Pastor's free speech struck down by courts

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Dronetek, Apr 24, 2011.

  1. Pastor Terry Jones released from custody after his bond is posted

    So, what does this mean. It means that the courts have now set precedence for carting you off to jail if the people you protest decide to commit violent acts. Seems pretty backwards eh? That's because it is. Its EXACTLY what the Islamic extremists wanted.

    Terry Jones goes free on $1 bond after jailing; judge bars him from mosque for 3 years | Detroit Free Press | freep.com


    Hmm, thats interesting. Sounds a lot like the Skokie Ruling.


    So, a state can criminalize speech that incite violence, but its meant to be applied to someone actually telling his flock to go out and commit acts of violence.

    Allahpundit at Hotair broke it down really well:

    Detroit jury finds Terry Jones guilty of breach of peace for attempted protest outside Islamic center « Hot Air

    Why don't we all just convert to Islam now and get it over with?
     
  2. i wouldn't limit it to just part of islamic terrorist goals...look within our own government as well..plenty of groups flushing the constitution down the crapper today

    there are some americans, even vets, that think your rights should be limited to what THEY decide is ok (flush) ...how patriotic is that?

    can't allow someone to say things against the state...but that pesky 'freedom of speech' gets in the way, so lets use the excuse of 'it may cause those being protested against, to lash out with violence' (...but will it work when the KKK tries to use this precedence...) or spout off that they are un-american and not patriotic (because they have a different opinion...FLUSH).

    Why not arrest those that start the violence? Is it bad to arrest someone being violent now, because of their religion, so revoke freedom of speech instead? (flush flush flush..)










    ...so stop posting things I may agree with dammit! I might have a free thought... ;)
     
  3. The man has a job, abusing his free speech for a living.


    They went to jail for refusing a 1 dollar bond, which after being jailed they paid?

    Thank god we have people protesting this idiot.;)


    Or better still, why don't we just re-write the Constitution, and omit the allowances for churches to remain tax-free spreaders of bullshit?

    Two wrong ideas, make a right wing?:D


    Accidentally discharged? Or was he just too stupid to have the safety on?

    Because, see, negligence is no accident, it is idiocy in practice.
     
  4. There are limits on free speech.

    What he does is like going into a crowded theater and screaming that there is a fire and causing a panicked stampede. He not only expects violent and angry reactions but he thrives on them. He is intentionally trying to incite violence and disturb the peace.

    If he was on TV he could blabber all he wants and not risk being charged with a crime. But he knows that if he travels to funerals/churches/etc he can incite anger and retribution and "prove his point" to the world.

    Think about that type of situation:

    You are a cop. There is a church full of 60 angry people and there is 1 guy standing there yelling at them, telling them they are evil, etc. and causing all the trouble. What is the solution? You arrest the motherfucker for disturbing the peace before it turns into a bloody riot.
     
  5. #5 Dronetek, Apr 24, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 24, 2011
    No, its not. Yelling fire in a theater is you causing direct action through your words. Whats happening here is a man protesting Islam and then followers of Islam making the choice to inflict violence. If the pastor was outright telling people to go cause violence, you might have a point.

    You would know this if you took the time to think through what you said and not just repeat what others have told you. If I go kill someone because I didn't like something you said, people wouldn't then blame you right? Use your head. This isn't even complicated stuff. :rolleyes:

    http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local..._fired_from_his_job_after_ground_zero_pr.html
    Huh? You act as if Muslims have no free thought or choice. That somehow this pastor controls what they do.

    You could say that about ANY protest! People like you really bother me and make me realize how important it is to stay vigilant for people like you who would dictate what people can and cant say.

    So basically you think that nobody should be able to protest anything that causes the bad guys to kill people. Don't fight crime, because it angers the criminals. Don't fight against racism, because it angers the racists. In your world, anyone that decides to cause violence in response to peaceful protests should be bowed down to.

    Argh! This is such simple stuff! Why don't you get it???

