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Running into problems with first time hydro grow..

Discussion in 'Hydroponic Growing' started by jnasty0412, Jan 8, 2013.

  1. #1 jnasty0412, Jan 8, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 12, 2013
    So I started some greenhouse feminised white rhino from seeds about 4 weeks ago and also some seeds from bags I bought.. I have them all in a recirculating dwc 5 gallon system.
    My problem now is the seed I found in the bags starting to turn yellow and leaves are starting to get crispy.. The white rhinos all seem healthy but I see them starting to turn yellow and leaves starting to bend. I wanna fix this problem before it get's any worse. My light is 1000watt dimmable and was set at 750watt about 18in over the plants. I was not sure if the light was to close so I moved it to 24 inches but the problem is still continuing. Then I did a complete res change and set my nutes and ph to 315ppm and 5.7ph. Before then change it was 375ppm 5.7ph.. Im following the lucas formula micro, bloom and im using the .5 conversion. So it says for veg 0-5-10=592 ppm. Im doing half that 1 month into veg so I don' think nute burn is the case.

    Any help is appreciated, this is my first grow so the more info the better. My phone screen is broken so I cant get pics up right now but I will once a friend comes by.
     

  2. this could be tough. What are your temps like? how do the roots look? is there any nitrogen being provided? I see you said 0-5-10 seems like NO nitrogen some Phosphorous and a double potassium? are you sure about your TDS readings? have you calibrated your meter?
     
  3. Ace, I think he was referring to mL / gallon for GH Flora, 0mL grow, 5mL micro & 10mL bloom (which would provide the nitrogen) ? But that wouldnt get to 592ppm unless his water is as hard as mine....
    Any rate, 592 shouldnt cause burn, I vote for excess heat buildup.
    Or were you misting the plants? DON'T.
    Only other idea, I recently discovered that sometime in the past, GH changed their base formulas so cal-mag deficiencies can develop with Lucas. Try the full 3-part Flora & see if that helps.
     
  4. http://generalhydroponics.com/site/gh/docs/prod_labels/floramicro.pdf Micro http://generalhydroponics.com/site/gh/docs/prod_labels/florabloom.pdf Bloom

    Plenty of nitrogen. My room temp during lights on is 77-80* and 68-69* lights off. Humidity is 50% during the day and maybe 25-30 at night. My intake and outake(carbon filter) are on a set timer for 15 mins every hour. I did have only one 6in fan blowing on them so I just added one more that's much bigger. I see the plants blowing around much more but its not strong enough to break bones. Im hoping this was the problem. And yes my ppm meter is the hm-com 100 I calibrate weekly. The roots are definitely getting bigger. The leaves are just not looking as dark as before. My plants are only about 5-7 inch out of the hydroton after transplant but the leaves are wider than the plant is tall on 3 of them. Is this ok for 1month I know indica stay short?

    After 1 month from seedling what are your ppm readings along with your conversion? THIS IS A QUESTION FOR EVERYONE READING THIS (Hydroponics).
     
  5. Im hoping you're right olde school. I believe the air was getting to still around the plants because the 6 inch was not doing much. Do you think there's any way I could be underfeeding? And im not sure if this is a dumb question but if you are or were using the same nutes and formula as me micro, bloom.. What would your feeding schedule(weekly ppm's) be like growing white rhino for you whole veg cycle? And how long do you think you would wait to flip to 12/12 from seed?
     
  6. he man, if getting yellowed, and you got a 1000watt, at 24 inch, ita wayy too close,, even if its cooltubed, put that at about 48 inch,,, lol,,,
    a seed will grow easyer and faster and greener with a lower light than a blast in the face, trust me it can possibly be only that
     
  7. What is your reservior water temp? Are your roots draining completely? How often are you watering? Any pH issues? Have you checked your water quality report?

    I'm also growing White Rhino, using GH's Expert / Recirculating feeding schedule (http://generalhydroponics.com/site/gh/docs/feeding_sched/GH-FloraSeries-REC-Charts.pdf). I did *not* use Rapid Start or Floralicious Plus, but I'm using the rest of the additives. I mix at about 85-90% strength and they've been doing great so far, but these were *NOT* grown straight from clone, they had been vegging for a while. The Sweet Island Skunk is growing along side them, they *were* straight from clone and they are doing equally well. If you're using less nutrients than this, you're probably fine. I don't even have a PPM/EC meter.

    I don't think your light is too close. As many have said before, it's hard to replicate the intensity of the sun. I run mine 4-6" from the tops (1000W) and I haven't had a single leaf burn or curl up. I did slower lower it to that height over the first two weeks, but in retrospect I don't know how necessary it was.

    I don't know if poor air circulation would do that, but if they aren't getting much fresh air the roots will be starved for oxygen and the plant starved for CO2 so that sounds plausible to me...
     
  8. still waiting on pics. BTW are the leaves curling up or down? and where are the yellowing leaves? top? middle? bottom?
     
  9. Newthumb, The light is a 1000watt dimmable it's set to 750 watt, and 26in over the plants that should be ok? 28days ago I germinated them and they popd out within 24hours so these are from seed 27 days ago.
     
  10. My res temp goes anywhere between 68-72 which should be ok, from what I hear 69* is perfect. And my roots do not drain because im in a recirculating Dwc 5 gallon bucket system which has a constant watering system. I never read that I should put the pump on a timer but this is what im using. Amazon.com: THE HALO RAINMAKER 6 Aeroponic Hydroponic system aero drip garden dwc deep water culture: Patio, Lawn & Garden

    Im using tap water that reads 77-80 ppm on a .5 conversion meter and 8.2 ph, that's not considered hard water is it?

