[quote name='"AgMan"'] As long as this is happening in the last two weeks, I look at it as a good thing. Preferably, I want this to happen in the fer last week. As for keeping them green, I give nitrogen right to the end of flower, and supplement with added PK in the last 4-5 weeks. This is what the creators of "Medi One" think is best, and they have won numerous cannabis cups.[/quote] When you say you "give them nitrogen", how do you mean? Curious minds Boro
I give a steady flow of nitrogen as a base nutrient, then around week 5 or 6 I start adding a pure PK boost to this base at 50% strength, then double the PK boost at weeks 7-8 to the 100%. I cease all feeding in my final week, which generally has them senescing by harvest. I don't use Medi One, but their base nutrient is a 4-3-3, this is fed all through veg and flower, but in flower you add their bloom formula that is higher in PK. I honestly don't know what my base NPK is since I brew it up my self, but assume it is around the same range... My PK mix is 0-52-34.
[quote name='"AgMan"'] I give a steady flow of nitrogen as a base nutrient, then around week 5 or 6 I start adding a pure PK boost to this base at 50% strength, then double the PK boost at weeks 7-8 to the 100%. I cease all feeding in my final week, which generally has them senescing by harvest. I don't use Medi One, but their base nutrient is a 4-3-3, this is fed all through veg and flower, but in flower you add their bloom formula that is higher in PK. I honestly don't know what my base NPK is since I brew it up my self, but assume it is around the same range... My PK mix is 0-52-34.[/quote] Kinda what I thought, this is a soil mix thread... Don't use those bottled Nutes here... Nor do I concern myself with "NPK" You should spend sometime reading the stickies in the organic section your posting in. I don't "feed" my plants, they feed themselves, with the help of millions of little assistants in the soil. The point of this thread was to "amp" up my soil mix. Boro
My post was in reply to keeping them green through flower. Totally agree, but I do believe a PK boost in the last few weeks makes a difference in the swelling of flowers. I make a concentrated tea, and feed the soil microbes. It is made out of fermented molasses, alfalfa, Bio Alive (for veg), and some added bat guano for the flower formula. I don't mix my own soil anymore (just too much soil needed and not enough to time to do it) but I use organically alive soils, and add more biologicals and supplements. Quality is definitely better when you feed the soil. Those microbes make all sorts of tasty shit for plants. For a time I relied on just the soil additives to take me through flower, but I didn't think it was as beneficial without supplementation later on. In flower, after I mix my additives in, I do just give plain water for 4-6 weeks of flower, then start the feed until finished. Nutrients seem to run out around this time. As for adding stuff to your soil mix, have you considered expanded clay pellets for aeration (like hydroton). Clay pellets are a great place for soil microbes to live, and clay also has an ionic charge which prevents excessive leeching. Also, check out SEA-90 from seaagri.com, it is a great trace mineral supplement and there is tons of research (50+ years I think) to read.
Nutrients seem to run out around this time Doesn't this come down to the quality of the soil and the assorted components in it? If nutrients continually run out each time, then how would a no-till bed continue to work for many, many years? J Edit - As for adding stuff to your soil mix, have you considered expanded clay pellets for aeration (like hydroton). Clay pellets are a great place for soil microbes to live, and clay also has an ionic charge which prevents excessive leeching. This is just another reason to spend money at the hydro store. If you're looking for a place for microbes to live, have you considered glacial rock dust? Also, just how much water are you adding if your soil is "leeching"? There shouldn't be any reason for an organic soil to be kept at any level above "moist". An organic soils components ARE the soil, therefore it is physically impossible, with the exception of totally excessive watering for anything to leech out of it. My .02c. J
There is a lot more going on outdoor than indoor. There are a lot more macro soil organism living, eating and dying, leaves falling and decomposing in place, critters urinating and defecating, left over roots and crop residue decomposing after each season. There is also a lot more soil for the plants to work with, vs the 10 gallons I use per plant indoor. Cannabis roots can reach around 6 ft in the ground and many square feet of area around the plant, this adds a lot of organic matter each year, eventually more than what is needed to sustain life. No till works because, turning up the soil causes soil microbes to go crazy and decompose at higher rate, which is good for 1 crop but not sustainable. Furthermore, outdoor in nature, climate alters the profile of NPK to the more PK ranges in fall's cooler temps as the microbes die off and release their contents. This is why I add PK indoor, since I don't have seasons. http://nmsp.cals.cornell.edu/publications/factsheets/factsheet12.pdf
Do you go to a glacier to collect dust or do you buy it from a store? Hydroton, or similar expended clay pellets are reusable. Edit Leeching occurs anyway, it can be as simple as moving nutrients to edges of pots, or in the case of my smart pots, in the fabric where it dries and is not usable. Roots like the clay pellets, they wrap around them quite readily and sink in to the pores. They probably like lava rocks too, but I am unsure if there is an ionic charge that hold nutrients, I'll have to research that one. I am guessing you buy lava rocks at the store rather than collect them from a volcanic field...