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
     
  6. #6 Fëanor, Apr 24, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 24, 2011
    You don't have to instruct people exactly what to do to incite action. Imagine if a KKK member in full costume walked into a southern Baptist church full of black people and yelled "N!ggers!"

    He did not tell them to do anything but do you think the reaction will be peaceful? Of course not.

    Who told me what? You don't know what you're talking about; trust me I come up with this stuff all on my own ;)

    If his words bring people to violence those people are still responsible for the violence, but he is responsible for his words. Is that really too complicated for ya?

    You can't sit back and pretend that words are meaningless. They cause action and Terry Jones knows it even if you don't.

    Where do you get that from? I'm saying that he knows how to push people's buttons and that's what he is doing. Whereas you are acting as if he is some innocent guy, just saying what he says. I'm simply saying that these are calculated actions meant to cause an uproar.

    Learn to read; I don't want to dictate what the guy says, but I recognize that there is a time and place for everything. As I said if he was saying everything on TV it would be fine. Or if he posted blogs online, Tweeted, put it on his Facebook, wrote a book, published a newspaper, put up billboards, spoke at the City Council, whatever. I'd be fine with all of that. But the way he goes about thing is to make personal, intrusive attacks against the people he dislikes. There is a difference between speaking freely and showing up at personal events to attack people while you dance back/forth on the limits of the law and how far away you're allowed to be.
     
  7. #7 cball, Apr 24, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 24, 2011

    thank DOG they don't allow hate based protest ! ! ! :hello:

    ***cough cough***
    Westboro Baptist Church - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia :(

    Limits should make sense, the intent has to taken into account (like you said, screaming fire when there isn't one, people panic and get hurt...and the offender KNOWS IT)

    The problem I have with the topic here, is it is exclusive to protect some, not all.:cool:

    I think that if they stop him from his protest, then they should stop Westboro too :devious:
     
  8. I bet the mosque leaders have received 10x the amount of threats that pastor has.

    It's like that everywhere in the country.
     

  9. I think they have done that a few times...can't recall where though :confused: (off to google)
     
  10. Somehow I doubt it, since the MSM is aligned against the "pastor". Even so.....

    AFP: Blacks, Jews most likely victim of US hate crimes: FBI
     
  11. No, but if someone carries those paintings and walks up to a Christian church and starts hollering that the pastor is a used condom and shoving the paintings in the faces of everyone and causing a disturbance, they should be stopped.

    There is a time and a place for everything. Once you grasp that concept everything will make much more sense to you.
     
  12. I respect that guy Terry Jones, who wouldn't.

    Promoting such a worthy WORTHY cause, something that brings the whole world together and our bitch ass court system took away his rights because he's such a consistent altruist. Haters gonna hate, though.

    Me, y'know, I'm just trying to finish college, become a licensed engineer and maybe build some free generators for the lower class and what not. But after watching this documentary about him my whole damn life changed and that's when I realized you don't even have to be a little smart to change the world, religious trolling can get you anywhere in today's society.
     
  13. What was the protest about?
     
  14. Against the building of a mosque.

    Freedom of religion is only for christians.
     
  15. Freedom of speech/expression is either absolute or it doesn't exist. Period.
    However if he's the kind of ignorant douchebag that burns books I really don't give a shit what happens to him.
     
  16. I agree to an extent.
    Why do they have to protest right outside the mosque though?
     
  17. Because that's what freedom of expression composes of, things you disagree with as well as things you do.

    I think they should be allowed to protest but I don't believe tey should be given protection from the angry mob that will form,same with everyone.
     
  18. gawd and jeebus help me, i agree with gedio.

    if we want the best of speech protected we must also protect the worst. i think the guy is a douche-bag, but i will defend his right to be the biggest douche bag around. if people don't like what he (or for that matter any hate group) is preaching, i have a simple solution for them: don't fucking listen to him. it is that easy.

    i don't even like the fact that the court prevents "speech that incites violence" i say punish the person who commits the violence. just because i say that somebody should be killed doesn't mean that i am responsible when somebody listens to me. speaking your mind (even if you are a fucking idiot) should NEVER be illegal
     

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