thought id try this thread in the organic section as well... most literature on the subject will tell you that using synthetic fertilizers along with organics is pointless, a bad idea, and a recipe for disaster. recently, out of curiosity, i played around with using both (organics and synthetics), together, as part of a feeding program, with positive results. so, whats the deal? any input would be greatly appreciated
Totally defeats the purpose of building a livingsoil and growing organically withoutchemicals why would you do it? I get much better results ditching the bottled nutes.
When you repeatedly used synthetic fertilizers you stopped growing organically. The repeated application of soluble salts killed your living micro organisms and the plant grew on the synthetic amendments to harvest. No one disputes the fact synthetic fertilizer works, but by using them in organic soil you negate the benefits of growing organically. PW
Im using synthetics for my organic soil. Im not trying to go "all organic". The fact is simply that the organic soil im using is far better quality than the other crap i was using, the ph is perfect and all i had to do was throw in some perlite. So far im pretty happy with my plants. Next time i may go fully organic, but ive got nutes i need to use up so...
thats what i keep hearing. but last run i ran the two together and had the best harvest to date. and the current run is heading in the same direction. the results im experiencing using them both has me confused on the subject.
Yeh i understand the symantics of it being counterproductive and such. But my girls are so healthy right now its retarded, so im happy.
anyone know why the house and garden line of nutes (synthetics) recommend great white (organic)? they stress the benefits of bacteria/fungi within the medium, which great white supplies.
They are out to take your money so they want you to use your products. If youre gonna use synthetics stick with it otherwise dontbother building an organic soil its pointless at that juncture.
Oh sorry we got a masters in google search science here. If i need you to deconstruct my sentences into more detailed information i'll ask, until then, make a point or post an opinion.
It is not semantics it is soil biology/science. I think I did make a point. You brushed off PW's answer (post #3) as semantics. It in fact is not semantics. If I was trying to be an ass I would have pointed out the fact that semantics is not spelled symantics.
Oh please impart your spelling wisdom to the internet. You WERE being an ass, and you DID NOT make a point, you were a smartass. Why bother posting in this thread at all if you didn't have anything helpful to say? Obviously it's to do with botony and soil science, its a fucking marijuana forum and we are discussing growing, are you are botonist? Don't answer that.
Anyhow - lol This is my view. A couple of points that we all know already - 1. An organic soil is a living (collectively) organism. 2. Bottled chemical nutrients can and do harm fungi & some bacteria. I believe that it takes a little while to kill off ALL of the soil microbes in your organic soil with the chemicals you are using (ie: Potassium Sulphate, Magnesium Sulphate, etc). This doesn't all happen at once - it's not like pouring Draino on your soil, however, the salts do slowly shrivel up the fungi and minimize the bacteria colonies. Right now you are using these fertilizers and this is (obviously) why your plants are doing so well. I have no doubt that if you continue to use them that you will do just as well, but in the meantime you are turning your once living soil into an inert (dead) medium. As long as you continue to use your bottled nutrients I have no doubt that you will continue to see the usual fine hydroponic results. It's when you Stop using them that you will see the difference as your soil will no longer be living - essentially it will no longer be able to cycle organic nutrients, which is really what organic gardening is about; your soils ability, as a living organism, to break down the organic matter that our plants get their nutrition from into usable plant food. My soil is so alive, the other day, out of the corner of my eye I saw my tub of cycling soil moving. Upon closer inspection I could see it shifting, as if to a beat, and when I put my ear closer to it, from deep within the tub I could almost hear a low musical singing... Hehehe. The bottom line is that you WILL see good results by using the bottles, just like (most) we all have, but you are slowly killing your soil and making it impossible to get off of those bottles once you start adding them to your soil. It's a viscous merry to round, those bottles - kinda like crack...lol once you're on them it's hard to get off... J
Thank you for your insight. I figured as much. I've only started reading up on organic growing this time around and it sounds interesting. If i didnt want to waste my money by not using my nutes i'd definately go organic, but theres always next time.
Borgarden, It does take some time to put an organic garden together; Id suggest continueing to hang out here in the organics forum, reading and asking questions. Its not hard at all to do, and to be able to garden naturally, without spending a nickel at the hydro store, not always worrying about pH or PPMs is a very good thing, and our results speak for themselves. Think about organic buds like fresh organic veggie produce vs. tasteless supermarket produce - once you have organic buds you'll never want hydro buds again... j
Yeah i get that vibe from all the organic growers, i know once i start i would be hooked. Ill be in a bigger place soon so that would probably help too.
Borgaren, I really was not busting your balls, my approach is a little dry at times. Jerry told you the exact same thing as PW did in the post before your original post. I felt as though you were just brushing it off and trying to justify using the chemical nutrients. Don't get me wrong it is your garden and you are the one smoking it. Another reason not to use chemical nutrients is because of the beautiful country you live in. When you kill the soil food web with salts things that should stay in the soil no longer stay, they get washed into your brooks,streams, and rivers. Which then in turn changes the ecosystem in your waterways that can be detrimental to the inhabitants. It ends being a viscous cycle with the whole planet being the loser in the end. I know you still think that I am an asshole and your saying to yourself, "what does this have to do with me, I am growing in pots." The truth is that it has to start somewhere. Let me make one thing clear before you cuss at me again, I am not trying to push my views on you I am just trying to make you aware of the consequences if all gardeners and farmers alike chose to use chemicals to feed and keep their crops free of pests. Have a great day! MGB
Dude... I just wanted more detailed information on the subject from someone who is knowledgable on the subject and now i have it. Don't worry man i was just firing you up lol. Hugs. Thank you for the useful info. Might start a compost system going when i move in two weeks.
When you get everything all set up make sure you bring all your friends over and show them what you can do with organic gardening. Who knows maybe it will rub off on them and they can do the same in return. This is what I mean by "It has to start somewhere." You can't fire me up. I am to older than dirt, I will always walk a way before I make a fool of myself. If I can ever help you in your transition feel free to shoot me a PM. If I can't confidently answer your question I can at least point you to whom can. Take care. MGB P.S. I hope your heavy rains have stopped down there. I visited your beautiful country in the early 80's on a Naval vessel. Absolutely Beautiful!
I moved to the city so i dont know many people here and none that grow except for my ex neighbour (we were growing at the same time but both kept it secret). Gonna be a wet weekend. Its not even a cyclone anymore, i always miss out on cool weather ;( The mrs wants me to do a herb and vege garden when we move so it will be a good excuse to do some organic gardening.