I haven't started a new topic in some time but I've been thinking about this and think it would be a good thing for GCO. I have seen many discussing this but the posts are scattered and that really doesn't help anyone. Spider Mites. The Bane of the Cannabis gardener. I believe that most of us have run into spider mites if we've been growing herb for any amount of time. If you haven't, please consider yourself extremely lucky. A spider mite infestation will ruin your garden - PERIOD. There really doesn't seem to be such a thing as "just a few spider mites". They multiply incredibly fast; they suck the life right out of your plants - literally. They live on the underside of your plants leaves and suck the juices out of the leaves. Even a few spider mites will very quickly turn into many, but even with that "just a few", you will notice that your plants growth, vigor and overall health can rapidly deteriorate. They can be beaten. I've done it - on multiple occasions over the years. It sure isn't easy though. Let's start some good discussion about this folks. This is a topic that can and probably will affect all of us at one point or another and I think it could be a really good thing to have all of our information in one basket. Let's give the folks that do have them some hope which means sharing your methods for eradication. Thanks, J
<del></del>Please note that these are not my own pictures but have been downloaded from the Internet for the simple sake of showing what Spider Mite damage looks like. Spider mite damage starts to appear as tiny dots on the surface of your leaves. This is because the mite on the underside of your leaf has attached itself and has sucked the juice out of the leaf itself at that point. When it is done in that spot it will move on to the next, creating a stippling effect on the leaf tissue. Once the mite population has established itself, the mites will weave webs around the plant itself. These look similar to spider webs. Mites and eggs on the underside of the leaf - J
Azamax... done. Lol.. if you catch early enough. Sent from my SM-G530T using Grasscity Forum mobile app
Here's a pic I took of mine on a clover leaf. I thought the top right bug was a two spotted juvenile but all the life stages look the same as the adults with two spots so I am unsure of what white mite it is. I'm not asking for identification but just wanted to be clear about what's seen. There's eggs and an adult.
We're also going to need to touch on Broad mites. They make spider mites seem benign in comparison and can actually kill a plant. You can't see them (microscopic), and the damage mimics nute problems. I thought it was my mix. It wasn't and a 30x loupe showed nothing. Their saliva is toxic and causes extreme disfigurement of leaves. I had never even heard of them till I searched leaf disfigurement and they got mentioned. Matched my plants exactly. Wet
Being able to successfully eradicate Spider Mites takes persistence. There are many products available these days but as organic gardeners we are limited because we don't want to use harmful chemicals on our plants. That's ok though - with a few different organic items in our arsenal we can be successful. One of the most commonly used and most effective items in our IPM toolbox is COLD PRESSED ORGANIC NEEM OIL. I put this in bold because there are many neem products and knockoffs out there. Your best bet is actual, simple cold pressed and unadulterated organic neem. Neem Tree Farms and Neem Resource Ahimsa brands are examples of what I'm referring to. Neem oil will not mix readily with water to be able to spray it. It NEEDS to be emulsified, ie: broken down to a point where it can mix with water. Think about what happens when you add a single drop of dish soap to a greasy pan in your sinkful of dishes. You can simply use a few drops of dish detergent t achieve this. Most organic gardeners will want to use an organic dish soap such as is made by Dr Bronners, or similar. Many folks are also now using a silica product, whether it be a hydro store product like Rhino Blast or Dyna Gro ProTekt. I use a little pinchful of concentrate silica powder. The single trick to beating mites is to break the egg cycle. The problem that most folks run into is that they will spray their plants, kill the mites and then in a few days the damn eggs that were attached to the underside of the leaves hatch! You're back to square one. Mites all over again. You must take your time and spray well, making sure not to miss a single leaf. Not one! Just a couple of mites will repopulate your plants very quickly. Most importantly, you MUST REPEAT. The general consensus it to spray every 3 days but if I see a mite, that scares the hell out of me. I know the damage they can cause. I will spray every two days for several weeks - I don't want to take chances with them returning. I have also sprayed every single day for several weeks to ensure complete eradication. IMO, this is the best way. What about flowering plants?? This is a tough one and is a real issue. Nobody wants to spray their flowers - we don't want to ruin them, of course. I've discovered that very low amounts of organic neem oil can be very effective if sprayed daily during an infestation. I'm talking a half a teaspoon per gallon, and even less. Neem Oil is strong stuff and it doesn't take as much as many think to be effective. I have sprayed up until there is around 3 weeks left of flower with very low amounts of neem effectively. Hey, it's that or the mites take over. Take your pick. I choose eradication. There are also other very effective products that we can discuss of course. Neem is only one. Peace, J
