Just some random stuff. I don't get the sq ft as I'm used to working with volume rather than area (except in the garden), but the ratios look good. How many gallons is a sq ft? The oyster shell flour will sub for your lime quite nicely. Might need some epsom salts though for Mg. Like the Marsupial up North mentioned, that much rock dust can get the mix kinda heavy. I've had the same experience. Try it and adjust future mixes to suit. Adding the gypsum is a good thing. The 1/2 cup would be a good start. I'd also stay with the 1/2 cup of kelp. A 1/2 cup of Greensand would really compliment it though. Small amounts of both work better than a shit ton of either. My mix ran out of gas early flowering too. But to add enough amendments for flowering made the mix way too hot. Now, I do the same mix and do a healthy top dressing ~2 weeks before the 12/12. Or, I'll take some mix and amend it to SS strength for the bottom 1/2 of a bucket. Depends on the time and if I'm going to upcan or not. Lots of good info here and you have a decent starting 'recipe'. Trust me, you'll be adjusting the seasonings every time you make it till it suits you perfectly. I don't think I've ever made 2 mixes exactly the same. Wet
POSS! Forgive me if this is a silly question but what is the difference between this product and an OMRI Perlite? is it just that this is a Ceramic Material, and that Perlite is a glass? Soil Perfector is made from a naturally derived, ceramic mineral that is kiln-fired at temperatures in excess of 2000º F. This process creates a durable, lightweight granule containing thousands of tiny storage spaces that hold the perfect balance of water, air and nutrients for an improved soil structure. Unlike other amendments such as peat moss and gypsum, Soil Perfector will not break down or degrade so you do not need to re-apply it year after year" What other benifits do those possum eyes see that Im missing!?!? Boro
^^ another question if you guys don't mind, up a couple of posts Wet mentions 1/2 a cup of greensand aswell as less rock dust. Wouldn't the greensand actually act more like a rock dust, like housing for microbes, for the first 9-12 months until it starts to break down amd becomes of any nutritional value? Sorry if it's a stupid question, not intended just another noob out to conquer the world Oz
Short answer to the first part is, "I don't know". Short answer to the second part is, "areation". Just speaking for my needs I feel I've overlooked in the past the critical importance of ensuring adequate drainage and areation exists in the root zone 100% of the time. In the past I feel like I've exceeded the necessary requirements of meals in general, clay substances in general, stone meals in general, that resulted in a very heavy and poorly drained soil. I've been working to improve that over time and so I'm long on a high areation percentage of total volume when working with container plants. I now use large chunk perlite and a minimum I'm guessing of about 30% total volume of the base mix before adding any ammendments, nutrients, etc. Just the mixture of the peat, compost, EWC, perlite. That's what I refer to as my "base" and then anything added to that is an ammendement or conditioner etc. It's just how I prefer to view the thing. Areation. Long answer
The peat and perlite are nutrient-bare filler and there's way too much perlite in that mix.Organic matter/compost is great stuff, but clays help bind and exchange the nutrients that OM helps make available. Topsoil usually contains some clays. It's not a huge deal as much as all the perlite/peat, though. More soil in, less filler in...almost 1/2 your soil mix is filler.
[quote name='"bharatbuk"']The peat and perlite are nutrient-bare filler and there's way too much perlite in that mix.Organic matter/compost is great stuff, but clays help bind and exchange the nutrients that OM helps make available. Topsoil usually contains some clays. It's not a huge deal as much as all the perlite/peat, though. More soil in, less filler in...almost 1/2 your soil mix is filler.[/quote] Lol. Thanks for the input.
Yes, pretty much. Greensand is a multitasker. AFA the less rock dust. Figure the greensand as a RD, Lime as a RD, Gypsum,soft rock phosphate and so on. You add 5 cups of Azomite or granite dust, or glacial rock dust, the mix is going to get heavy. It isn't going to burn anything, no worries there, it just starts to get like wet cement. You just need to find the right amount where you have good drainage/aeration and plenty of RD. Wet
Hey Borophyl hope yer weekends going good pal! By the way Oz, no such thing as a stupid question as long as its well meant. We're all trying to learn.
