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Discussion in 'Religion, Beliefs and Spirituality' started by esseff, Dec 20, 2012.

  1. #81 thoughtware, Jan 11, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 12, 2013
    I'm not exactly sure why I am here today. I have a desire to write something, but not sure what. We can discover what that will be together - as the writer writes and the reader reads. I trust by the end, all will be a cohesive message.

    I am understanding more and more the power of thought. And the words born of those thoughts. Our understandingcreates the perception of our lives - while our words give birth to the reality that reflects this perception.

    Because mankind does not understand this, he is kept in a prison of ever increasing oppression. It is the reality created by the mind of man, in a flesh body, existing in the context of TIME - which maintains this prison. I want to explain a bit about this today.

    A flesh body aborbs it's "wisdom" from that which it can SEE, HEAR, TOUCH, TASTE and SMELL. The flesh body is "sensual" - because it manufactures "wisdom" by its senses. This concept is very important, and we'll revisit it after we understand the following.

    A flesh body's reality always reflects TWO different things. First, it reflects a unique array of sensual stimuli that is absorbed into the mind, and later manufactured into "wisdom". These are the reflections of the flesh body's reality perceived by the SENSES (sight, hearing, taste, touch, smell). Secondly, the flesh body's reality ALSO reflects back - "feelings" or "emotions". These are perceptions of reality aborbed by things OTHER than the senses.

    The flesh body navigates reality by its senses - (rather than emotion) and therefore elevates "sensual perception" to its highest level of "wisdom". Meaning, that if one navigates though the world by "sensory understanding" - one will do all he can to increase this understanding. Saying it another way, if reality reflects back both "sensual information" and "emotional" stimuli, the one used to NAVIGATE through reality (senses) is chosen above the other (emotion) because one is deemed "dominant", the other weak.

    Now, back to the concept of the flesh body manufacturing wisdom by its senses. Wisdom is always created by the reflection (understanding) of your current reality. How else could you learn? As you experience and process your current reality, you learn. As you learn, your understanding increases. As you understanding increases, so too does the way you perceive your reality. Thus, we can see that as wisdom grows, so too does the understanding of our current reality. The greater the wisdom, the better our current reality. Makes sense, doesn't it?

    But, let us now consider the prison created by our senses. If we interpret reality based on our senses - then the greater the sensual input, the better we perceive our reality to be. Certainly we can understand that the goal of the senses would be to increase sensory input, right? This means that without realizing it, the wisdom gained by our senses teaches us that a reality with MORE sensual stimuli is best. This is another way of saying that our wisdom desires to INCREASE the dominant (sensual stimuli) and DECREASE the weak (emotional stimuli).

    Sensory wisdom must therefore lead to greater and greater division. This is because in order to understand the concept of "HIGH" sensual input - it must be contrasted to "LOW" sensual input. Meaning, to understand being RICH, there must also exist those that are POOR. If one's wisdom is gained by the senses, the "goodness" of things is determined by comparing it against their "bad" alternatives. To experience being really rich, someone else would have to be really poor. We see that wisdom gained through the senses always contains "death" - for how else would "life" be known?

    Worse than this, in order for sensually-based wisdom to perceive a progressively better reality, the separation between "good" and "bad" experiences must also grow progessively broader. Once one is accustomed to the present "good", it is no longer "good" but rather "normal". A NEW "good" is continually desired. A new "good" can only be experienced when a new and improved "bad" is created along side.

    I have to go, but I have more to write. I'll finish later. As you might expect, there is much to say about our ability to use "emotional" stimuli INSTEAD of "sensual" as a means of increasing wisdom. Along with the very, very different type of reality it creates.

    Ponder on this for a while. :)
     
  2. I get what you're saying. It's strange, my roommate and I were having a similar talk last night about our true perception of reality. We were discussing the NOW and how to stay in a present tense mind set. Which brought us to the same conclusion you just shared, that reality is just a reflection.

    It makes sense if you think about it, everything we are surrounded by is a reflection. The world we see is just light being reflected into our eyes, the sounds are just echoes vibrations we perceive as noise, the actions are reflected from thoughts directed by what the senses tell us is going on in front of us. There is a speed of light...so there has to be something faster than what we can even see, so we can't even see the Present NOW, the "thing" making everything into the vibrations below. Pure Consciousness (PC) as you (thoughtware) called it.

    Experience comes before perception. We have been raised to only care about the Cause of things, what's going on right in front of us. We react to the world based off of what is happening, not why it's happening; we stress over the the Effect and ignore the Cause. This is where faith comes in, whatever faith one may claim, if we can ignore the stimuli from our "reality", to extent of attachments within the mind then we can become free from suffering within this world. When one comes to the understanding that the world we see is just the world we project, our thoughts are not our own, and we are all one piece in the same puzzle, then their world will begin to change. React to the Effect with trust in the Cause.