Agman, Simple questions Do you reuse your soil? How is buying soil better for someone that needs a lot? Because that is the EXACT reason I went to mixing my own, I started adding up how much bagged soil I would need, and what it would cost.....shit! Not only is is a fraction of the cost of bagged soil in the long run, I can also reuse it. AND if you look at guys as "dialed in" as Jerry and his garden, then you understand why I strive to get a soil together that I can literally take one plant out of and drop another in. Boro
Didn't say better, I said less time consuming. Time is money, everyone has their own balance to strike. I do reuse soil after it piles up and I let it decompose the roots. I have successfully reused soil for 2 years. Lately, I have been making new garden beds and have been filling them with my first run soil. I also have a shit load of clay that grass seed won't seem to take well in, so I tilled in a bunch of potting soil from previous runs. I spend about $50 on bagged soil per round, when I buy new stuff (my local grow shop gives me a 25% discount). Since my wages are $25/hr I feel like the 2 hours I save by not mixing is justified.
Hey boro I just stumbled across this product last night. I'm gonna try to find this product and use it and see what happens. Espoma Soil Perfector I'm thinking this is not an Espoma exclusive but it's the first of it's type that I've seen. And FWIW I'm a fan of Espoma's organic line. Good as any and better'n most IMO. In addition to plant nutrients we also need to keep our eye on the tilth of our containerized soil. EDIT: Again, FWIW, I'm currently using 7.5g containers and am completely satisfied with them within my current parameters. I'm already using lava rock to line the bottom of my containers as the drainage holes (6) are approximately 1"sq. Focusing for a moment on the areation component of container growing I also drill holes in the bottom of all my containers and also in a symetrical pattern around the container. I place these large containers in heavy duty saucers and I alternate watering the plants from the bottom and the top on different days. When watering from the bottom I can add 1-2 qts of H20 in the saucer and in ~10 mins it will be completely wicked up from the bottom. The whole point being <I was at the club tday > improved areation! LOL. I think lining the bottom of the container with this product is probably an excellent idea (as is drilling symetretical holes in the bottom and outside of your plastic containers ) Phuccccccccc
Agman, obviously, to each his/her own. Whatever works well for you is great in my book. My nutrients don't leech. My soil mix is constructed of humus (not water-soluble), sphagnum peat (not water-soluble) and an assortment of soil amendments (not water-soluble) and rock dust (not water-soluble) that as a whole, when combined make up what I call soil. As these items are not water soluble - at all, whatsoever, it is physically impossible for them to leech. I, personally, don't use lava rock. I've simply found I don't need it, but again, whatever personally works well for the individual gardener (as long as they aren't using Monsantos Miracle Grow *lol*) is A-ok in my book. I did pick up a bag of rice hulls that I'll try one of these days when I get a chance. Welcome to the Organics forum. J
Lol, okay... I'm surprized all these insoluble things you use keep your plants alive. What are these magical, immobile supplements? You do know insoluble means right?
Ok Agman, To each his own, now it would be nice if you read the title of this thread and decided for yourself whether or not your opinion is needed. This is a soil mixing thread, you don't mix soil. I would rather not see this thread derailed by misinformation. Thanks Boro
sol·u·ble /ˈsälyəbəl/ Adjective (of a substance) Able to be dissolved, esp. in water: "the poison is soluble in alcohol". (of a problem) Able to be solved. Synonyms solvable - resoluble - dissoluble - dissolvable Put some compost in a cup, add water. Come back and let me know when it dissolves. Boro
[quote name='"Borophyl"']sol·u·ble /ˈsälyəbəl/ Adjective (of a substance) Able to be dissolved, esp. in water: "the poison is soluble in alcohol". (of a problem) Able to be solved. Synonyms solvable - resoluble - dissoluble - dissolvable Put some compost in a cup, add water. Come back and let me know when it dissolves. Boro[/quote] You're a fool. I'll be glad to leave. My parting words: What the fuck is compost tea? This is a rhetorical question, the answer is obvious...
[quote name='"AgMan"']Lol, okay... I'm surprized all these insoluble things you use keep your plants alive. What are these magical, immobile supplements? You do know insoluble means right?[/quote] AgMan.....I haven't been at this growing thing too long. However, I have been at it long enough (and read enough) to know that you are mis informed. I suggest you pull up a chair and listen like I did. It has benefitted me, and would benefit you. But after using the word "fool" to describe Boro, or Jerry (or whoever you were addressing), methinks you may just need to take a hike on over to a different section. This place may not be for you. We are helpful towards one another here. We don't need to hear that crap, here. So....open your mind to learning or please take a hike.
I'm not sure I get it... Compost tea is where I add compost, water, and a food stock for microbes. Over a period of time, and by creating ideal conditions with proper levels of dissolved oxygen, the microbes breed in the tea, making large numbers of microbes on the tea solution, which is added to soil to ensure proper numbers of these microbes in the soil. The insoluble compost is left behind. Some folks put thier compost onto a paint strainer, just because the compost is insoluble. The magical insoluble nutrients that I use? Are you referring to my kelp meal, neem meal, alfalfa meal, seed meals, compost, peat, or the rock dust? These insoluble items? Out of respect for Borophyl I'll bow out now rather than fill his thread with arguments. Peas. J
I also apologize for getting "lippy" on your thread Boro. Let's get this back on topic, even though the consensus seems to be that your mix is great. Anyone, have useful additions for Boro and his soil mix?