Thank goodness I haven't run into them myself Wet. Sorry to hear that you have. I hope that you can help get into this a little more, or that others can touch on this subject. I've heard some real horror stories. Were you able to eradicate? J
Jerry, if you can post some pics of broad mite damage it would be helpful. Usually that's the only indication you have, mainly in the new growth. Disfigured leaves, weird color and growth entirely stops. The really bad thing is, they penetrate the leaves so surface only treatments are not very effective. Not very common and virtually unheard of right now, but extremely scary. I'm still not sure if my 7YO strain is going to survive or not. At least it was only 3 host plants with nothing else going on at the moment. Wet
I would prefer it if someone that HAS had experience with Broad Mites would post the pictures, only because I have personally never seen or experienced them myself. Let's see if anyone does and if not then I will see what I can come up with. Can you tell us what you're doing to battle them? Are you using methods similar or the same as one would use against "regular mites"? J
I would like to see pics of broad mite damage that are not vegetables and are actually verified BM. Too many pics of what people think might be them. The damage looks like two spot damage when I was looking or it looks like heavy nitrogen clawing. It's way too confusing to diagnose. When mine was about two months into it, plants started to get the blistered leaves with curled up edges but I have white stippling also. Like Wet mentioned, they have to have a translaminar insecticide used because they going inside the leaf tissue. You should ask 7557rb to talk about how he eradicated his russet mites using a sulfur burner.
Damned site ate 2 replys in a row, so this will be short. I used Forbid 4F. The plants were so far gone because I was convinced it was a problem with the mix and no bugs in sight. My #1 priority was/is saving this 7YO strain and the Forbid gave me the best chance of that not having "The Holy Hand Grenade" handy. Plus, I did used to do this stuff for a living. Now, the waiting game. Even Forbid takes some time, but re-applications are advised against and I've never found it necessary back in the day. Will update. Wet
An old member here had BM and SM using neem oil with CC and BJ helping him and it didn't work. He had them for a long time. Used all sorts of big name organic stuff after insisting the neem was not working. He used Guardian Mite Spray and it's gone. Another thing people have found effective elsewhere is heating the room to 120F for like a half hour to an hour. There's a huge thread that started when people didn't know about it. The conclusion is the heat treatments or Avid. Many many people have found success either for controlling them and some have eradicated them using that. It's using heated air instead of hot water bathes. I can't get my room that hot. I've tried a couple different times and it tops out at 110F. IPM from Davis mentioned sulfur is very effective on spider mites and it's listed as number one. I was very much interested in this and 7557 said it was the most effective thing with his russet mites. Sulfur I THINK can get into the leaves? Something about the sulfur cycle and sulfur pest sprays. I'm not sure but two folks here mentioned it.
My lazy spider mite prevention method consists of one treatment of spinosad (indoor use only) about 2 weeks prior to flower. I apply thoroughly every 3 days for about 2 weeks and that's it. Oil free.
This is from Colorado and updated regularly. . https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/sites/default/files/atoms/files/Pesticides%20that%20can%20be%20used%20to%20produce%20marijuana%201-21-16.pdf . Please note the product Evergreen pyrethrum. This product is not NOP listed but it is OMRI approved FWIW. Everyone should remember to use pesticides only as directed and only for pests identified on the label. In the world of pesticide use "the label is the law" is the pesticide applicator's mantra. . Know your enemy, know his/her habits, and know how to kill him. Also note there are published studies on the efficacy of mixing pyrethum (pyrethrin) with neem in order to improve pyrethrum efficacy against the mte nymph and larval stage of growth. . HTH's. All I got.... Ciao! . EDIT: clean up. posting with a tablet is often challenging.