    Its all comes down to awareness. Being ego-minded, or being cosmic minded.
     
  3. ^Agreed.

    Everything is perception, that's why raising consciousness is so important. As we resonate at higher and higher frequencies, what we see and what there is to see, becomes more obvious. Our awareness of reality becomes clearer, which in many ways expands it and focusses it at the same time.

    Everything is reflection. Like a mirror, what we put out is what we see coming back. So as we change the way we are, so the world changes to reflect that. What we believe we are matters much, because only by seeing ourselves as we really are will we see the world as it really is.

    What's interesting about all this, is that there is nothing to find, nowhere to go, in order to realise this. It is and has always been right here. For there is nothing else but here, nothing else but now. Once the ego-mind no longer stands in the way, what remains is what has always been there - you.
     
  4. people will keep dying till everyone realizes we are all one
     
  5. Correct. Those that die will "fight" being one because being ONE requires harmony with those of the ONE. There is a connection (oneness) between distinct entities - thus all entities must live in harmony.

    No time to write - but happy to see the dialog starting.

    I do want to correct one thing @pantlessdragon said. He said we must "ignore" the stimuli of our enviorment. No, that's wrong. It's impossible too.

    However, there is a way to achieve what he is saying. I will write about that next.
     
  6. Even science is beginning to recognise the idea of one. They call it quantum entanglement. They observe that a particle over here can affect a particle over there instantaneously. That being the case, it reveals that everything has a level of connection not previously accepted before. If everything has a connection outside of space/time, nothing is separate. If nothing is separate, then like the neurons in the brain revealing consciousness, all minds are connected, every particle in the universe is intimately part of the collective whole, which reveals one consciousness. We could call that god.
     
  7. absolutely...one day people will look back and laugh that people actually believed that everytihng wasnt all one..much like its funny for many to think that people used to believe the world was flat...u can see the jump in dimensions right there
     
  8. ..in the context of collective conscious
     
  9. #90 A AnoesisOrange, Jan 12, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 12, 2013
    Kinda makes the term "spiritual journey" seem a bit contradictory. Great words, my friend.



    I don't have much input for the time being but I wanted to get in to this thread since I like it.
     
  10. #91 esseff, Jan 12, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 12, 2013
    Well, perhaps. But then, a journey can be all about discovering that you're already exactly where you need to be. That everything you think you're looking for you already have. You only need to change the way you look in order to realise it.
     
  11. Before we can break free from our prison cell - we must first understand what it is that binds us. Today we'll examine the chains of our bondage.

    In the King Of Mercy story, we remember that mankind preferred its own limited wisdom over the infinite wisdom of the King. Looking closer we learn that mankind prefers "finite things" over "infinite concepts". Thus, we can say that man's wisdom is built upon the "finite" (things perceived by our senses) and the King's wisdom is rooted in the "infinite", (things perceived by faculties OUTSIDE of the senses; we might call these things "emotions").

    In my last post I described how our reality is created by our wisdom - which is our "consciousness". If our wisdom is cultivated by what we see and touch - our consciousness becomes more and more divided. This is because we are forming NEW wisdom by the reality that PREVIOUS wisdom created. Want a good mental image of what this looks like? Think of making a photo copy of a detailed architectural drawing. The copy becomes a present reality - based on a past reality. Now make a copy of the copy - and that second copy, now a bit distorted and fuzzy, becomes the next reality. Every subequent copy degrades the original further. Eventually reality becomes so distorted - the original intent is completely obscure.

    In this fuzziness, we have lost the understanding that we are even creating a reality at all. We are fully engrossed in walking by our senses - which includes what we see OTHERS doing and saying. Mankind does not even realize it is simply copying the past - by trying to OUTDO what others have done in the past. Mankind no longer understands how to create NEW realities.

    This is why the Bible calls "hell" a bottemless pit. Understand that Hell is the experience of the reality in which we "live" right now. The human experience always gets progressively worse because the current reality is always a slightly "worse" representation of the reality that preceeded it. This is another way of saying that DIVISION always grows in a man-made reality.

    So this raises the obvious question: Why would man prefer wisdom that creates an increasing WORSE reality?

    The answer is that man's wisdom is actually the perfect prison - it ensares through its allure. Why? Because when man desires the reality of his prison more than the "concept" of something better, no one EVER desires to be free. Even when the doors are flung open. Man will always prefer his own wisdom.

    Still you might ask how could wisdom that creates a progressively worse reality EVER be preferred?

    This is the biggest question of all - and actually the point of all my writing.

