I've followed a few journals on varying forums across the web... I also know a couple off the growers quite well and they found no added benefits to using a cmh... despite their initial excitement. You'll also want to stop you bare skin coming into contact with the light, many growers reported getting a rash. I have done enough research to know that cmh is nort for me. I flower with mix spec, but the mix spec is in the form of a 300w UV bulb alongside 2 400W HPS. lumens is everything, my friend. ... and you sir, know nothing about me.
never said I knew anything about you since it is an internet forum never saw any reason why I would, but don't act like you know more than me when you clearly can't gauge that without actually meeting me and knowing what I have dealt with in the past. Never said lumens was secondary to spectrum but the fact that so much importance is given to lumens without thinking about proper spectrums is a common mistake by most growers. HPS is a brute force way of giving light to a plant when giving it less lumens at the proper spectrum is actually alot healthier for a plant since they don't see light intensity in the way humans do which is lumens they see PAR, so if you want to get technical you need to know PAR rather than lumen output of a bulb as it pertains to horticulture specifically.
i grow and i use cfl's for veg and a 400 watt hpas for flowering in any situation i think cfls are the best to veg with just because they are easy i have been growing for a while now and honestly just go with the cfls and try a hps for flowering
I use cfls for veg alot as well and they are great since you can keep them so close to the plant just takes alot of them to properly light a plant from top to bottom. CFLs are actually a perfect example of how lumens aren't everything to a plant it is more about spectrum and getting enough of that spectrum distributed evenly over your whole space.
here is a quote for you Harvester from Simba a very highly respected member on International Cannagraphic forums which is definitely a higher quality site as far as info and experienced growers. He is also the main supporter and knowledge base for CMH on the site, he is the guy who spread the advancedtechlighting.com link so many could reap the same benefits he has been from the great bulb. Anyways here is the quote, "the yield question is debatable.depends on setup etc.. 2 400 cmh would equal to outperform a 1 1kw on overall yield.. (ya the ones under the 1k will be big but the edges will be nothing compared to center.. CMH will be even and quality) IMPHO & IMPHO if u do it right same yield overall. and with better qaulity than hps or even hps mh combo as full spd beats partial.. peaks.. Obv but the one thing that cant be questioned is the Qaulity..no matter the yield outcome.." I rest my case even mixed spectrum of MH and HPS still doesn't add up to CMH benefits. the graphs speak for themselves as well. And as I originally said quality is what I care about not yields. CMH= better quality period. I rest my case.
Cfl's are a perfect example of how lumens aren't everything to a plant? ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Lumens are everything to a cannabis plant... you can grow it in either spectrum, blue all the way if you wish, or red all the way too... use UV all the way too if you please, I've done it. Spectrum is important too, but then so is environment. Fact is though, the more lumens you give a plant the bigger a plant you will get. Also in veg, it will grow faster and mature quicker. CFL's are barely good enough to light ones living room... and yes I have used them, didn't even rate them for clones.
What? Even mix spec of HPS and MH doesn't match up to CMH? Now you're having a laugh. You get 2 400's of HID against 1 1000 of course you'll get more coverage from the 400's, doh. You'll also be able to get them closer to the plants. In fact if you use them properly any 2 400w lights could outcompete a 1000 You see every now and again on forums like this cmh pops up with some guy thinking it's all a new thing... when it isn't, it's an old boring one, at least for me... oh and I've never heard of simba, bring him here and let him argue his case. Maybe he'd be a little better at pulling out all the arguments for the use of cmh than you are. As you do care about quality of bud, I agree you are going the right way about it as the blue spec is very important in regards to thc potency... i just don't agree that they are better than ordinary mix spec HID. Indeed I prefer to put in extra lights (hps, mh, uv) to increase potency for my plants in flower. Lumens=more bud... lumens=faster, better photosynthesis... better photosynthesis=more uptake of nutrients... more uptake of nutrients=bigger, more potent plants. Lumens is everything, spectrum is always there.
we will just keep using our respective setups cause I like using mine and you like using yours so lets just leave it at that. I know how good mine is doing as compared to my one HPS and that is the big difference you can use multiple bulbs where as I can't so to each his own. CMH is much better suited to a setup that can't use more than one type of bulb. I would think the best would be a 600watt HPS coupled with a 400watt CMH. Now that would really kick some ass.
Yes I agree... it is pretty much each to their own, and most of the 'science' behind cannabis is merely theory and old wives tales passed down from stoner to stoner. I have my opinion and you have yours. although you can actually buy mix spec HID's if you want to. They sell them in 430w to account for the loss in lumens of having a mix spec bulb.
Yeah you know I have seen the mixed spec bulbs but they are so expensive and I am running on a budget right now and the 53 a bulb for the Philips CMH was just right for me. Definitely will check out those bulbs at a later time when my space is larger and the funds are more available.
YOU are the mess. There is more than one way to skin a cat and there have been MANY impressive grows with CFLs. Far too many to think your way is the only way. Far too many for you to be such an arrogant prick.
