Ramana Maharshi

Welcome Chronic777!!! Thanks for joining us and sharing the quote.

I will just say so that everyone knows, Chronic777 is a chill dude.

 

Maharshi is beautiful and I love him, but I disagree with the teaching of Abiding as the Self, as is in the rest of his lineage's teaching (Ramesh Balsekar, Nisargadatta)

The Self is the Absolute, it is the Source in experience. It is the foundation of Existence and Non-existence, being and non-being, it is the primordial ground of What Is.

But it is not who we are, not entirely. It is the Absolute Truth, and in fact is our Absolute Reality and What we are, but it is not Who we are. Who we are in fact is a subtle and distinct flavor of individuality, the birthed child of the Divine, of the Beloved itself. We exist, certainly, as separate entities - for our separateness is the very cause of our existence, the very thing that allows oneness to be experienced. Without separation there is no oneness, without an experiencer no experience.

To Abide as the Self is a profound and valid approach, but it forgets our relative Reality, the duality within the nonduality, it forgets who it is that reached the absolute. It proclaims "I Am That" and forgets the one who created it itself, taking the position of the Self itself. It is a case of mistaken identity.

Once the absolute state is realized, one feels like one does not exist, that one is dissolved. The experience is so vast, so still, so profound, that it is very easy to say, "I Am That", "I do not exist, only THAT exists", and transfer ones identity and forget oneself. Only peace remains, and occurrences that arise in the primordial ground, nobody seems to remain, all appears causeless, purposeless, perhaps still beautiful, but without an intelligent design, without profound sensitivity, and the dual existence that we were birthed to lead is abandoned, and the beauty of it along with.

We are not born in this beautiful experience within time and space only to return into dissolution into the timeless and forget where we are Here, who we are Here. We are born to experience here and grow here and unfold along with and into the great Mystery. This comes to a stop if one identifies with the Self.

One must, after resting in the absolute, look into the heart to meet ones true identity, realize the profound yet subtle knowing of an intelligent creator, a beloved mother, and fall into the Beloved's embrace while still a soul, and at some level, still a human. Only from this place can meaning and the highest truth and subtle knowing and deep intimacy with the creator of our hearts - the creator of us and all, be experienced. From abidance as the Self this is not possible. Yet the absolute rest, peace, motionlessness, depth, non-separation and solidity of the absolute are abided in, but not dissolved into. To add and compare, not for comparisons sake but for clarity since we are referring to past Masters, this was the exalted realization of various mystics such as Rumi, Rajneesh, Trungpa, amongst others, as 'opposed' to the realizations of beings such as Maharshi, Nisargadatta, Adi Da, and such.

 

The absolute is the energy of the beyond, our energy system links and immerses into the energy of the beyond through the hara, the center of our energy. The heart is the portal to our true identity, to existential love, and the heart of the creator. The self inquiry the maharshi/nisargadatta talk about points to the absolute only.

It is fine if the Absolute Truth is all you wish to acknowledge, not all beings are meant to realize the same, some are meant to know the Absolute Truth and live it exclusively.

You do not feel any issue living your human life because you have not reached the absolute yet. Living a human life in the inside, from the inner perspective of relating (not relationships per say), relating to the wonder and beauty of creation, the wonder of birds and flowers, the wonder of oneself and the subtle touch and caress of the Beloved cannot happen when one dissolves into the Absolute, for the one that can be caressed, the one that can be related to Here and to the mother that created her, is dissolved into Isness, into stillness.

It is very possible to even become nihilistic and completely useless and tired of human existence when stuck and dissolved in the absolute, as is visible by various absolute-state-only realizeers - UG Krishnamurty, Ramesh Balsekar, etc. In extreme cases and a completely closed heart it is even possible to commit suicide in the absolute, for one is beyond creation, beyond phenomenal reality, beyond fear and any sense of self, and yet experiences the hardships and irritations of the human dimension.

Indeed, ultimately, all including the individuality, is an expression of the absolute. You will find various Absolute State realizers such as Balsekar and Nisargadatta responding to this very question with the answer, 'it is the Self acting through this body, there is nobody else here'. However, it remains only a philosophy and not a true experience, similar to someone who has experienced unity on LSD philosophically understanding oneness but not energetically experiencing it. You will find cases like Balsekar where in fact he has been found to grab women students' behinds and such and say, 'it is not me, it is the absolute'. It is simply not true.