[quote name='"wetdog"'] Yes, pretty much. Greensand is a multitasker. AFA the less rock dust. Figure the greensand as a RD, Lime as a RD, Gypsum,soft rock phosphate and so on. You add 5 cups of Azomite or granite dust, or glacial rock dust, the mix is going to get heavy. It isn't going to burn anything, no worries there, it just starts to get like wet cement. You just need to find the right amount where you have good drainage/aeration and plenty of RD. Wet[/quote] Great thank you for the answer wet, def don't want to be dumping that soil after one run then. Always well mean't here jerry, selfish really I noticed there was a bit of an argument starting up and ya see I'm a bit of a knowledge pig, wanted to get my bags off before she went up in flames Hello Boro! Great thread, hope it's helped you as much as its helped me!
Wet, argument? I wasn't aware. If it was, it sure weren't with you, buddy - I like you. It's Borophyl I never really liked...*lol* Great thank you for the answer wet, def don't want to be dumping that soil after one run then Oz, especially since it takes years to really (greensand) break down, eh? Once you start mixing real soil, man, you never want to dump it! It can always be recycled - in many different ways. Some do no-till and just keep using it. Some bust it up and re-amend it, and others chuck it in thier compost heap - but we never just get rid of it! J I'm an editing fool today! Smoke some herb and only write half of what I'm thinkin' hehe
[quote name='"jerry111165"']Wet, argument? I wasn't aware. If it was, it sure weren't with you, buddy - I like you. It's Borophyl I never really liked...*lol* Great thank you for the answer wet, def don't want to be dumping that soil after one run then Oz, especially since it takes years to really (greensand) break down, eh? Once you start mixing real soil, man, you never want to dump it! It can always be recycled - in many different ways. Some do no-till and just keep using it. Some bust it up and re-amend it, and others chuck it in thier compost heap - but we never just get rid of it! J I'm an editing fool today! Smoke some herb and only write half of what I'm thinkin' hehe[/quote] Hahaha no no argument with wet! Or me What I mean was about agman (no bad words there either) , it just looked like this thread was going to turn into an argument or get well off track anyhow and I wanted to get my info out before it did 'Oz, especially since it takes years to really (greensand) break down, eh? ' Exactly!! Learning really is rewarding that's what I was getting at with my original question, thanks guys! Oz [quote name='"AKAoZ"']^^ another question if you guys don't mind, up a couple of posts Wet mentions 1/2 a cup of greensand aswell as less rock dust. Wouldn't the greensand actually act more like a rock dust, like housing for microbes, for the first 9-12 months until it starts to break down amd becomes of any nutritional value? Oz[/quote]
Yeah, Borophyl, that granola head wannabe! AFA Greensand, Espoma adds it to their Garden Tone, so I guess 'some' of it is available soon. Organic soon, anyway. Boro ... Do you mean cubic foot when you say square foot? I'm still lost on that one. We're just fucking with you. If we really didn't like you, the questions would simply be ignored. Wet
[quote name='"wetdog"'] Yeah, Borophyl, that granola head wannabe! AFA Greensand, Espoma adds it to their Garden Tone, so I guess 'some' of it is available soon. Organic soon, anyway. Boro ... Do you mean cubic foot when you say square foot? I'm still lost on that one. We're just fucking with you. If we really didn't like you, the questions would simply be ignored. Wet[/quote] Well I'm pretty lost on this as well... Gonn let my ignorance show a little here I guess but here it goes.... All the recipes I see refer to sq ft as opposed to cubic foot. Which make no sense up me, sq ft doesn't measure volume like we need to be because wouldn't there be an infinite number of "square feet" in a cubic foot? Sq ft has nothing to do with volume, sq foot has no "thickness" so theoretically you could stack infinite sq feet into a cubic foot. I was more or less just wondering if anyone else sees this and thinks its odd.... I always convert to gallons to decide how much to amend my soil, so I guess it doesn't matter much, just a thought, Boro
