Possible Over Water and Fert..PICS INCLUDED!!!

Discussion in 'Sick Plants and Problems' started by GTMan2010, May 24, 2010.

  1. Alright guys here's my specs

    Strain: Clones of unknown type
    lighting type: SIDE: 2 4"T-5 panels TOP:CFL. 6x23 2x42 1x68 in a pvc rectangular hood.
    lighting timing: 24/7
    lighting height from plants: top 1-2 inches, side 3-4 inches
    vent method:open doors and small fan
    grow method: soil, root organics no additives
    grow mode: normal
    nute/fert brand: Advanced Hydroponics Grow/Bloom/Micro
    nute/fert mix:Grow/Bloom/Micro
    nute/fert additives:None
    medium/soil type:Root Organics
    medium/soil quantity per plant:3 or 4 gallon
    water source: Bottled Water or tap water depending on if I have Bottled.
    water quality:Do not know
    water amount per plant Water when soil was dry to 4" deep...Read Post
    (soil/non hydro): frequency: About every couple days, then I fert'd 2 times in a row.
    flushing interval:3 days ago
    reservoir change interval(hydro): N/A
    plant age: 62 days
    Ph fresh nutes/ferts: Ph of 6-6.5
    PPM fresh nutes/ferts:Do Not Know
    Ph spent nutes/ferts**:Drainage 6.1-6.3
    PPM spent nutes/ferts**:Do Not Know
    Temp "day":no higher than 82
    Temp "night":24/7 no night but temps never get lower than 65
    Relative humidity "day":* Do Not Know but outside humidity is 50-75%
    Relative Humidity "night":* Do Not Know but outside 50-75%

    And the story:

    I had some very nicely growing plants, both were very dark green and with very tight internode spacing, bushy queens with perky tops and arms. he main stem was very thick and stable and supported the plant well. My lighting setup is fabulous and is providing a large amount 38,000 lumens, 360 actual watts of flourescent lighting both 64k and lower 27k color spectrum spread over the tops and 2" 4 bulb T-5 panels on 2 sides of two plants, about 5 square feet total. So its surrounded by flourescent light!

    My medium is Root Organics un-aided, I had been watering my plants as needed every 3 or so days fluctuating between bottled water, and tap water, sometimes Ph'd and sometimes not. I was fertilizing every other time with a mild to medium (according to bottle) strength nutes, Ph'd of course to 6.2 to 6.5. Into week 6 I started to spray at a mild strength, the nutes onto the leaves for foliar feeding twice a week but then held off on watering them as I was not home much... so I think I under watered them this week..

    Into week 7 for some reason I watered with %75 strength nutes by mixing up 2 gallons of water and adding in nutes and then adjusting the Ph to 5.8 +/- .2, I watered each plant with a half liter of water and saved the rest in two liter bottles and over the next two days I poured in the rest that was left, I did this thinking they needed it as the soil was so dry one day, like bone dry. I also foliar fed them 3 days in a row too. At the end of week 7 I noticed a few of the bottom leaves start to turn yellow and some of the overall leaves were yellowing at the the very tips of them and ALL the leaves were very very droopy, clawed under and were looking very sad.

    At the beginning of week 8 (this week) Sunday, I put them into my bath tub and I filled the tub with tap water and then drained it 3 times in a row to flush them thinking they were over nuted. I let them rest 24 hours and they were still looking bad so I flushed them again this time pouring Ph'd bottled water 4 Gallons through one at a time so that it would drain out the bottom. The drainage Ph was slowly falling from 6.8 to eventually 6.2 as I went, testing from each gallon I Poured into them by collecting a small portion of the first drops that came out.

    I then let them rest 1.5 days. They were continuing to yellow and look bad so I pulled them out of the pots to check and they looked slightly root bound but the roots were very bright white, and beautiful, all spread out and no bad smell, slime, or rot at all. So I repotted them into larger pots (their final size pots) 3.5 gallon sized pots.

    Part of the repotting involved sprinkling root hormone powder lightly into the hole I dug into the new soil filled pot to aid in root growth into the new medium. I had done this 2 previous repots and they seemed to LOVE it so I did it for this repotting. And then I set in the plant and then lightly watered the whole plant/soil to settle the soil and plant into the newly potted pot, and to wet the rooting powder inside the hole.

    Then I let them rest 3 days and here we are today. Plants still look the same and the leaves that were yellowing are getting slightly worse, and some others are starting to yellow, all the leaves are dooopy and clawing, but mostly they are dark green, a healthy looking green. The new growth is bright green and clawed, some of the leaves are curling and twisting and I am worried.

