Rock Dust

Discussion in 'Growing Organic Marijuana' started by jerry111165, Sep 22, 2012.

  1. Ive discussed this topic with several of you, and it has been the general concensus that we need a thread on this subject. It is an amazing subject, one that I have been and still am studying. I do not claim to be any kind of an expert on this subject, (at all), but I've been working on this with a friend who does know quite a bit about it and so have learned at least some basics.

    Rock dust! Simple, powdered, shattered, ground, screened rock!

    First, let me quote from something that Lumper and I were discussing regarding soil -

    "Soil: rotted plant and/or animal materials with shattered rock. Here again we can see how basic plants are to the development of this planet. It is algae (the most basic plant) that over the eons pulled thin shattered layers away from the rocks leading to the development of what would become 'soil' - that is soil at its basic definition. Sticks, rocks, etc. would be considered 'amendments' by gardeners or something close.

    Minerals: while  this is completely inaccurate from the perspective of a geologist or even a botanist, I'll use the layman's definition of a mineral as an Element that can be derived  from a mined material,  i.e. shattered rock 


    So, now that we have a basic definition of "soil" out of the way, to those that do not have rock dust in thier soil mix, by rights, this soil is incomplete. We need the rock dust in our soil mix to make it complete. I'm talking about actual rock dust here; ie: granite meal, glacial rock dust, basalt dust, et al. I'm not talki g about rock phosphate or clays (this is for a different post) - I'm just talking about simple, ground rock dust.

    The real question here is WHY are these dusts so important?

    Again, I'm going to quote LD here:

    Contrary to the misinformation passed around garden forums (of all stripes), there are not 12 'things' that plants need. That was the theory behind Liebig's Law of the Minimum. Liebig was the chemist (not botanist) who dropped the NPK bomb on the world in the 1840's in Germany. The book 'Bread From Stones' was written shortly thereafter that refuted Liebig's theory (which were based on Carl Sprengel's work).  "Bread From Stones" is available online for free - a must have for a guy like you, i.e. serious organic gardener. 

    The fact of the matter is that there aren't 12 Elements needed but rather 83. Keep that number in mind as you look at plant materials that you might consider using. All plants accumulate these 83 Elements and some plants that do a better job are called 'healthy' by nutritionists and we refer to them as 'bio-nutrient accumulators' and in the dietary world Kale is a better accumulator than Iceberg lettuce so we use terms like 'more nutritious' or 'healthier' - that's from the Elements that are accumulated - Phosphorus, Calcium, Potassium, etc. In the sustainable/organic gardening and agricultural paradigm, we call Comfrey, Kelp, Alfalfa, et al. nutrient accumulators. Same Elements but different terms for the same thing.

    In a soil shattered rock (rock dust) provide a number of things: 'anchors' for many fungi strains. While it is true that endo & ecto mycorrhizal strains 'bore into the roots' like a corkscrew that is not the case with the majority of fungi in a soil. Even in the brewing of an AACT people who know what they're doing (like Microbeman) add small amounts of some kind of rock dust not to enhance the 'mineral level' in the brew but to provide an anchor for the fungi to attach to and then extend their length.

    Another benefit that rock dusts provide is structure in the soil which equates to aeration paths. Paths for not only air but water to move freely in the rhizosphere. 


    So, now we know that rock dusts provide several benefits, first, "mineralization", and also pathways for air and water, and most importantly, anchors for bacteria/soil life to latch onto in our soil.

    After much reading and discussions with LD, the REAL BENEFIT comes from ENZYMES. Once the bacteria has latched onto and anchored to the rock dust, they produce enzymes. While there are many different types of enzymes, (different types of enzymes are created dependent on thier "host") one of the most important things that happens due to these enzymes in our soil is Nutrient Cycling. Bacteria do not "eat" organic matter - they utilize these enzymes to break down the organic matter for them. They excrete enzymes thru thier bodies. By having the rock dust in our soil, we have created many places for bacteria to latch onto, more enzymes are created, by more enzymes being created, more nutrient cycling happens, by more nutrient cycling happening, more organic matter is broken down into usable plant food!

    Pretty slick, isn't it!