i used cfls til aquired a h.i.d the growth is about the same through veg for me but my 250w halide works alot faster for veg and really packs a punch for flower i mean i have flowered with cfls don't get me wrong it just takes sooooo much longer then it should
ok so i got a question for cfl growers im just wondering how long it took for you to veg before you were able to begin flowering and how many watts etc your light was producing and if it was cool white or whatever, your lighting scedule which is most cases will be 24/7 and how big they got during your veg time because a buddy of mine xsaxisx and i r growing also using cfls and we are using Three 25" 30Watt Flouro Tubes | 725x3 Lumens each Four 42Watt CFL'S | 2700x4 Lumens each (day time lights) Two 23Watt CFL's | 4700x2 Lumens each(cool white lights) Total: 22,375K Lumens Two Computer Fans Temp gauge the soil is from wally walmart organic mix and we left it for two weeks before adding some mg in which was dumb shouldnt of done it but its our first time and we are bound to make mistakes anyways we didnt add any more and they got a bit of nute burn but made it through so then around the 24 day in too veg we got some eugno bat shit as well as worm poop and some fox farm nutes and added about a quater of a table spoon to each but they jsut r growing so damn slow its bothering me :S ill post a link so everyone can see we just added some very recent pictures tonight and we are thinknig of switching it too a 250 hps for the rest of vegging ? would this speed up the process a bit more orrrr???? and here is the link to our grow journal even tho we didnt put it in grow journal sectino sorta dumb but what the hell http://forum.grasscity.com/general-indoor-growing/219098-attempting-grow-cfl-s.html
I have vegged with CFL and HPS. I had, for the first month and a half, only 1 42w CFL around like 14 clones. They got about a foot tall. I transplanted, added another 42w (no reflector), and let it grow another month - about 6 more inches and a lot of leaves. I was bad to them and fertilized when roots were growing, stunting them quite a bit. It was really cold in my basement, too. These factors hurt my growth, but they were great for what I wanted (I had to wait for the flower room to empty, anyways). In the end, I took 6 vegged clones in a cooler (yes, all in the same box with their roots intermingling and gettin' all friendly - I had to tempt fate, right?), and put 'em under the HPS for their flowering. Man... it was beautiful. I'd say I could have gotten there better and faster if I had more light from the start and waited longer to fertilize, but it was good for my needs at the time. That was CFL's. The round before that was my seeds vegged under a 150w HPS. This made l'il trees. I didn't top, I didn't LST, I just had a plant that grew. I vegged for 2 months total and under an HPS you get stretching (not disastrous, but enough to say they were stretched). I ended up with 4-and-a-half footers, the limit of my growing space. I then just switched to 12/12, and waited. In the end, the six small plants produced more, higher quality buds than the three trees. This has a lot to do with improved technique, so unless I start growing again, I won't be able to give good experimentresults. Depending on what you're doing, each method was fine. I think trees are a little less than ideal for small scale grow ops because while the tops have light, the bottoms get dick all. If I had a big watt room with space and intensity for light to get everywhere, I would love to do the tree thing and just watch them get full. But if you have 400w or smaller HID flower light, you're probably going to want to concentrate the growing tips to the top of the plant by topping, LST-ing, breaking, or whatever (in my 1st example, I did all 3... not hard to tell I did some research between grows!). I think vegging with HPS would have been ideal for a ScrOG, CFLS good for SOG and keeping the plants shorter in general. Both made weed, though. E4A2s
You'll notice a tremendous leap in vertical growth. You'll have to try it and figure out what suits your space and needs. Were you planning on flowering with CFL's or planning on purchasing and HID light for that? If you haven't made the investment and if it is a lot of money for you to put out, you may want to try to flower with your CFL's, just so you KNOW if it's not the right thing for you. You may get results that satisfy without shelling out $200-300. E4A2S
well acuttly we could grab up a 250 hps for fairly cheap running around 50 bucks? im in canada and thats fairly cheap yea you have to wire it yourself but for the price its a steal, also if you check out that link r our plants the right size for there age? and being with the cfls that we have would we expect a small yeild from cfls? if we were to go that route instead of using the 250 watt hps and also is it too late to begin lsting and topping at almost a month in ? the plants r still small if you check out the link you can check them out and give some info on it
If it's no biggie to grab an HPS, then I'm not gonna lie and say it's BETTER to stick with CFL's (for flowering). It's no competition... your plants will flourish under the golden HPS goodness. And, since you already have a batch of fluoros, you can make up a mother/veg room and keep a perpetual grow going. The plants look ripe for starting some LST and Topping. As long as the mainstem is still flexible, you can probably get a 90 degree bend in it right away. You'll know how much is too much as you bend it. As to which is better for vegging, if your gonna get an HPS for flowering anyways, throw it all on. Why choose... be greedy. E4A2S
hey dude im just wondering what your thoughts r on this buddie on here stated on our grow thing that we need to completely change the soil because the plants look like there thriving for different soil? i personally dont think hes right but if more people belive it then ill do it but like i said its orangic shit from wally mart and we have added to it now eugno bat shit worm castings (poop) and a bit of fox farm nutes with blood meal and bone meal phsourous etc in it whats your guyss thoughts on it i know im getting off topic from the mh vrs cfl but ill jump right back onto it from seeing the link and seeing our plants if we lsted and topped what would be a rough estimate on a yeild we could get ???
Do you have fertilizer burn? Is your drainage okay? If no and yes, you're fine. People bash Walmart soil and Miracle Grow by name, not always by experience. If your nutrients aren't burning tips or spots on your leaves, chances are they aren't overdone - and organic soil wouldn't have any chemical based time-release ferts (which are the no-no's in MJ food) that you don't know about. If you don't have some pearlite or vermiculite in there, you may want to in the next transplant pot (if there is one), but if your soil drains well, I don't think your problems lie there. Do you even believe that you have a problem, or did someone just put a random comment up that made you worry a little? I also don't think you're better with your lights out until you replace your 4500K bulbs with bluer 6500k ones. Your current lights emit in both the blue and red frequency spectrums, it just concentrates between them, in the greens. It doesn't mean you have a green light (which would not help your plants, but would make a groovy alien-kinda-look to your room). But yeah... 6500 for veg, 2500 for flower. E
In flower a 400w HPS light is good for up to a 2ft cola... such is it's penetration. in vegetation a 400w MH kicks the hell out of fluoro's. adios.