The Devils Advocate

Discussion in 'Religion, Beliefs and Spirituality' started by esseff, Dec 23, 2013.

  1. We know that an advocate is someone who speaks on behalf of someone else. In this case, it would be the devil. But the devil, or your idea of it, has another side, god, or your idea of that. Each aspect cannot exist without the other. The dark needs the light. Yin needs Yang. Two sides of one reality.
    \nSo you could say an advocate for the devil would actually be able to speak for both sides, although, calling oneself god's advocate seems way too pretentious. Why would god need an advocate anyway? Come to think of it, why would the devil for that matter?
    \nWhatever these two might be, they aren't of the world, this world, our world, physically, as we are. They might influence it, more or less, depending on who's open to seeing what. Who's willing, consciously or unconsciously, to become an instrument for either, temporarily or otherwise, so that their reality can be here, more or less.
    \nIt's not a question of good or evil either, as each can appear to be both. So it must be more about what feels right, what makes most sense.
    \nMany associate god with good and right. Love and light. Or that's the way religion would have us see it. But what if religion is, or has become, the domain of the opposite? Would that change the way you saw religion's idea of god?
    \nThen there are those who cannot stand the idea of a religious god in any form, for all sorts of reasons. They might even choose a darker, more down to earth alternative, if they were to seek one that is.
    \nAll that's bad and evil, selfish and wrong, well, the devil must be responsible for it. And yet, if god and the devil are two sides of the same whole, then everything appearing to be one, must be in harmony with anything appearing as the other. The universe is balance. It is self-balancing you might say. Only what can happen will; there can be no other possibility.
    \nThe devil/god would therefore be different expressions of a single principle. Different ways of expressing the same thing from different perspectives. It is a unified perspective that matters, but it is up to us in what form that takes.
    \nSo what is it I'm advocating? The good, the bad, is there a difference? Is it both? It must be both. But it is also neither, as none of this is real outside our imagination.
    \nWhat? What did you say? That can't be right? You're saying there is nothing there? Nothing that reveals right or wrong? Nothing to guide, teach, save? Nothing to pray to or be afraid of? Nothing to take responsibility for what happens? Nothing that makes things happen a certain way? Nothing that needs defending, worshipping or praising? Nothing that expects anything? That we are completely and totally alone?
    \nYes.
    \nAnd no.
    \nAnything we can imagine about any of this must, by definition, be wrong. Why? Because we imagined it. So anything we have thought so far, whatever it is, WE CAN SAFELY LET GO! When I say anything, I mean it. Nothing of those old beliefs, the old thinking, should remain, not if something new is to come in.
    \nThere is nothing to fear about doing this, because only what is real can be here. We cannot lose anything real because nothing that is will ever become something that isn't. So what we know to be true, if it is true, can't ever be lost by letting go of it, it can only become MORE of what it was. But to realise this, the old way of seeing must go.
    \nIt's quite a matter of faith to accept old beliefs must go, and then actually let them go, completely. But we must do it because they're getting in the way. We are not separate. Our connection is real. This means that what a single individual thinks and believes must, in some form, affect the whole on some level. We don't move forward unless we really get this, but that doesn't mean we aren't making great changes anyway. In fact, we're quite close really. It requires such a small shift to make a huge difference when you're that close to realisation. We've been doing it our own way for so long, that all the new that has come, all the changes we've gone through, are not the sign of some major transition, but the end of it. That to actually make the transition from what is, into what will be, where things actually feel different, will be the smallest of steps.
    \nSo I am here to tell you. To tell you that who is telling you doesn't matter. It is this and that and the other, if need be - it's all the same to me. You know what you do and what you want. You know why you are how you are. You know what matters and what doesn't. You always make the choice.
    \nWell, I'm telling you it's time to make the choice. Make it, but make it well. Anything you have done, that you know to be wrong, no matter what it was, is wiped away once you make the right choice. It is our choice that matters. And if we choose to make life better, realer, more like how we want it to be, it will become so. But if we continue making the old choices, because we think there's nothing wrong with them, we will really know it.
    \nWhatever happens, we must come to know the truth. There are different ways of getting to it, recognising it, but it is all the same in the end. We are ready for something new. We are ready to embrace a way of living that doesn't contain what doesn't work anymore. What doesn't work cannot stay. It doesn't work. How can it?

