Meditation - Empty your mind? WUT..?

Discussion in 'Religion, Beliefs and Spirituality' started by AlexanderTheGr8, Apr 13, 2011.

  1. The title is kinda outlandish but it's only to draw attention, I promise I'll be more civil and open minded with my question ;)

    So I've been reading a little into meditation, not really seeing the point of it or how emptying your mind is supposed to make you free and happy.

    I'm all for taking moments to yourself and reflecting on your life and giving yourself a chance to do some inner critical thinking but to completely void your mind of thoughts? Sounds like people are just trying to make a 'feel good' club - heck with nothing on your mind, why would you be anything but feelin good? Am I right? Not a day that I don't wish I didn't have to carry my worries with me.

    Well, I got me some cannabis for that. :cool:


    Come on now, enlighten me. :smoke:
     
  2. For me, I meditate to meditate. I think that if you do it with the thought of getting something out of it, you'll find that you get nothing. It's about returning to the true self, the source, god, Allah, or whatever you want to call it. I wish you well in your endeavors man.
     
  3. By clearing your mind you are also clearing out the illusions of happiness that we all hold. It is to learn to live fully in the present moment so that we can be truly content. The reason the mind must be clear is because all thoughts that may arise in your head are either of the past or of what you believe the future will hold. The only way to remain completly immersed in the present is to concentrate only on what is physically happening at that excact moment. Which is why many like to focus on their breathing. Although not all meditation involves keeping your mind void of thought. There are other types of meditations, for example, used for insight.

    It may sound strange but i highly reccomend reading into it. The idea of contentment is very intresting.
     
  4. Try to be as specific as possible.

    Returning to true self? What is the true self? Explain best you can.

    Returning to the source? What source? I'm not accepting a 'whatever you want' as an explanation. Is it a god? is that the source you are talking about?
     

  5. I understand what you are saying, I have come to some kind of conclusion of living in the now is more real than 'living in the head' for lack of a better explanation. It seems whenever I'm alone I do this more or less anyway.

    Meditation had no part in my realization of this so I ask: If meditation is just a means to an end your own inner dialogue can be too - then rendering the symbolical ritual of meditating is more of show of that enlightenment, if even that.
     
  6. I assure you just because you feel that you have come to this realization doesn't mean that you live a fully content life. To be fully content is to never feel dissapointment. You seem to throw around 'enlightenment' as if it is merely what one is called that meditates. It isn't merely a realization, it is a lifestyle.

    Enlightenment is not easy to attain by any means. Nor is it easy to describe. It is said that it is not possible to comprehend what it is like to those of us who have not experianced. Buddha describes life as suffering, and to be enlightened is to end suffering. To be enlighted partly is to be free of all material posession, and external desires. True happiness is said to only be attainable from ones inner self. Everything we desire in life; sex, money, accomplishments, even our beloved cannabis only brings ephermal joy. It is all an illusion of happiness. If you haven't noticed life is full of moments where it falls short of our expectations. These expectations are the source of suffering. When you enlightened there are no more of these moments. This is extremley hard for me to try to describe...

    Then of course there is also ego death which comes along with enlightenment although you can attain ego death without being enlightened. I'm sure you are aware of ego and in my opinion at least, and I know I'm not the only one, ego driven emotions are a primary cause of suffering and dissapointment. There are actually members on these forums who have experianced ego death and perhaps they could do a better job of explaining all of this than I can.
     
  7. By learning to release the mind of its habit of constantly commenting on everything that happens or remembering the past or projecting into the future due to fear, etc, not only do you come to understand that there is only the present and feel a deep sense of peace as you experience it, but you open yourself to that which is far more real, now that the illusion of the mind is beginning to fade. In order to feel the truth of yourself, you first have to let go of yourself, at least that which you think is yourself, sometimes called the ego.
     