    Again, by LD - this dude has taught me a lot, and it's cool to be able to pass this on -

    But here is where the greatest benefit lies (IMHO) and that is the enzymes created by bacteria (primarily) that surround these pieces of rock. It will take many, many years for this material to breakdown. Years. But the microbial activity creates enzymes and enzymes are a key component in the nutrient cycling by plant roots from other microbial activity. 

    Chitin is a perfect example of what I'm trying to explain. Chitin in and of itself does not kill a single insect. It's the enzyme that is created by bacteria called Chinease and it's this enzyme that softens insect eggs preventing them from hatching. Chitin is also a key component in fungi as it forms much of the outer layer. But again, it's the enzyme from bacterial activity that is the real goal here.

    But let's get back to 'mineralization' again. Last winter, Acres USA Magazine had an article that featured 6 leading experts on soil from leading universities and research centers. Each individual wrote a piece which was part of this anthology. Down to each and every scientist it was agreed that complete mineralization could be easily accomplished by using kelp meal. The problem is that the recommend amount of kelp per acre is 200 lbs. That's a lot of money - imagine amending 200 acres which is a pretty small farm.

    But in the world of organic farmers, Alfalfa is often referred to as 'field kelp' because like kelp, Alfalfa accumulates all of the 83 Elements needed for planting health and costs 25% of what kelp costs. Comfrey, Stinging Nettle, et al. will provide a farmer or gardner each and every Element (even NPK!!! Yay!  LOL)

    So rock dusts, particularly in an artificial soil like we make up even as good as it is) will do very, very little as far as 'feeding' a plant. Very little. But the benefit comes indirectly, i.e. by having these anchors in the soil the fungi increase in size (length) meaning that they can reach more hidden 'sequestered nutrients' from bacteria exudes, etc. so in that sense the rock dusts do increase plant growth, health, etc.

    Think about it logically - if soil rock pieces could degrade in a 3 or 4 month trip through our indoor gardens the imagine what would have happened out in the real world - the human race and all plants and animals would have died out in the first million years of their origin. 


    I'm going to end this first post by putting some links to read here. This is a fascinating subject that deserves discussion here in the Organics forum.

    A Rock Dust Primer

    http://www.paramountgrowth.com/images/rockdust_sdiver01.pdf

    Earth Remineralization Rock Dust  & Seaweed

    jerry.
     
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  2. #2 jerry111165, Sep 22, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 22, 2012
    Regarding the importance of soil enzymes:

    Cite: Soil Quality: Indicators: Soil Enzymes

    What it is: Soil enzymes increase the reaction rate at which plant residues decompose and release plant available nutrients. The substance acted upon by a soil enzyme is called the substrate. For example, glucosidase (soil enzyme) cleaves glucose from glucoside (substrate), a compound common in plants. Enzymes are specific to a substrate and have active sites that bind with the substrate to form a temporary complex. The enzymatic reaction releases a product, which can be a nutrient contained in the substrate.

    Sources of soil enzymes include living and dead microbes, plant roots and residues, and soil animals. Enzymes
    stabilized in the soil matrix accumulate or form complexes with organic matter (humus), clay, and humus-clay
    complexes, but are no longer associated with viable cells. It is thought that 40 to 60% of enzyme activity can come from stabilized enzymes, so activity does not necessarily correlate highly with microbial biomass or respiration. Therefore, enzyme activity is the cumulative effect of long term microbial activity and activity of the viable population at sampling. However, an example of an enzyme that only reflects activity of viable cells is
    dehydrogenase, which in theory can only occur in viable cells and not in stabilized soil complexes.

    Why it is important: Enzymes respond to soil management changes long before other soil quality indicator changes are detectable. Soil enzymes play an important role in organic matter decomposition and nutrient cycling (see table 1). Some enzymes only facilitate the breakdown of organic matter (e.g., hydrolase, glucosidase), while others are involved in nutrient mineralization (e.g., amidase, urease, phosphatase, sulfates). With the exception of phosphatase activity, there is no strong evidence that directly relates enzyme activity to nutrient availability or crop production. The relationship may be indirect considering nutrient mineralization to plant available forms is accomplished with the contribution of enzyme activity.


    J
     
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  3. thanks for this! woke up to gc still on my computer screen. barley had my eyes open for 5 minutes and just had to read this!
     