There are a lot of tough decisions when it comes to this. Maybe we should just focus on spider mites which are completely different than other mites. All university and college IPM plans state hands down that chemical miticides should not be used with spider mites. There's a study I read a long time ago that looked at fruit trees in Yakima WA over a three year period using four orchards and different populations of two spot mites. They tried to find the most effective way to eradicate them. They used avid the first year I think and they reduced populations of 3/4 orchards at 99% but there were survivors. The last orchard only had something like 90% death. They found that once a mite population is exposed to avid, it will reproduce more rapidly even if used once. The generations after that will reproduce faster. The population that was resistant increased its population 350 times higher the following year! Now over time they found the best thing they used was a commercial Rosemary synthetic miticides similar to Azamax IIRC. I don't think there is a magic spray for spider mites. I think they are not always on the plant and can hide in areas you can't get to. I fully believe they are in the soil and environmental influences like a lack of "winter" indoor gardeners do not have. I've been doing the every three days thing forever. The only time my plants are decent looking is when I'm not doing so much to them but still spray every week once population is reduced and for when I know they're present, I've found an oil spray then three days later a non oil spray like spinosad or the enzyme sprays (EM5) then three days later an oil spray again so essentially your plants are getting sprayed with an oil based spray every six days so damage to the leaves is less. As long as you don't damage the leaves with phytotoxicity, they can really pull through nicely. I was also reading about mite count per leaf and the resulting loss in yield. Even with one or two mites per leaf, there was barely a loss of yield. When the mite per leaf count extended that, then plants suffered. Good IPM is scouting for bugs, not bringing in dirty clones or even used equipment. Preventative sprays on a weekly basis keeps pests at bay and even eradicate an infestation that just started since you last sprayed. Keeping your room clean, using filters on your intake ventilation and focusing on increasing plant health do more than any product. When my mites come back and they will since I just beat them back and finally have a mode of healthy growth, I plan on using lacewing larva as a control. They withstand all ranges of temps, cheap and the thing I find priceless, it allows me the little time I do have to spend in there to focus on other things like making sure plants are watered properly to reduce stress, scouting for damaged leaves which I physically remove or clean my floors and walls. I'm going to spray with EM5 instead of buying the $200 version from arbico. Then the bugs come the next day. They also are not effected by sprays like other popular predators and eat 200 eggs and mites per week per larvae. I am learning to find a good control for the bugs without the bugs controlling me or killing my plants. A few folks here have bugs they can not get rid of and all of them have found that control methods that keep populations down while not harming the leaves has worked the best whether it's neem oil, EO or plant extracts or even unicorn tears. this has all been in my experience and reading I've done dealing with spider mites for over a year. Any ways I hope this thread goes well. I would really like some hope.
I like to use neem oil mild strength for a week then Ed rosenthals stuff for another week. Worked few times I had them bad.
Has anyone having recurrent mite issues ever tried essential oils of rosemary, or spike lavender? Neem's kinda' chump considering the fact that it has no destructive power when it comes to eggs... This has definitely been covered by the postings of CC and GiMiK...
I used rosemary, clove sometimes, lemon eucalyptus and peppermint with neem oil from ahimsa for a month with no success. I tried using cinnamon and lemongrass oils with bronners on cuttings and it destroyed them so I am hesitant to use them on small plants just yet. The peppermint, eucalyptus, rosemary and clove oils emulsified with bronners has really been impressive with it being gentle at 1-2 ml per gallon. When I use the silica for emulsifying, it doesn't seem to work as well as the soap. That's what I used when I got the burned cuttings since I was out of bronners.