  8. Hi A'. I was convinced that what you say is true when I first began. But no, the kinds of meditation usually talked about here are forms of concentrative meditation, learning to hold the mind on a single perception so that you can train it to stay on any perception continually in a 'single-pointed' way. This method is introductory, there to show you what a clear, calm mind is and to help you learn to relax fully, breath properly, be able to create feelings of happiness and bliss on cue - all as tools for later work. The idea isn't to create a thoughtless state and sit blindly in it. It's a common misconception and something I did for years with no point.

    The purpose isn't to end inner-dialogue, that's pretty easy to do and everyone passes in and out of that state tens of times every day. Think of all the latter meditation work as the warm-up exercises before meditation proper takes place. Kundalini (Hatha), thought by many to be a way to realisation, is in fact just the same, a purification and strengthening stage to prepare you for the higher form of Raja Yoga.

    Schools of higher meditation don't meditate in the way people think, it isn't about constantly sitting, or about trying to stop thoughts or becoming a good person. Instead, we set up a perfect mental ground by using preparatory methods such as meditation, which makes the mind much more sensitive to subtle changes of state. Once there we understand reality and self to be of a particular nature and construction, and these thoughts lead into say, instant blisses, samadhi,or kensho.

    It gets to a point that just casually thinking about reality as you're going about your day, even for a moment, will push you into a 'state' of some kind. After a while there is only the result and not the thought. There is no meditation, no non-meditation. Just walking about and knowing what reality is on deep level without the need to recall it. Every time you look at it your underlying understanding pushes you or you push it, so access to it never ends.

    Knowing the nature of reality in the right way and applying it whilst in the right frame of mind is 80% of all that's needed. Of course it's not quite as simple as that, but on the whole, knowledge of reality has always been the fastest and most direct way to reach realisation.

    MelT
     
  9. It can be used for many many many purposes and reasons. To get in touch of your 'true' self. Instead of who you have been thinking who you are.

    -Find your inner Peace, Love, Light, Harmony, Compassion, the Joy, the Understanding, the Wisdom
    -Calm your body & mind (inner & outer)
    -Relieves tension/confusion/benefits health
    -Reduces anger/hostility/resistance/worry
    -Let go.....Let go of letting go... let go of thinking letting go...release yourself
    - Just allow
    - Just be



    Test have even proven that two minds have connected telepathically, in a meditative intent.

    People have channeled different 'sources' or 'beings' from other dimensions, other lifetimes, all through meditation.

    The most advanced can do MAGIC/SURREAL abilities through meditation. (Healing through energies, feeling no pain, shifting body weight, creating energy levels to ignite paper on fire, etc. alotttt more)

    But one cannot pick up a guitar and except to be Jimi Hendrix. It comes with time. With patience. With acceptance. The deeper you go the more you will understand.

    God is not a man in a throne in heaven somewhere judging us through good/evil. Do not look out for the answers. But look within. He has been within you your entire life. Within all. You are God. Meditation is a source to know this.
     

  10. I think you explained very well and I thank you for taking the time to do so.

    Try not to take what I'm saying to personally but instead as my sincerer intellectual attempt at understanding while playing a bit of devil advocate.

    From a different angle or maybe just a more cynical, depressed angle, it seems like this is just another 'feel good club'. "End all suffering, no more disappointment!"

    'Here's the best technique to numb yourself of all emotion and cause specific suffering!' We do this through a bit of realization and world understanding, don't forget to slap the word enlightenment on it, and then can all live a content life. :hello:

    /sarcasm.

    I admit, if everyone lived their lives like this, we'd be in a utopia state but utopia isn't going to help us if there's an incoming meteor and we're to busy being content to explore technology that will one day save ourselves. You know? The philosophy isn't flawless. Or would you say that it's the natural order of things for us to get hit by a meteor? I don't know. This shit it mentally exhausting and I'm tired.

    Continue this tomorrow with your response.
     
  11. I'm proud to say I understood that read on a mostly experience based level of understanding but my analysis skills lack where I question the realization. Have you gotten 'there'? Still seems like a 'feel good club,' sure you have an advanced sense of reality and it gives you a good feeling but I guess I'm just looking for the absurd. A point.
     
