Organic Magnesium

Discussion in 'Growing Organic Marijuana' started by genghiskgro, Jun 11, 2013.

  1. Hey GC,
    Just wanted to say howdy and if you could give me some insight into possible remedies for this problem.
    Recently noticed that might plants were just looking a bit lack luster and a magnesium deficiency reared its head and it has gotten pretty bad.
    Since doing organics I did not want to switch over to Botanicare nutrient regiment to resolve problem but also didn't think my soil would still have acidic hot spots because I had it cycling for quite a bit of time.
    --First question If I keep doing foliar, and soil drench with the epsom salt is that something that i have to just keep doing throughout the rest of the grow now or do you think ph will stabilize through the use of the epsom salts?
    --Second question the second mix i started I added the yogurt by product of the fermented Lacto B into the compost pile so I'm wondering do you guys think that I may not run into this problem next grow round, I'm kind of starting to think that my ratios weren't the best that they could have been but I'm still working out the kinks.
    --Also thought of making another mix just wanted to know what you guys thought of it:
    1/3 coco coir
    1/3 EWC
    1/3 Perlite/Vermiculite 
    1 cups of Epsoma Plant tone
    2 cups of Epsoma Green Sand
    2 cups of Azomite
    1 Cup of Kelp meal
    1 cup of Garden lime
    Any advice appreciated.
    Happy Growing

