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Recovering Cancer Patient Need Some Sleep!

Discussion in 'Medical Marijuana Usage and Applications' started by danski09, Mar 7, 2016.

  1. Hey guys

    My step dad is has been having a lot of issues sleeping throughout the night because he's just unable to shut down plus experiences hot flashes throughout the day/night, he's 81 currently and also a recovering cancer patient.

    We've tired sever different things from eatables, oils, joints, cbd pills, etc. After multiple trials and errors we found that the eatable chocolates mixed in with his hot chocolate before going to bed helps him sleep throughout the night but he retains his high when he wakes up in the morning. We ended up lowering the dosage and then found that he couldn't sleep soundly throughout the night.

    We also found that sativa strains help with his hot flashes but does not help him fall asleep.

    Can anyone suggest an alternative that would help ease the hot flashes and help him sleep?
  2. Are you getting your edies from a dispensary
    Maybe look into RSO Oil, its very stong and you need to start off slow
    They will be able to tell you more, explain what you need it to do.
    Best of luck
  3. They also have coconut oil capsules that may be of some help
  4. Currently getting it from people in the industry that we know. We're currently using Caligold THCA+CBD chocolate at 10mg which is two squares. RSO oil is something that might be useful, any suggestions for sativa based strands of RSO oil. We actually haven't tried coconut oil but I'll do some research on it and see what it yields. Thank you for your insight!
  5. Hard to say, but there are people who can tell you better than I can
    That is why I suggest keep doing what you are doing and try to see what works best
    Also ask the caregivers who are supplying you with Meds what would they suggest you try for your Dads condition. Good Luck
  6. #6 PsychedelicSam, Mar 8, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2016
    You definitely don't want Sativas for sleep or for a RSO. The chocolate is high in THCA which is the inactive version of THC and while it doesn't produce psychoactivity, it can cause hyperactivity, anxiety, tachycardia and a number of other physical reactions. Other than that, it does have some health benefits of it's own. However, it's not ideal. CBD needs THC in order to optimize its effects.

    You don't need a lot of THC but it does need to be active. Some THCA is acceptable because decarb varies across the spectrum but you want most of the THC isomers to be THC. And you need not just the CBD but all those other cannabinoids that affect the THC effects like CBG, CBC, CBN, CBDA & others. Most of these other cannabinoids are created by enzymal action caused by the heat of decarboxylation or maturing/curing.

    To be more specific, I believe that you should find a high CBD strain, but a Sativa, that has a CBDA/CBD to THC ratio of about 5:2. It's possible that some of the Sativa traits are helping with those hot flashes so a "Sativa" high CBD should provide enough of those when activated without keeping him awake. Harlequin is a good strain that may work but like all high-CBD strains, it has to be fully mature otherwise it's has more psychoactivity. With high-CBD you need to be confident in the source. Tested dispensaries are good.

    Be careful when you look at those strains. Often the CBD percentage includes CBDA. According to a number of lab tests I've run and a study by the lab, CBD will remain steady while the CBDA and CBGA actually turns into those other cannabinoids I mentioned earlier which play such a large role in the profile of the strain. You will still have a significantly larger amount of CBD.

    Caps, honey, agave nectar or other similar items might be helpful for him, also.

    I've had night sweats since I was a child and the only thing I have ever found that stops it is 2 Indica strains from the Himalaya area, Mazar and Hindu Kushes. I've tried lots of strains and the sweats still come. I don't know if his hot flashes would be the same but it's something to keep in the back of your mind.

    I have a thread over in the edibles section pinned to the top and active. If you want to check it out, here's the link but it's long. Start about half way through or near the end to save your eyes if you do. :)

    Another Tincture Thread....Try It, You'll Like It!
    • Like Like x 3
  7. Thanks Much Sam
    I knew you would know
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Looks like you nailed it
    Hope the OP comes back after all that work
    Appreciate it I do.
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Not everybody has as much time on their hands as we do or even in the same country so I expect they'll be around sooner or later. It wasn't a lot of work. I've cited it so much that I can do it pretty easily. :)
    • Like Like x 1
  10. It will always be here for future seekers of knowledge......
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Thank you so much for your considerate reply and such detailed amount of information.

    The reason we stuck to the Sativa strain was mainly due do its ability to stop his hot flashes throughout the day or at the very least minimize them so that he is able to function. I will try looking into the Harlequin strain and see if any of our contacts currently carry them.

    I'll take a look at your edibles thread once I get a chance to actually sit down a absorb this information properly, don't want to half fast it and stick over things. He enjoys his sweets over smoking but I've been careful because of the potency and effects it has on him.