    Here are the pics of the drooping:

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Pics of the tops of the plants:

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Here are some pics of the leaves I cut off the plant and laid them out in order of progression of yellowing.

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    And Finally pics of my lighting setup

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    So I hope I have left enough detailed information to assist in diagnosing what has happened to my plants. everything was going so well and then BAM. So any advice, suggestions or really ANYTHING reply!
    Please any old pros out there care to lend a hand/word I'd sure appreciate it!

  2. #2 Antigen, May 26, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: May 26, 2010
    You want to keep your pH at 6.5-6.8. If you drop below 6.5, you will start locking out nutrients, like Magnesium. Dark green veins with light green in between is a good sign of Magnesium lockout/deficiency. Make sure you pH your water after you add nutes or anything else that might change the pH. Your plant won't like it if you are giving it wildly different pH'd waters (if you don't check it sometimes, especieally if you add nutes and don't bring pH back up).

    Flushing is the correct way to fix this, so it's good that you did that. Just make sure you use 6.5-6.8 water, and err on the high side rather than the low side if you can't measure that accurately. Also remember that the damage may continue for a bit even after you fix the problem, but as long as it doesn't get really bad or affect the new growth you should be OK.
  3. I agree. Your plants have the claw. You can't fix anything until you flush with water 6.5-6.8. Flush with 5-6gal. Then wait for at least 2 days before doing anything else.
  4. Ok guys here is a pretty big update of what I did today.

    It's now ummm 11 days since I flushed my babies and the pots are completely dry to almost the very bottom. My small plant is looking great, but the large one is still fighting but gettin' there.

    The big plant's leaves are a bit curled, twisted and browning at some of the tips, some leaves have yellowing that is turning into brown spots in the middle of the yellowing. Some of the tips are browning at the very tip and some of the leaves are showing nutrient lock out or nutrient movement issues. I am thinking now I have a Ph problem preventing proper absorbtion of nutrients.

    At 9:00 am I decided to add some Ph'd water to my large plant. I did and noticed the run off was 5.1!! So since it's been 11 days since I watered last and that was a flush....I have to flush again to fix the Ph. issue...

    So I flushed with the following 5 gallons of Ph'd water about a liter at a time and here are the results of the runoff...

    1st 6.3 ----5.7
    2nd 6.5 ----5.4
    3rd 6.5 ----5.2
    4th 6.5 ----5.3
    5th 6.5 ----5.6
    6th 6.5 ----5.4

    I was concerned the runoff was still so low so I upped my Ph of water going in

    7th 7.6 ----5.6
    8th 7.6 ----5.7
    9th 7.6 ----5.7
    10th7.6 ----5.8
    11th 8.0 ----6.0

    I stopped here because I had flushed so much water that I wanted to post and see what the community had to say about this ? I can't seem to get the Ph up to a reasonable level without putting in HIGH Ph wanter...

    What am I supposed to do?

    I also have some pics to show my plant that I am concerned about...

    Pics Immediately after flushing..


    And here are the shots of the plant 12 hours later after flushing this morning..

    Side Shot






    Pics showing the yellowing and browning.


    So there ya go. I thinks it's a Ph issue being too low. I tried to fix the Ph but was only able to get it to 6.0.

    Please! I need advice and assistance. What should I do?
  5. I just opened up the bag of dolomite lime and sprinkled in 3 table spoons and mixed in the top 4 inches of soil.

    I watered and flushed in 3 gallons of Ph 7.0 water and took pH samples on the way.

    Going in ---- drainage...

    let it rest for 10 minutes

    7.0----6.1 fluctuating to 6.2

    I am happy now knowing I have something in the soil to help buffer the soil.I stopped here to let the powdered dolomite lime sink in and do it's job

    So now I a feel much more confident about my pH problem. I unfortunately did not add in any nutes, I figured I would solve one piece of the puzzle first then the next...So I will Probably have to wait 4-7 days or so till I water again and add nutes then. I am not going to add any nutes till next week or if/when told it is safe to do so.

    I am so happy I am getting this pH issue taken care of!

    Oh yeah! While at the hydro shop they had a new product in called Exhale CO2 bags. a bag of soil inoculated with a fungus that generates CO2 as it grown in the soil, supposed to help increase CO2 levels in a small grow space. It was relatively cheap, only $15 so I bought one and hung it up in the grow space since my space is contained and almost air tight figured more CO2 couldn't hurt. Has anyone used these before?

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