     
  2. The above was heavily edited. Not sure why. There was a large gap between creating it and posting it. while it sat in my laptop, open, but not let go, i read it, re-read it, edited it, and decided that if it didn't feel right to post it, if at all, i liked it, even if it did have an air of religiosity about it - i knew what i was getting at. so i 'made it better' until i felt able to release it.
     
    so what happened to the idea of not editing? why did this escape that idea, and why didn't it matter?
     
    when i wrote it i was a little high, and while i wrote it, it had that feeling i sometimes get when i know i'm saying something that feels real to me. yet, not only am i interpreting what that is anyway, but if afterwards, when i read it over, and especially as i am now in a different state, what was said, the alleged 'errors', now feels different, and in attempting to change/alter/adjust what it was, regardless of what it was, i lose the spirit it contained.
     
    It seems realer, yet is less real. it is polished and clear, yet covers over or rubs away something only the original can have. i don't have the original to compare it with now, and while i can see what it has within it, because i've been with it from its conception, it makes sense that others will not. After all, why am i sharing these things if not to benefit from doing so?
     
    It can be hard to reveal, especially as to simply teach implies a feeling of i know, when really i want to explore what i or anyone else knows. sometimes i feel i must question what i say, while others, i just want to say it.
     
    There is something going on that I'm looking to get to, put my finger on. does it matter that what i say has any relevance? can i reveal it when i think it does just because i think it does, or just to share it because i can? am i looking for a certain kind of response perhaps, maybe even a reaction, that will trigger something? Maybe. But i don't expect it, and it rarely, if ever, happens anyway. In fact it usually only happens out of the blue, in private, when someone contacts me unexpected.
     
    I do wonder whether my need to edit makes it seem like i need a response. if i put that much effort into writing something then perhaps i must? yet i would only have the right kind of response or not at all, and while the 'right' response, whatever that is, is very dependant on who reads it and how they feel, so few do, that this isn't why i share it.
     
    A few years ago i used to be far worse. Very reluctant to reveal anything written during my highest states as i felt so vulnerable revealing it. that it was opening me to criticism and comment, some of which wasn't easy to deal with. Why should I care what someone i don't know thinks? or if not care, be affected by it anyway? yet i continued putting 'me' out there, and over time, the responses, and the way they make me feel, has changed.
     
    yet, as soon as i feel something new to say, there is a feeling, almost a need, to reveal it somewhere. seems very egotistical. but it doesn't come from feeling what i have to say is any truer than someone else - just better from my own ability to reveal it. and if we're all here to learn something, something about ourselves, then we have a duty to be ourselves and reveal something unique and real, so that others might get it, reflect it, and trigger further insight.
     
    You can only get something, have something to say about something, when you feel it, so when things I say receive no reply, nothing is missing. I know full well that speaking for the sake of it, just because i can, doesn't always produce the best sounds. why should anyone else do so unless moved to?
     
    We are a strange mix of age, experience, life, who without this medium would not spend time in each other's company. In life, those we don't like don't get any at all, and yet here, even they are accommodated. As a result, sometimes, an odd reaction occurs, and it is that which makes this so very interesting.
     
  3. We're making choices every moment, even when we're choosing not to. Many make their choices automatically, based on long held beliefs, habits, etc. As we become more aware, we notice these choices, that we have choices, because freedom is about having and making choices. Once you realise this, the choices you make can either seem irrelevant, as nothing really matters, and you are free to follow and play in whatever way you feel. Or, they matter tremendously. Not because of any religious or spiritual ideology, but because life is a journey, and a journey usually has some kind of destination. Without deciding what that is, there is something about making conscious choices, and what happens as a result, that changes the journey you think you're on. It is only once the idea of what journey you're on changes that the experiences you have do, and what they then mean, without having to form a story or belief around it.
     