    Once again thank you Sam and Stiggy!
    • Like Like x 2
  12. The thing I have found with edibles is they don't affect me the same way every time.
    I have the same issue-insomnia. I've eaten something that I bought from the dispensary that knocked my socks off.
    I couldn't see straight or focus and could barely get myself to bed without falling. I got a great night's sleep.

    The next time I ate the exact same thing, with the identical doseage, I felt absolutely nothing. I am not sure if it was because of the difference of the amount of food in my tummy or what. I tend to think it was because I ate them too close together. I screwed up my tolerance. After I ate it the first time, I couldn't get stoned at all. I felt stoned while smoking or dabbing, but 20 minutes late, I was wondering why I wasn't stoned anymore. I think my body was too saturated from the edibles
  13. My solution would be Sativa during the day and an Indica at night. You can make kick ass brownies really easily, thanks to PsySam's info all over the site. Maybe a hybrid would work but I suspect it wouldn't help with the sleep because of the sativa in it. Good luck, being sick sucks ass and I hope you get him feeling better.
    • Like Like x 2
  14. I am a cancer survivor myself and my wife and I were taking care of her father who was 94 when he passed of bladder cancer. He was having a hard time sleeping at night and dealing with end of life cancer pain and the associated mind slowing that comes with it all. Here is what we did for him to keep him comfy as best we could.

    At night when he had a hard time sleeping because of pain and anxiety. I found that edibles worked the best. I could make them as potent as needed and the effect lasted far longer when he ingested it. It also didn't have the same anxiety feelings that he was getting when he smoked ganja or vaped wax or oil. I kept decarbed ganja on hand and would add a teaspoon, semi heaped of ganja to the milk as it warmed in the sauce pan. By the time the hot coco was ready, it was highly medicated. The fats in the whole milk, cream and milk chocolate steep out the good stuff for easier ingestion and quicker onset.

    During the day, when he wanted to take the edge off I would vape with him. In the evenings too, just as long as it wasn't to close to bed time. Bed time and at night in general is when he would get the mental stuff. Sundowners syndrome I think it's called. It happens in varying degrees to the elderly and vaping at night attributed to this highly. That and to much ganja, dosing appropriately is what you are really shooting for.

    When I gave pops just enough, not too much, but just enough he was great. Dosing it correctly for your dad is going to be far better then trying to find that perfect strain. I have my medical card and I must have tried 30 different strains of ganja and wax with my pops and to be honest, it came down to getting the dose just right. I liked the pen vape for concentrates during the day for my pops. It was perfect as far as getting the perfect dose. I showed my pops how to use the pen vape by having him breath through a straw. It helped him to understand the concept of what we were doing. He was also blind so he didn't understand the way some things worked like you and I do.

    I would hit the pen vape loaded with some killer wax of one kind or another, hit it a couple times to get it good and primed for him, then I would put it to his mouth and tell him to breathe like we practiced with the straw. Another reason I hit the pen vape 2 or 3 time prior to my pops hitting it is so that I had a feel for HOW it was hitting. Then I knew when to pull it from his mouth so he would stop hitting it, he would continue to take a medium breath, hold it for 4 or 5 seconds and exhale. Typically very little vapor came out during that exhale, that is the kind of tiny hit he was getting. I did that for a reason. In that way I had micro control over his experience. I would give him 2 or 3 minutes between hits after the first 1 or 2. Again, this was day time medication for the most part and I would only rarely give it to him after the sun was down. At night we would do edibles.

    Edibles at night were magic for my pops. Easy to get it down, pretty fast onset time, incredible pain relieving capacity and it is very easy to make it into a single dose edible if you keep the decarbed ganja on hand. Night times were strained for my pops because of his age and how sick he was. So I needed something that would knock him out for as long as possible with as little after effect as possible. He too didn't like the morning buzz / hang over as he called it. He did learn to live with it and after a few months it wasn't really a problem for him any more.

    The edible I would make pretty much every time was hot coco because I had decarbed ganja on hand, in a small container, in the freezer. Then I would do the following to get it together.
    1) add a semi heaping teaspoon of decarbed ganja and a cup of milk to a sauce pan on a 4 or 5 burner. Letting it go for 5 minutes. It shouldn't boil but will be close. Remember to crush the kernels of decarbed ganja as close to powder and as fine as possible right before they go in.
    2) while the milk is warming add the following, squirt of chocolate syrup to taste, 1 small square of milk chocolate, 1 small square of dark chocolate, 1 small square of caramel. Be mindful of the time the milk and ganja have been warming.
    3) if you were quick enough getting the stuff into the milk in he sauce pan, it all should have melted with in what was left of the initial 5 minutes. If it hasn't melted completely worry not! Because the hot coco sits covered for another 5 minutes with no heat.
    4) so all in all, 5 minutes under a 4 or 5 burner and 5 minutes of sitting covered with no heat, should be more then enough for all of it to be melted together and looking fucking delicious! Give it a good stir to mthe X it all together and serve in a mug over small marshmallows.