    I have a 6in inline hooked up to a carbon filter, I think the fan is around 475cfm. Then I have a 6 inch duct fan for the intake pulling through ducting with panty hose filtering the end. Just want to say the panty hose been collecting all the dust and crap that would have went in. Anyways I have them set on a timer together to run 15 minutes every hour. I did have it every half hour but I changed that because humidity control. Then I have a large fan on 1 side of my tent and 6in on the other blowing directly on the plants making sure there is no still air around the leaves.
     
  11. #11 jnasty0412, Jan 9, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 9, 2013
    Sorry ace, Ill try to get them only thing I can do right now is use a shitty webcam on my laptop to take the pic. I know it's probably aggravating trying to help someone without seeing the problem. The leaves are curling both ways on the plants I got out of the bags. The white rhino started losing darkness in the leaves all around and started bringing out yellow lines. Right when I saw that It seemed like I was underfeeding. So I flushed the res, up'd the dosage to 400ppm. The drying stopped on the bag seeds, and I'm paying close attention to the leaves on the rhino. And the leaves were drying on the tips then going down through the whole leaf dying out. The rhino was just loosing it's color tone through the whole leaf.
     
  12. well if you put your hands at the top of your plans, do you feel the hot of the light or no. if no., your probably alright, if yes, then you burn them.

    ive did a test with some seed until about they was 20 days. i blasted them at about 10 days they got about 5 leaf already, and they not liked that. they was growing very very slowly, when i put them back into neons 6500k, if its like if they was reviving again... but youno i can be worng, maybe more advanced people on the forum can say something on this. but most of the people will tell ya the same, small plan,seed, clones, dont need high light ,
     
  13. #13 DT4, Jan 10, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 10, 2013
    I'm telling you, I had three week old clones (three weeks *from cutting*) with 1000W sitting about 12-18" over them, and by the next week I dropped the lights to 4-6" over the canopy and I've kept at this distance ever since. I'm not an expert, but I'm almost certain it's NOT the light intensity. *NOTE* my hoods are air cooled, this does make a difference...

    Your water pH is naturally pretty high - anything over 7.4 i think is considered high. High pH can be a HUGE problem and correcting with pH down is not always the most effective way to correct it. Also, a water temp of 69 is OK, but lower is better. Your PPM's are moderately high, but not too bad. I would seriously look into a water quality report - you can go online with your water company and find it for whatever source your water comes from. I learned A LOT about my water quality, and specific things to watch for in my area. The hardness will impact your PPM/mineral content and the pH will impact nutrient uptake.

    Personally I think it's nute burn or a pH issue. My nute strength during that first week after transplant was VERY low, in fact I think I did the first couple floods with plain water. Anyhoo, mine is an ebb & flow, so it's a little different.
     

  14. your tap water has a high enough Ph to cause excessively high TDS when you use whatever yoou use to lower it. Or are you even lowering the ph? If its up at 8.2 problem solved. lower it to 5.5-5.8. Whats IN your tap water anyway? Chlorine? copper? calcium? try RO or distilled for awhile and get that Ph down.

    As long as the temps at the plant arent above 79ish (lowers better) too much light isnt possible. Ever look at a 100Watt bulb? it sucks! Ever look at the sun? HELLA WORSE!!!
     
  15. Those are my ph and ppm readings right out of the faucet. I do lower my ph when needed and right now it is 5.8 which is perfect. After everything I've done the plants seem to be a lot more comfortable. I'll keep you updated if more yellow or crispy leaves start to develop. I appreciate all the help. I believe bit of anyone's advice help me figure out the problem. The leaves that were crispy yesterday are now moistening back up.
     
  16. I'm not an expert on hydro, however I do know a few things about tap water. Depending on where you live you may have several impurities in your tap water. Most common are calcium, copper, iron, flouride, and chlorine. Most of which are added intentionally because raw water is not safe so minerals are added so that the body will absorb the water, and chlorine is added to combat bacteria. Also when chlorine agents are added to kill bacteria it does just that, however you are left with dead bacteria in your water (lovely eh?)
    The biggie that most people over look is Arson. Yes there is trace amounts of Arson in your water. California, Arizona, and Nevada have significantly dangerous amounts of Arson in their water supplies. Many cities advise to not use tap water in formula for babies.

    Ill get to my point. Be weary of your tap water, get local water reports before you use it to verify its contents, and make sure you let your water stand for 24 hrs minimum before use in your tank to allow chlorine to vapor out of the water. I would suggest going to walmart or anywhere that sells the 5 Gallon jugs of water. Typically $12 for the containers, and ~$1.50 per refill. Or filter your own water.
    Cheers
     
  17. ^^
    Arsenic. Arson and water just don't mesh.
     
  18. LoL. Thats what I meant.
     
  19. If your using tap water, what's your TDS and/or ppm before adding nutes? Are you using just micro? Or micro for hard water? I would still try and swing that ph lower, closer to 5.5. What type of system are you running again?
     
  20. My water before adding nutes is around 80 ppm on a .5 conversion hm com 100 pen. Im using regular micro because I was told it was not really considered hard water. But the ph is around 8.2 and that's pretty high. But of course I lower that. I think my problem had to do with a little bit of everything a first time grower could experience, slight nute burn, distance of my light, and fans constantly blowing on the leaves. I think everything is looking ok now.

    here's the system im using.. recircuating dwc I upgraded to an 8 outlet pump for air stones in each bucket
    Amazon.com: THE HALO RAINMAKER 6 Aeroponic Hydroponic system aero drip garden dwc deep water culture: Patio, Lawn & Garden
     

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