  2. Any possibility of having access to a tea brewer or making one yourself?  Try some ewc slurries the girls will probably turn around.
  3. #3 genghiskgro, Jun 11, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 11, 2013
    Currently just aerating my teas using an aquarium pump with two hoses with a rock set atop of the airstone, most recent one brewed up was:
    2 handfuls of EWCS
    1 tsp of BSM
    2 tsps of Kelp meal
    Bunch of Dandelions
    Couple crowns of lemon balm
    Brewed for 15 hours in about 90 degrees then applied.
    Quick question though how come EWC slurrys are effective because the other night top feed with about a tablespoon each of kelp meal to both the girls just haven't drenched them yet with water going to water in a few days, was just going to keep doing epsom foliar feed every other day or so.
    I ask about the EWC slurrys because i have heard and read a lot on these threads about them and i suppose aside from having benefical microbes I was just curious as to why it was so effective in turning my babies around because this is my first grow round organically so I'm glad the problem is happening but also want to resolve it before flower ya dig. But i didn't think as far as traditional NPK it was all that effective if having a little bit of soluble nitrogen. And or do you think it would be ineffective to use the 1 gallon that i mixed up a tablespoon of epsom salts into and throw some ewc castings in there for the next drench i give.
    Thanks for the reply so quickly
    Happy growing
  4. Maybe try a tea and add a little lime to it as the very end, just before you pour up!
    Could just be that your girls don't like the foliar treatment as well! Do you wash the leaves off after you foliar?
    I use high cal lime as well, so maybe you wanna get some of that or dolomite rather than garden lime.
    It's garden lime the fact acting sort? Pardon me if you have dolomite already.
    And the soil mix looks ok.
    I would go 2cups kelp meal vs. 1 cup azomite!
    Also, where is your Phosphorus source? I use Hi-P Bat Guano.
    I'd also add some legit rock dust! I'm a compost over coir guy, so I'm not sure how that'll do ya, but good luck!
  5. #5 genghiskgro, Jun 11, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 11, 2013
    Thanks man yeah i was a little skeptical going about buying that garden lime but it was 2 dollars for a 40 lbs bag, and at that point in my organic adventure didn't even think about substitution as far as liming agents, was just kind of following the beginners Itinerary :[ I guess you don't know till you know ya know
    Few questions then:
    --One why would you say more foodstock VS living space
    --Two how come you say adding the dolomite or lime right before application, just didn't want to throw another tea up there because i thought my problem could be ph stabilization because the first watering i ever gave I started with a foliar of just molasses and i think it kind of threw the girls off from the beginning.
    -- As far as phosphorus I was kind of thinking the the plant tone and kelp meal had me covered but if not I was in the process of brewing up some of GIl's Calphos, FPE of dandelion, and the home brewed Hydrolysate so in future grows I might be covered but as of right now just kind of left with what i got, which is questions lol.
    And as far as a foliar the only thing i have ever hit them with is the Drammatik K fish/kelp extract which might have been a little strong but since then, aside from last night with the epsom salt foliar I have not fed them anything but regular distilled water through foliar means
  6. Luckily I picked the right lime when I started out haha.
    But to answers your questions, It's not that you necessarily need more foodstock, it's more so that I don't see an amendment for adding the Phosphorus you need. P is not only needed during flower, but also during veg for for root development.
    Ans kelp meal doubles as an amendment for nutritional value as well as mineralization given the fact that its laden with trace minerals and vitamins and growth homorones.
    For your second ?, I suggested adding some lime right before you pour the ACT because I've done it and my plants have responded well, and its a way to get some cal/mg to your plants right away. Don't wanna add it initially bcuz I don't have a microscope to see what it does in the brewing process, so I just stick with what I know works which is the recipes from
    The soil living soil is meant to work with the pH of everything that you add tho, and keep it constant
    But I hit my girls with some aloe a few days ago and they did NOT like it. I got a little spotting on the leaves afterwards, so I know to go back to the books on the recipe I used!
    But you don't have to feed the soil so much with teas and what not.
    I feel like you should add very little of anything when you do bcuz this stuff accumulates, and one thing I've read about coir is that salts accumulate really easy in it. I wouldn't know tho, as my mixed is maybe 30-50% compost when most ppl go 25
  7. #7 genghiskgro, Jun 11, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 11, 2013
    Thanks for the responses International Green I will give the lime a try with the next tea i brew, probably gonna pick up some dolomite lime though because i can't get my hands on any crab meal or lobster meal, but I will keep you posted on developments.
    But as it is do you think adding the epsom is the best route to take as of right now for the current deficiency showing?
    Thanks in advance
    Happy growing
  8. Some epsom salt
  9. Thanks mill,
    Assuming i use the epsom salts do I just need to use it till the problem is resolved or the rest of the duration of the grow or from the duration of time used it should buffer ph and then not have to use anymore dumb question i know but just making sure.
    Happy Growing 
  10. Never had to add any Epsom salt brother, but I see or read about it all the times, so sure you could you use!
    Molasses is also good on Cal/Mg so if your brewing balanced teas your supplementing it already!
    Def wanna use it in moderation as your adding salt to your soil eco system. Seems to me the pH might be touched by it....
    But I can't tell you if it's the best thing for you to do brother...I'd say just keep things as simple as possible and experiment with things one at a time so that you can isolate the variable in your experiments.
    Could be other things that your doing you know?!
  11. You're right - a castings slurry isn't a heavy "NPK" hitter - but it will ensure microbial activity to make the nutrients that you do have available.

    Quality vermicompost is ALWAYS the answer.

  12. sul po mag - leingbenite - sulfate of potash, magnesia
    It's what I use, or if u have some around, Epsom Salts (Sulfer and Magnesium) should work well too; just dissolve it in somewhat warm water when mixing.
  13. #13 genghiskgro, Jun 12, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 12, 2013
    Thanks to all of you for the quick and helpful replies, I'm gonna check on the babies tonight so I'll post an update see if the epsom foliar i gave the other night helped at all.
    And side note just wanted to know what you guys thought of the girls though sans the defect. recently topped about a week ago or so trying to get the 4 main colas on both plants.
    Thanks and happy growing
  14. Did you top just above the 2nd true node?! That's the secret to the four mains! Might leave you with your uglier leaves for a bit but the end product of that method is spectacular!
    Hope everything sorts itself out for ya brother.
    Godd luck!
  15. Sprinkle some around the plant and water it or mix some in the water, warm preferred probably. Idk much more than that ;)
    Good luck!
  16. And the outcome was??

