Question to Statists: How is Taxation Not Theft?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Mr.Deez, Dec 1, 2011.

  1. u morons you have to have some taxes in this day and age. u guys know what would happen if no one had to pay taxes? shit would collapse idiots.

  2. Yea idiots, without the government we would revert to the stone ages. Government's the only reason anything is good. Morons...

  3. There's only one road to your house. What if you are unhappy with the private business who's maintaining YOUR road? What if they don't do a satisfactory job? Are you going to stop using it? Stop paying for it?
  4. #64 hoboleader, Dec 3, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 3, 2011

    ill say this, the federal pell grant saved my life from being complete shit.

    my disabled mom that raised 4 kids by herself is living off your tax dollars. why dont you tell her to piss up a rope for surviving off money the government stole.
  5. I'm not going back and reviewing the argument made by others so sorry if this is a repeat.

    You have to ask yourself, why was the pell grant so instrumental in saving your life? Why was it you needed it in the first place?

    The answer is because it was prohibitively expensive for you to go to school. without Pell grant you wouldn't have been able to afford it.

    Now what if access to school wasn't so hard? What if schools had to compete for students, rather than student having to compete for schools? What if you did not need the competitive edge of the Pell Grant blessing to get into school?

    This is the situation libertarians want. We firmly believe that the free market will provide for affordable education, and chances are, with the government not stealing from you, you could invest the money that would have been taxed into your eduation. I don't know about you, but id have enough to cover my community college costs if i were not being taxed like i am now, and that's with the currently inflated rates which would likely come down via competition.
  6. I also want to point out an argument i have seen made a couple times.

    I see arguments made against libertarians for being hypocrites when they accept government help.

    The people making these claims are forgetting that even thought we believe in doing things a different way, we still live in a system of society in which these government programs give a competitive edge to those people willing to use them. Not taking advantages of these competitive edges based on principle is shooting ones self in the foot so to speak. We are already being stolen from, therefore we would simply be denying ourselves the minimal benefit that we are already paying for.

    Even thought we benefit from these things we know its not the right way to go about organizing society, and we are willing to risk losing the small benefits we are currently getting to make things right.

    The real hypocrites are the people that know what we are saying is true, but out of fear for losing these benefits ( which they have grown to rely on) they deny what they know to be logical reasoning, in favor for the ideology that best serves their reliance on these programs.
  7. If it's my road, then I would be the one maintaining it.

    Assuming it's not my road, then I would probably be pretty familiar with the owner considering it's the road that I use to get to and from my place of residence. I would sign a contract with them upon acquiring my residence that included a clause (or clauses) about satisfactory maintenance of the road.

    So, to answer your question(s) clearly:

    If I was unhappy with the business maintaining the road that I needed to use to get to & from my house, I would implore him to uphold his end of the contract I signed upon acquiring my place of residence. This contract would include a clause (or clauses) regarding satisfactory maintenance of the road. If they stopped doing a satisfactory job, violated said contract and refused to rectify the problem to my liking, I would probably enter into a dispute with them and seek the counsel of a court/arbitration service.

    Any of these 'what ifs' can be taken care of by legitimate (voluntary) contracts.
  8. r u 4 srs?
  9. taxes = franchise fee
    America = franchise
    government = board of directors
    earners/tax payers = franchisee
    voters = shareholders (owners)

    If you need a business-framed justification for taxes there it is.
  10. Indeed, well put.

    Taxes is the fee you pay to be a part of your particular (national) club. If you want to work or do business within that "club" you must pay the fee.

    But ofcourse, I think that fee could be handled more efficiently :)
  11. What businesses (that aren't 'governments') have their own court system, military & a monopolies on currency & violence?

    What clubs control millions of square miles of land and imprison thousands of people?
  12. Businesses hire private security all the time.

    and if there was no government, businesses would privatize the military and justice system the same way they privatized much of the prison system
  13. How would an anarcho-capitalist society deal with nuclear weapons? o_O

  14. This makes the assumption that you have the bargaining power as an individual to create a mutually beneficial contract. How much are you willing to pay for a road that goes to your home?
  15. First off, Walter Block wrote a whole book on the subject of free market roads. If you're so interested, why don't you take a look.

    As to your question, I don't know the market price of roads because the market for roads is monopolized. I'm willing to pay quite a bit, but something tells me I won't have to.

    I thought this thread was about taxes. How much of my income goes towards paying taxes? How much of your income goes towards taxes every year? Do you think the government is efficient with our tax dollars? Do you think that increasing prices (read: inflation of the US dollar in the past 40 years) are harder for the poorest sections of the population to endure or the richest? Governments literally create poverty and then, on top of it, they extort money from productive members of society.

    You're holding water for a criminal institution at least partly because you feel you (and the people you care about) have something to gain. It's a sick society.
  16. While that is sad to hear, in many societies the family would take care of her.
  17. #78 mbfm, Dec 3, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 3, 2011
    lmfao if schools had to compete for students they would accept any student that could afford to pay. and that's how you degrade the quality of education.

    because their interest would shift from public service to profit maximization.

    that is why princeton is a better school than ITT tech

  18. which is why many societies are not as rich as the united states.

    isn't it funny how rich countries also have welfare that are proportional to their wealth.
  19. and in many societies she and her children would've suffered a great deal due to poverty.

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