From what I have been told in the past, greensand can take up to 8 years to completely break down - however... For the organic gardener, very slow release organic amendments can end up working out much, much better than ones that break down fast. I've been doing some reading on this particular amendment, and it's pretty interesting how it works. I copied these paragraphs from "doityourself dot com" - I thought it was a worthwhile read. Greensand is one of the most highly recommended soil additives for its ability to draw in and retain moisture while also adding slow-releasing nutrients. It has been used as a natural mineral fertilizer for centuries, but has seen a particular resurgence in popularity as more commercial farms strive for coveted organic certifications and home growers have shied away from harmful artificial chemicals. Greensand will counteract drying effects in any area and with any soil type, but delivers especially dramatic improvement in desert and clay environments. It will also deliver vital nutrients. This combination dramatically increases the fertility and sustainability of your soil. What Greensand Is Greensand is a sandstone rock that slightly resembles glass while also being chalky to the touch. It is abundant in Europe and North America around the coasts. Its color and texture are due to the mineral glauconite, an iron potassium silicate with low weathering resistance. Unlike unstable nitrogen fertilizers, greensand is non-corrosive and non-toxic, so will not harm your skin or surrounding animal life (including mischievous pets). Because of this, it will also not kill the important microorganisms and worms that you worked so hard raising in your compost and mulch. Why You Need Greensand The primary cause of soil infertility is a loss of moisture. Moisture is important not only because your plants need water, but for the long-term sustainability of the soil. Often times allowing your soil to dry up causes irreparable damage. Excessively dry soil becomes substantially altered in its porosity. Soil then becomes like clay and like a compressed sponge, suddenly unable to retain new moisture. Water leeching into the water table is not immediately evident and will have already seriously eroded precious root-level soil before you will have the chance to correct or even notice the problem. Greensand prevents these effects by promoting soil moisture in two ways. Firstly, the greensand's potassium makeup attracts water, drawing moisture from the evaporation prone surface toward the roots. Secondly, this attracting property holds moisture in place until used by plants or replaced by new saturation. When aplied in the proper amounts, greensand will add nutrients and retain moisture to your soil, increasing plant vitality and longterm soil sustainability. Greensand not only improves your soil's moisture retention but also provides vital, water soluble nutrients. Greensand primarily delivers soluble potash (potassium that dissolves in water), stable nitrogen and calcium while also containing variable levels of up to 30 other plant-usable minerals. Recommended Application Apply at 16 lbs. per 1000 sq. feet for lawns, 30 lbs. for flower and vegetable gardens, two ounces (1/3 cup) per bush for roses and two tablespoons per gallon of potting mix. If you are dealing with a particularly dry climate or clay soil, increase these amounts by up to 10 percent. Greensand should be mixed into soil, compost or mulch when possible. However, its low weathering resistance means that if you missed this opportunity, it works well to sprinkle generous amounts around the base of plants. The greensand will then break down and recede down to root level. There is no wait time before the areas become safe for skin contact as with artificial fertilizers. J
[quote name='"jerry111165"']Wet, argument? I wasn't aware. If it was, it sure weren't with you, buddy - I like you. It's Borophyl I never really liked...*lol* [/quote] He sure is a trouble maker! :: J, I WILL find time to respond tomorrow, thanks so much for your help the last few days, sure is clearing ALOT of things up, maybe someday I will feel confident enough in my understanding of the process to help someone as you have me, and as your "teacher" did you. Full circle, pay it forward kinda thing! Wet, I appreciate your help, bad granola jokes aside. Ha! Seriously though man, thanks. Boro
Just which recipes? Here in this forum? Or, where? Links? I'm trying to get on the same page here, but need to know what you're referencing. Wet
^^^^^I'm with Wet here^^^^^ Boro, With all due respect, I think you are confusing sq/ft with cu/ft. Most of the soil mix recipes we've used here for years are based on cubic feet. Volume instead of area....Hope this helps, Chunk
You'd use sq ft/meters if applying to feilds yards beds ect (but then I make it cubic anyway by x the depth , eg 1sq ft dug in 6" will be 1/2 a cubic ft. A cubic ft is about 7gal /28L. If your talking buckets ,cups ,gal , liters and mixing above ground you wanna be going with cubic. Your exactly right boro, sq ft is area cubic is volume. Oz