  4. Excellent info jerry, thank you for doing this. This was definitely needed. I vote for sticky.
     
  5. i second that vote! who knew jerry could get my lazy butt outta bed with an article on rock dust;)
     
  6. :smoke:
    As always jerry, great informative posting! Links downloaded, and bookmarked! Thanks again for sharing your wealth of knowledge and the experience of others!
     
  7. Thanks folks. The more I get into this subject the deeper it takes me into this "thing of ours" - this hobby of organic gardening. There is so much to learn.

    More to come.

    J
     
  8. [quote name='"InTheGarden"']Excellent info jerry, thank you for doing this. This was definitely needed. I vote for sticky.[/quote]

    Agreed 100% thank you jerry
     
  9. great stuff as usual, jerry!
    definetly agree with the rest here, this is the beginnings of another great sticky, one of the building blocks of a great soil mix.
     
  10. [quote name='"jerry111165"']Thanks folks. The more I get into this subject the deeper it takes me into this "thing of ours" - this hobby of organic gardening. There is so much to learn.

    More to come.

    J[/quote]

    [​IMG]

    how deep do you want to follow this rabbit hole neo? I mean jerry lol
     
  11. how deep do you want to follow this rabbit hole neo?

    As deep as I can.

    This is an AK-47 and my 6 Week strains , that have been in flower for 3 weeks now, in a soil mix that was amended some time ago with 5 cups per CF of Granite Meal in 12 gallon pots.

    Ive done well before, of course I have, but this is blowing me away. I had good growth before I added the rock dust, but not to this extent - at least not consistently, 3 weeks into flower. The sheer plant health that I have going on is....hmmm, lets just say I smile alot in my room.

    The rock dust helps/adds in a huge way to bacteria colony size. Theres simply that much more surface area for them to attach/anchor/whatever to. Once they anchor to rock dust in this amount per cf massive amounts of enzymes are secreted by the bacteria. Massize amounts of enzymes equals massive nutrient cycling equals massive amounts of available plant foods released.


    :cool:


    j
     

    Attached Files:

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  12. Truly amazing Jerry!
     
  13. Ps - 3 weeks being the key words here. These were moved upstairs from the veg area August 31st.

    J
     
  14. Quote: Massize amounts of enzymes equals massive nutrient cycling equals massive amounts of available plant foods released.
    -jery111165

    Woohoo jerry :hello:

    I found a very cheap source for granite dust today, and you have definitely convinced me to go pick some up first thing on monday!
     
  15. Jerry your ladies are always a pleasure to look at.
    I cannot say exactly that my rock dust mix is responsible for my young girls growth but i know that they are very much thriving!
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    My very young Pineapple express is doing very well.

    Im not sure exactly what your dust mix is but mine is pretty well pitiful in terms of diversity.
    I have coral as my liming agent
    RSP
    Im also incorporating Basalt
    And harvested these "sea urchin" skeletons
    They looked like this
    [​IMG]
    But they originally looked like this.
    [​IMG]

    If enzymatic production is in the mindset, im sure those will help lots!
     
  16. Very nice SD! Great find with the sea urchin skeletons, I'm sure they will add lots of beneficial minerals. Between sea urchin skeletons, coral, and basalt, it sounds like you have a pretty diverse mix! I'm loving all the "proud papa" pictures :D. I'd like to jump on the bandwagon and show off my babies (even though my girls are much more petite than yall's) but being in an unfriendly state and all...baby steps.
     
  17. [quote name='"InTheGarden"']Very nice SD! Great find with the sea urchin skeletons, I'm sure they will add lots of beneficial minerals. Between sea urchin skeletons, coral, and basalt, it sounds like you have a pretty diverse mix! I'm loving all the "proud papa" pictures :D. I'd like to jump on the bandwagon and show off my babies (even though my girls are much more petite than yall's) but being in an unfriendly state and all...baby steps.[/quote]

    No shame mama.
    Share if you like. Its an invitation, not an obligation.
    Aloha!
     
  18. Fun stuff! Thanks guys and gals, blades and bladies!

    Sean, RSP? Kudos on the basalt! I want some too. I understand its excellent as rock dust.

    Sean, how are you grinding the shells? I'm working on my new heavy duty mortar and pestle, but then I need to come up with a good 200 micron screen - it is my distinct understanding that the dust needs to be the consistency of flour - super duper fine.

    Beautiful plants! Fun stuff isn't it!?

    J
     
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