It is a subtle paradox, that cannot be grasped, only understood intuitively by the intelligence and subtle knowing of the soul. Duality within oneness, limit within the limitless, separation within unity, like a cup in a river - at once the water of the cup, at once the water of the river, one and separate, separate and one. But when the river is all that is acknowledged, the relative truth of the soul and its distinct individual angle of perception, its relationship with its divine mother, and its subtle wholeness and fulfillment are lost and only peace and silence remain, only the river, the cup that is viewing it identifying with something bigger, when it exists to be something smaller that experiences something bigger. Ultimately, the experience of individuality is lost as one loses oneself as the soul to the mother, but in a far different, far more subtle, far more meaningful, far more blissful way, instead of in just total directionless, meaningless, peaceful way.

 

My perspective on all that Androgenicx is saying is that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make her drink it. To me, mysterious philosophy doesn't really mean much unless the philosophy is one's own. I don't see how anyone not fully attained could KNOW. Hence, it seems to me that Androgenicx claims he knows that which he cannot.

There are people (this is an observation, not an assumption, to characterize ) who feel the need to distinguish. Little do they seem to know, their distinctions arise from a need to one-up. How far can the top be from the bottom? And where would either be without the center?

 

I say nomore but to not assume of my assumption or my state, and to allow this to sit with you and toy with it if and when you do stabilize an experience of the absolute.

 

The absolute as in the absolute experience? What the heck could this be if not that?

Well, I know you've decided not to answer man, but what assumption did I make?

 

I really like the way you articulated that, very beautiful

Androgenicx it was my undestanding that once you've realized what you really are (the absolute) the turiya and individual soul will be much more free to express love/bliss/etc, but from the absolute standpoint those expressions will belong to the turiya, not you.

Anyhow, I hope we all find out what is perceiving all this, good luck friends!

<3 Ramana

 

Is all that is required continued and persistant dabbling in silence? And one day you're suddenly sucked in and the pure consciousness reveals itself?

 

Nothing is required, but the mind would like there to be a requirement so it can find a witty way to get around it. Individuality... as if we're not individual enough already.

 

You know what I mean though , I'm still working on the duality level, so it still feels as though "something" is missing.

Currently it's like this, when I absolutely don't try whatsoever things will just spontaneously happen, etc and sometimes I will know that "I am", I am just silent during these times and know that I exist, and this will last for a little while and then i'll be subtely tricked by my thoughts and forget that I exist, and I'll just go throughout the day cycling through these two. Okay and then in sit down meditation I "try" and hold on to this silent feeling of "I exist", which is ever so nice, but the mind isn't always too pleased with loosing all its concepts and at times will wig out and want to cling to something.

I guess I'm just still waiting for "something" to happen and would like some encouragement that I'm "doing" enough for the shift to occur.

 

Trying to find peace is not peaceful. Not trying is peaceful, but without definition.

 

Unfortunately I don't have much to add in this thread, because I have never looked into the teachings and beleifs of Ramana Maharishi - but from what I have read in this thread I'm going to make it my next learning adventure.

What I would like to say, is welcome Chronic777, its great to have another member here who will be posting in the S&P forum... because it is by far the best one here when the content is right. It seems like you will definitely be another blade who will help righteously shape the content here.

Nice "meeting" you, you seem like a chill blade, and if bkadoctaj says you are, well then you must be

also, I'm not sure if I ever want a tattoo, but i have decided that if i do ever get one, its going to be your avatar

 

"it is futile to search for it in books. There will come a time when one will have to forget all that one has learned" (& trust in your own true nature which you can not learn)

thats something i pretty much have come to the conclusion of on my own this past month or so. I'll still continue to read - but that was one huge revelation i've had this past month.

"offer yourself up unconditionally to the power that is your own source"
thats another revelation i've had, but i've had a hard time acting on it - though i guess from how i've looked at it "my own source" could be looked at a few different ways. Ill start looking into Ramana today when i have some more time, i bet he has a better answer to that that my own

and nice, on that tattoo... is it just black?
I'm pretty sure im going to get one, but im still mulling it over (as i have been for the past half year lol). I was thinking my left shoulder blade, actually, so pretty similar. us two standing next to eachother would make a cool picture if i got it haha