    I've run out of time again - but will continue soon! :)
     
  12. one thing thats cool too is that when you attain to oneness you can then look at anything and find the truth in it...basically everything that has ever been said any idea that has ever been had is true from a certain perspective...the perspective that it had been percieved from
     

  13. Yeah, I guess if you travel around the world only to come back to the same spot you were that is a journey. The good thing about being back at that spot, though, is you've now circled the globe.
     
  14. ^ thoughtware...wisdom in itself is completely rightious...what ur talking about is false wisdom...with true wisdom comes freedom
     
  15. wisdom is knowledge of truth
     
  16. [quote name='"thoughtware"']@dankydankk

    Thanks for sharing your ideas about "hell". I might add this one thing:

    We exist in the "present" - which is so fleeting as to almost be non-existant. This should give us all an idea that the "past" no longer exists - and the future only exists as a "hope" or "desire". Yet our entire existence is contained in a "split-second" moment of time we call the present. We might now understand that since the past no longer exists - and the future is only an "expectation", at anytime we might affect a NEW future by changing our actions in the present. We create the future - and since the past does not exist, our future is NEVER bound by the past.

    Yet, you might argue that the past DOES exist because you can remember it. I would say that in a sense you are correct, because our MEMORY is the only thing that would try and keep us BOUND to the past. In fact, it is our MEMORY of the past that influences our Present - and therefore our memory influences our future.

    So, back to your very interesting concept of hell - what could a loving father do that would be JUST and MERCIFUL to the soul tormented by replaying its memory over and over? The Just and Merciful thing to do would be to "wipe" the memory that the creature may start again.

    Perhaps you could consider it this way. If you built a beautiful and powerful computer you would be pleased with it as long as it processed information and made expected decisions. However, if the computer became infected with a VIRUS - what would you do? Certainly we do not disgard the computer - you MADE it and understand exactly what is wrong with it. The VIRUS is simple for you to understand - but the computer you built isn't even aware it has a virus - it continues to run as designed. The computer is not "defective" (evil). When you remove the virus - the computer is restored.

    Thus, hell would be the place of eternal suffering - which I would say is this present creation since this created world will continue to produce suffering and death forever. Hell also extends beyond the death of the "flesh" - into the place of "death" - where souls must wait until death is defeated. This is the ultimate "prison" - and a place where God removes viruses. This is only my understanding - and what I believe.

    Now, regarding your question about the devil. I do not believe in a devil as an entity in the same way that I do not regard Christ or the Father as an entity. Instead, I view Satan as the "mass consciousness" of mankind. It is a "false wisdom" based on what the human mind absorbs from reality with its senses (touch, taste, smell, hearing and sight). This consciousness influences others in a mighty way by presenting itself as the "normal and right" way to live, act and speak. Thus Satan is like the dark cloud of "smog" hanging over the city of Los Angeles which obstructs the Sun.

    Satan (man-consciousness) has no truth in him. This is why the ways of truth seem foolish to the natural ways of man. However, Satan has NO POWER - because anything without truth is simply a "lie". Therefore, the "normal and right" ways of man are a LIE.

    This is why it is written that the Truth will set you free - and why Christ is called a "Light". Defeating Satan's rule is as easy as more and more people walking in Truth. At first it may appear "foolish" and contrary to worldy wisdom - but it destroys every part of your present that reflects Satan's lies. When this happens, the changes in your present become so dramatic that your future changes. This is because our current future reflects the LIE's by which we live. And this is why everybody dies. Remember, I have said repeatedly that Death is a lie. Yet death is inevitable if everyone's present is affected by lies.

    Now, as people begin to learn Truth - and walk in it, their future begins to reflect Truth. And you know what? There is ONLY LIFE in a present lived in truth. And...at first....LIFE appears as growing peace in your present.

    More later. Thanks for the questions! Please ask more.[/quote]

    Yeah I see your view on hell. I just don't think time exists In the world of gods being. And I don't think eternal suffering exists, my view I think would actually fit your analogy more than your view. In my view like a computer with a virus, its conscious is cleaned and then the soul moves on. But you believe that nothing else happens, only "suffering " why I ask by the way what is suffering in hell to you?

    That's an interesting view on Satan. I believe Satan is part of God like everything else, so there is no reason for anything to be destroyed. Satan is a symbol of temptation, of the struggle between being righteous and not giving a fuck. I don't think God is just the light, but also the dark. All the forces in every "realm" are of God imo
     
  17. False wisdom is claiming to know true wisdom - yet displaying your rudeness by continually double posting.
     
  18. ^ lol oh am i not following the proper grasscity spiritual forums proper posting ettiquette? you sound pretty defensive their thoughtware lol i think you can do better
     

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