because Him knowing what He is going to do makes it so that is going to happen, and if He changes that, then He is changing something that wasn't going to happen, thus something He didn't know He was going to change, making Him not omniscient. Don't you see? Omniscience and Omnipotency can never be compatible.
Yea i dont think he would be able to change anything anyways just be able to see all possible timelines and possibly control which ones we observe
Its not a cop out. You have absolutely no idea what God is, therefore you cannot make your claims as though they are a fact.
Just out of curiosity from a philosophical perspective. If we have no idea what God is how can we even think we can recognize, have a concept of or even having an idea of the possibility of existing in the first place. I know you didn't say complete understanding and you may think it's a partial understanding , but since you said absolute , that would imply those partial understandings are tentative , and so would that mean there's no solid ground in believing in a deity?
I dont understand what you're saying. I'm saying we dont know everything about God, we dont know what God is exactly.
If you don't know what God is , then how can you effectively direct your belief with confidence that It holds the properties of having a personality , or what kind of personality. This God could not even have a consciousness. Given the many definitions of God. I take it that since you're christian(I think) you believe he is an all knowing ,all powerful and all loving. Besides using scripture and confirming it isn't a pattern seeking bias. What makes you believe it holds those properties. Let's grant that It's a prime mover. I'm just having trouble understanding how one can attach those human properties onto the prime mover. The more attachments you have on him , the more great he is and the more great reasons you should have to believe this is so.
Since we aren't able to, maybe we shouldn't assign genders to it, you know, since that would be making us Its equal..
That's kinda why I call god "it" , but at the same time it sound condescending like a lack of identity, but really I don't know any other way to refer to a sentient god.
"Believing" that God is good is different from making claims that its impossible for God to do something as though its a fact. The thread starter is stating his claims as though its a fact, as though he knows exactly what God is.
I'm not talking about the thread , I want to know how you yourself made these logical connection on the qualities of God using the conditions I've stated. I don't think anyone here is making the claim that God is impossible so I'm not sure where you're trying to go with that. Every atheist here I think fore the most part are agnostic about it. Being gnostic would be very arrogant , unless he had infallible absolute proof. I'm aware you're now saying you "know" , I just want to see the logical connection or your cognitive pattern of why and how you reached your belief of your conceptualization of God.