    Hope all is well bud
  17. #17 genghiskgro, Jun 14, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 14, 2013
    --Been swamped working all the time pistol pete , but when I see them next time, I'll definitely post an update I can see I'm not the only one who cares about these babies now  :ey:  
    --But hoping that there are some positive developments just a little scared to do an epsom drench, because I have been working hard on making my soil happy that I do not really want salt in there throwing off the eco system.
    --Just in the process of making fish hydrolysates today, but i haven't added the 1 to 2 tbsp of LAB yet, can it be added in at any point just as long as its there, and it is already making layers of different sediments and i just wanted to know if that was normal because are we just going off of the normal bubbles at the top cause I'm just thinking that is from adding molasses into the blender, but I do understand it has to sit for almost a month. 
    Happy growing update soon to see if I can kick whatever the problem is with the girls...
  18. I tried and epsom drench on my Bubba Kush(as it's now an experimental plant) and it didn't show any bad effects brother.
    Also did a foliar with it just to see how it worked, and I didn't really notice a difference yet, but certainly didnt have an issue.
    I used 1tbsp/gal. I dissolved it in hot water first than added the solution to a gallon of water.
    If my bubba kush continues to grow fine, I'll probably try it as a drench! We'll see
  19. #19 genghiskgro, Jun 18, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 18, 2013
    Whats up green,
    Finally got to check on the babies and they are still looking kind of deficient, you can't really see it in the pictures but its there, I think it might have just been kind of a complete lockout due to ph buffer from those teas because I was not adding in proper ratio's(didn't really think at the time it mattered) and by my ratios I just mean WAY too much molasses. But overall though i think the epsom drench helped quite a bit the new growth looks very green but the old is way to damaged to bounce back i feel like, plus a few of the foliars were not done at the most appropriate times, but i was working with the free time i had,  and we all know that patience is a virtue but times a motherfucker..
    --  I just recently started to aerate about 5 gallons of water and threw in a nice amount of EWC, keep in mind this is bagged EWC, wanted to start a nice slurry for the girls, plus I was going to pick up some dolomite lime to add in right before application, I wanna see if the PH buffering plus the quick absorption of cal/mg has any positive effects. 
    ---First question is there a point of adding to much EWC because i top dressed to aside from the ewc put into the AACT, it was what was left in the bag but i thought maybe putting another layer of mulch atop the top might help,
    ---Second question I just recently finished brewing up some Dandelion FPE, or slurry and strained and got the liquid but was a little skeptical to use it because it smelt like straight swampy ass. But do you think it would hurt to add 2 tsp/ gal I just figured adding in Iron and other dynamically accumulated minerals that the dandelion got might not have been the best idea to throw on aside from the boost of micbroes, at this time anyways assuming it is a lockout from acidic soil.
    --- I wanted to add a foodstock to add to the AACT brewing right now but have nothing more then kelp meal, plant tone epsoma, vermiculite, and unfinished hydrolysates, because i didn't want to add in more molasses assuming the molasses threw it off in the first place.
    ---And last question if you know about anything in regards to homebrewed hydrolysates, I only used the fish head to make it and it was a half a pound fish some im gonna assume the head didn't weigh all that much but the mixture isn't bubbling anymore and doesn't have a foul smell do you think i would be okay to add that in to the tea as well, 
    I'm sorry for throwing a bunch of questions out there just I'm falling in love with falling into this rabbit hole...
    Thanks for the input and happy growing
    May not be bud porn yet but its getting there slowly  8)

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  20. And I am at a toss up, do you think i should trellis or go scrog net assuming I keep topping before flower, I have some bamboo stakes but they are really scrawny and can't reach the top of the plant as it is, so i figured maybe time investing into other ideas ya dig?
    But happy growing

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