    There ya go, 10 minutes to happiness! Well it worked for my pops so hopefully you'll get something good out of it for your elderly family. Oh, and if you're not sure how to decarb ganja it is really simple to do. He is my quick method.
    1) take 1 or 2 grams of killer ganja, the kind you would smoke. Roughly grind it or chop it up. Remember to not go ever board. You want a rough consistency. You could do an eighth this way as well. More even but it's not really necessary at all. A gram of decarbed ganja was anywhere from 4 to 6 doses for my elderly pops, he was 94 when he passed.
    2) put the roughly group / chopped ganja into a foil packet. Think envelope made of aluminum foil. Make it somewhere around 5 inches by 5 inches so it has the surface footage to evenly distribute the heat throughout all of the ganja kernels and pieces. Close up the open end good and tight. Now use the handle of a butter knife to seem each edge of the foil packet, getting it as close to air tight as possible.
    3) put your foil packet into a preheated 220* F oven for 15 or 20 minutes. Every oven is different so be aware that times and heat will vary by each oven. I also added a baking sheet / tray to the oven as it was preheating and actually sat the foil packet with the ganja in it directly onto the preheated baking sheet. This helps quite a bit with shorteni g the time it takes to decarb the ganja in the oven. Heat is the killer to our edibles so every little bit we can cut it down is helpful to some degree.
    4) remove after 15 or 20 minutes and allow the packet and its contents to cool to room temperature. Now you can open the packet. prerly decarbed ganja has the following qualities, it's dry as the desert, smells funky as all hell, looks darker then it originally did. Take a small pinch and feel it. It feels completely dry and more then likely has little oil beads on the little bud kernel. Now smell it. It smells funky like James Browns britches after a night booze, ho's and chitlins. jokes aside, you WILL smell the difference. Now take a closer look at the decarbed ganja, it should be darker. Not burnt, but darker. Green to dark green, brown to darker brown, etc, etc. if it isn't 100% decarbed then put it back on the baking sheet that's in the oven for 5 to 10 minutes more. One you have the exact time and temp needed to decarb ganja in your oven, remember it!
    5) store the decarbed ganja in an air tight container in the fridge or freezer. You could also put it in a dark drawer as well if it will all be used in a week or two. I stored it in an old pill bottle and a small glass mason style jar. Both were air tight. Leave the bud kernals in the pieces that they currently are so they hold th integrity on the psychoactive compounds we are using for their medicinal properties. Just remember to crush the decarbed ganja between two spoons when adding it directly to single dose edibles. It will allow most if not all of the decarbed ganja to dissolve into the hot coco you are making.
    6) the proper dose is important. I found that edibles for my freinds and myself is somewhere between a quarter of a gram and a half of a gram of decarbed ganja. For my pops it was right around half of that, which is like an eighth of a gram of decarbed ganja. Every gram of decarbed ganja was right around 4 to 6 doses and as many as 8 doses. That ended up being right around a semi heaped teaspoon of decarbed ganja. And by teaspoon I mean the kind you eat food with, not the perfect measurement tsp.

    Long post I know, I just hope you get a little something out of it dankski09 because it was hard to find any experience or direction with the elderly and ganja. I mean I didn't know how much to give him, how I should be giving it to him, should I be giving it to him at all?! With that said let me tell you one last thing....there is nothing in the world like watching your pops, who you love dearly, getting the relief he so desperately needs and deserves. And when I say relief, I mean laughing like a braying donkey. I had some pretty amazing times with my pops before he passed and the ganja helped him on many different levels. Just go easy with the ganja to start, keep a log of what you gave him, how much of it you gave him and the time and date you gave it to him. It will help you understand how he is feeling by how often and how much ganja he is using.

    Anyway, good luck and I hope you get the ganja figured out. I think with the right strain, the right dose and the right administration of said ganja and you'll be good to go! :metal:
    • Like Like x 3
  15. I would like to thank everyone for the support and responses to such a delicate matter. Your knowledge will definitely be put to good use! Ajroxit thanbk you so much for your well informed answer! One thing I did lack was keeping a log of what and when he ingests, I will definitely have to pick that up so I can keep a better track of his intake!
    • Like Like x 3
  16. Thanks Guys and dolls I knew the right people would chime in

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