    This is not a mental idea. But can't we all say how making a choice will change things tremendously,sometimes revealing something very different to what we imagined doing so would bring. That's why our choices matter. Freedom is not about simply being able to do what you want when you want. It is to some extent, but it is the inspiration behind acquiring that freedom, so that something can come from it that is more than what it seemed to be.
     
  4. #4 dirtydingusus, Dec 24, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 24, 2013
    i have mentioned this many times.......
    dark light....
    good bad.....
    white black.....
     
    north south....
     
    just more ways for them to keep us separate.....
    the more separate we are the easier we become to control.....
     
    for their to be a "god" it would have to be all...... or at least everything would have to be a part of it.....
    and if nothing could exist without it.....
     
    then how can this evil...this darkness..... not also be a part of this whole.....
     
    we as humans wouldnt even know the difference if had only one and not both....
    without the dark to contrast....how could one ever know it was light?
     
    even if this "bad guy" is out there....... it would have to be as much a part of their god as they are......
    otherwise the whole thing falls apart....
     
     
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  5. Sometimes we can open to more than one thing. Sometimes we can even decide what that is. Sometimes I have no idea what is right or wrong, outside whatever I feel it to be in that moment.
     
    Bad guy, good guy, that guy, this. What is there that I react to. What is there that I act upon. Who I feel myself to be. What must be done. What needs to be. What changes things. What lets me see. I am free to come and go. So are you. Prove it so.
     
  6. The choices you make is how society veiws them as good bad or even regards them 'normal' and 'insane'

    Let me explain. Society as a whole is the oppisite of what it really is, Makes sense? I think not.

    You have logical yet outside the box rational thinking about how everything works, came to be, might even throw in their own defined version of something your labeled delusional. Yet it is this thinking that puts us forward in life.

    You follow a system that leads to the self destruction of its own civlisation, And not just follow the system, but are obliged to not speak out against the very system that tries to do good for the community, yet doesnt because the legal system is designed so that it just keeps raising revenue, and because its corrupted, the very fact why the governemnts of the world havnt won any war on drugs, is because they are in direct contact with it. these drugs iv mentioned before coke herion meth pills, even weed causes a habitual session to start, inevitably feeding the beast. Why you think the governments lifting the prohabition on it, yea the medicinal side of plants might have been found but now the government knows they can control us with it. Phsycadelics tend to twist this around and make you realise that. The bad people in jail arnt bad. Just kids who never grew up. The real bad people are rapists, people who watch rape happen and say nothing, and pedos and even corrupted governments. The people in jail yea might have killed someone might kept doing whatever it was that landed them there, but it was this strange force that acted. this force is greed. Everyone is in there due to something with money, whether it is, stealing hacking robbing killing scamming, fraud, counterfieting kidnapping extoriting... All have something to do with taking smethin for your own personal gain, paying off politicals to use them in your monoply

    Everyone is an individual with individual set of morals that doesnt confine within the regarded norm. Now how the good and bad come into it,
    Good is been a person, caring for others, animals nature, etc, not just have your head stuck up your own ass in your own fantasy materialistic world, where you think your king shit with your mates, getting on it every weekend, paying out people who arnt like you, who prefer to come into closer contact with your own phsyce, then in your own little world having pointless conversations whilst off your head or have actual intellectual conversations that could one day do good and change us.

    End of the day theres forces here that shouldnt be rekond with. Good and bad are just words, the law is what stops someone stealing from a shop, but what stops the shop stealin from us, ripping us off with clothes made from sweatshops for 50cents put a brand name on it and it suddenly becomes 100$ fuck the coprate world. Nothing but an addiction to wealth. Greed.
     

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