The Afterlife

Discussion in 'Religion, Beliefs and Spirituality' started by viper11smith, May 19, 2013.

  1. I remember when I was young I used to think, "I cant wait to die so I can find out what the afterlife is like". Then I realized the worms just eat you and I started enjoying life.
    We're all doomed.

  2. What is you?
    Well the "you" is obviously defined differently amongst people, but since there is no evidence that anything survives brain death I think you know what he means.
  4. What evidence? We don't even fully understand consciousness yet.
    You isn't your physical components, but the intelligence that drives the interaction between your physical components.
    The body is comprised of atoms, these atoms interact with each other to create complex systems that are separate from the whole. These systems, or cells, then create increasingly complex relations amongst each other that create an even more complex system, or body.
    This Body is an amalgamation of several particles working in conjunction to create a separate universe from the One in which everything resides. This is done to create a separation, so that the two universes may interact, observe and understand each other.
    Define Biology. What is it at its most root component? Do the same with other branches of Science.
    Define Physics.
    Define Life.
    Evolution isn't a biological process, it is a universal process. The universe is always evolving, shifting and changing. 
    First separating from itself, then understanding itself, then adapting to the separation, then understanding further, only to come together and create greater complexity, so as to understand itself more.
    You exists infinitely, there is only one You.
    You exist always.
    The conscious energy that drives all of existence is never destroyed, it only changes form and continues its existence in different forms.
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  5. You have no proof that "you" exists always.  Your consciousness requires a working brain as far as we know.  When the brain dies, everything not at the atomic level ceases to work.  If your consciousness existed prior to your brain existing, why don't we all have recollection of it?  Energy may be eternal, but there is no proof any of it has consciousness. 
  6. #7 pickledpie, May 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2013
    Your consciousness requires a working brain?
    Humans aren't the only conscious beings, we are simply the most conscious beings on this planet, at least that we know of.
    A fruit fly is conscious, does it have a brain? It does, but its perception is very limited, as is its ability to interpret that which it perceives.
    Does a bacteria have a brain? Well, it is in and of itself a brain, that is able to interact with its environment according to sensory stimulus.
    When the brain dies, everything except for that which is at the atomic level ceases to work. What does this mean? Work in what way?
    How does the brain "work" in the first place?
    You're saying that the communication between the various cells in the brain and body is unable to continue, this simply means that consciousness is unable to use cells as a conduit to create just one working process.
    Consciousness is the force which allows communication to occur between any force. In a multicellular organism, each individual cell has consciousness, but in combination, we would consider that organism to have one consciousness. 
    The very nature of consciousness is that. It exists on all levels, but they grow increasingly difficult to comprehend when they are outside our own level of consciousness.
    Now, you asked a very important question.
    If your consciousness existed prior to your brain existing, why don't we all have recollection of it?
    I've talked about this in another post before.
    The brain defines what we are. Consciousness is one thing that is the same in all things. That which separates us and makes us different is our physical components.
    Think about the properties of the brain, it is basically a recording device that perceives all types of stimulus which is then interpreted through programmed parameters and also our reasoning and intellect.
    Memory is a very important thing, and it allows us to create an understanding of our world, without it, we would literally be unable to interact with the world or really even do anything. All we would have I guess, would be an awareness.
    We cannot have memory outside of what our own brain has recorded, because that is the very source of our memory.
    I've written a more detailed post about this elsewhere but I don't know where, if someone could tell me, I would appreciate it :)
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  7. here it is
    The Mind is not just memory though, it is a conduit of consciousness that is used to record existence, memories are just an aspect of the mind that can be drawn upon to facilitate an understanding of anything. 

    The mind is considered the 6th sense in certain systems of belief, that is because the mind itself forms habitual reactions to certain stimulus, the mind is like a computer that executes a certain program when faced with a certain situation. The intelligence is the one that does the coding in the first place. The mind is the aspect that holds fear and instincts, which are unconsciously driving our every behaviour.

    The enlightened man is able to understand the function of the mind and is able to transcend the baser instincts of his physical nature. 

    The mind is the interface by which consciousness can make sense of the world, through its use by consciousness, intelligence is derived and intelligence directs all the behaviours associated with life.

    The mind is of the most gross substance, thus it is not much different from the 5 senses. The mind is what produces the ego and it is important to understand the role of the mind and the ego, and how it is separate from the truth of existence. Or rather, it is very necessary to understand that we are fooled into thinking that the mind is the self, but it is not, that is the greatest illusion.
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  8. #9 A Rational Psychopath, May 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2013
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    You got everything right, but I would like to address the fact that I never said your personality is you.
    Your personality is a set of parameters that give definitive responses towards certain stimuli.
    Your personality is your base line brain functioning, your own reaction to every action is ingrained into your mind. Consciousness and time, which are basically interchangeable ideas if you really want to get into it, are what allows these ingrained parameters to change and shift with the environment.
    The same way DNA is a blueprint for your biological structure, consciousness is the blueprint for the DNA.
    Consciousness is the Observer. Simple as that.
    The self is the Observer, and the Observer exists beyond the restraints of time.
    The singularity observes itself, and thus finds the need to separate itself from itself, eventually again finding the need to come back to singularity.
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  10. Nobody is really sure what happens when we die, and the only conclusive proof we have is personal accounts from people who have died but were later revived.

    My theory is you have your physical-self and your spiritual-self. This is why it is important to be happy and enjoy your life while you can hence the term 'feed your spirit'. When you do eventually die, your spirit can pass onto the other side with ease, whatever that may be.

    If you live your life as a miserable bastard you're going to want to stay behind. If you commit suicide, the same thing. If you spend life in prison, same thing. Ultimately you never get to live life to the fullest and you spend eternity on earth looking for it. You might be pissed about it or you can come to terms with it.

    Do I believe in heaven and hell? The jury is still out on that one.
    Mine does, yes.  I'm pretty sure yours does as well. :rolleyes:
    "Consciousness is the force......"   WTF!?!
  12. #13 RippedMonk, May 21, 2013
    Last edited: May 21, 2013
    That is not conclusive proof.  The brain works beyond the point when the heart stops beating.  Eventually there is not enough oxygen though and the brain dies.  However, many people are revived before the brain dies or suffers injury.  Others are revived but with brain damage.  If the brain is still alive and working any experience is still possible...discussions with dead family, meetings with angels or gods, horrifying experiences, etc..  It isn't conclusive proof about anything other than the brain's visions while it slowly suffocates.  When someone comes back after their brain has died and tells a story we'll have some possibly viable proof of an afterlife.
  13. Coma?
  14. I don't know if I would want an afterlife.
    If I died and it turned out there was a God and I had a choice of living forever or being zapped out of existence, I would need some time to make a decision lol
    The brain isn't working 100% in coma patients that's for sure, but it's not dead. 
    A coma really has nothing to do with what we are talking about.  The point was human consciousness comes from the brain.
    It amuses me to have been lectured about ego from a person who has decided they know better than all of collective science.
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    I keep reading lately how hospitals install up-facing panels against their ceilings containing numbers so that people whose souls are floating around the room while they're close to death can see them.  No one that I know of has been able to report them after coming back.  It's probably foolish that we even humor the idea, but hey we're giving the idea a way to validate itself.
  18. #19 esseff, May 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2013
    It's not just a question of oxygen starvation.
    I've come across neuroscientists who say that during certain types of coma, there can be no brain activity on any recognisable level. In other words, nothing is going on in there. For the brain to be creating the complex experiences of the NDE there would have to be proper measurable brain activity. They are therefore beginning to feel that the experience has to be happening outside the brain (proper neuroscientists don't forget) because there is nothing going on to produce it.
    EDIT: Obviously not all coma victims experience NDE's, and not all coma victims who have that level of brain inactivity come back to tell us anyway. But you might want to check out Dr. Eben Alexander's account. He's a Neurosurgeon who experienced exactly that himself. He goes into the scientific aspects of his brain in detail in his book so I don't know what you'll find online about his lack of brain function during the coma. Nothing on the EEG.
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  19. Indeed, believe Dr. Eben Alexander had a meningitis infection that had essentially destroyed his brain and put him into a coma. The doctors basically said it was impossible for him to survive, yet he regains a conscious state of mind after sometime, and his brain is somehow able to heal itself, and during his experience in the coma, he describes the most intense and incredible experience, that he describes as being more real than real life.
    I believe his description of what he saw could truly allow us to garner a greater understanding of that which remains unknown to us, for it exists in a realm outside of our physical senses perception. Most importantly. if one observes the recounting of near death experiences from various different individuals, they will see that a common theme emerges with similar experiences described by these people.
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