  12. #12 StoneBuddha, Apr 13, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 13, 2011


    Yes enlightenment is the way to end all suffering. I don't see any harm in this, do you? And enlightenment is not just a slapped on term. To be enlightened is to see through all illusions and to have true knowledge on life. Meditation in a lot of ways is a way to see life as it truly is, which believe it or not is an appealing idea to many. In fact, I've that there are certain buddhists who will stare at an object or an organsim (whatever it may be) until they fully understand it.

    And it is not simply being null of emotion, it is very blissful.

    And lastly, to say that not being able to make technological advancements is a bad thing is all a matter of opinion. In my opinion most technologies are redundant and are not necesarry to living. I mean, we are destroying our home planet to produce things for consumers and it sickens me. All of these things people attach themselves to just complicate their lives and make them more stressed out.

    And I don't think we are all that close to developing something that can divert a meteor. To be honest i find that to be a little paranoid. Anyways, I'm all for prodicing new technology that will help ensure our planet from being destroyed, as well as medicines. Just could we please cut it out with all of these pointless material objects that people attach themselves to?
     
  13. Do you mean realisation by 'there'? Yes, about 13 years ago. I was just lucky, that was all. Gaining access to the 'feel good club':) was instrumental in reaching it though, you usually need the mental pliancy that blisses can give to help you along into realisation.

    But, blisses aren't the aim, they're a pretty easy thing to raise once you understand the process. Bliss in a way is a distraction from your proper condition. As time goes on you learn to go past it. Imagine it as though the requirement of meditation was to look out of a window, but each time you did a bliss began and distracted you. It stops you doing the thing you're meant to be doing, looking out of the window. Bliss is the same, a pleasant distraction, but it's not an end in itself.

    However, as I've said here before,people can have small spontaneous experiences of kensho without having meditated or thought about reality ever in their lives, it happens relatively often. Meditation gives you an edge and a direction to go in, that's all, it's not always necessary. Reaching Satori though is something else, and does need a lot of practise over a number of years.


    I'm not sure what you mean by this?

    MelT
     
  14. The guy in the Quantum Activist said it best....Life comes down to balancing Doing and Being...Do and Be, Do and Be....DOBEDOBEDOBE...lol
     
  15. Interesting question one that i've meditated on myself... or as i like to call meditating.

    Best I can say is that although it's true it is emptying your mind, the nothing is something, or at least it becomes that. For example I found myself between a rock and a hard place the other day and I couldn't escape the worry, all I could do was lay down on the couch and though I didn't fall asleep, or remember the dream, just by laying down and dreaming I was right as rain afterward.

    Oh i'm sure the dream went many places, it's something I remember doing as a kid all the time. Just day dreaming away. It's something that as we get older we like to make ourselves feel important when we do it. :rolleyes:

    i dunno i suppose when i realized that I was dreaming and wanted to interact with the dream it was over and i couldn't do it again. so that's what's meant by doing nothing.

    just enjoy it like you enjoy a dream. it's not about batting your head against walls, or winding yourself into a fit about something. I mean you might do some negative association to start it off.

    Like for example you could start to think about what happened during the day and what, if you were the person you interacted with, what you would think about how you acted. And then your mind might take you to a situation that happened at another time in another place, and you might have a realization about how you acted the same way in that situation. And you might feel bad. But that won't last. And you'll start to forget about worrying about all that stuff, and maybe even go deeper the more you have less things to worry about. :D
     
  16. #16 HighGrowMan, Apr 13, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 13, 2011
    The true self is joy, it's quantum singularity, it's pure consciousness without the body. Pure thought.

    If you remove all sensory input and you just have thought, that's true self. When this happens you might go through sensations of dying. Which is the body or ego reacting to loosing it's control. It's like WUT no way this is mine... nooooooo...... but then when that's over and the feeling bad about all the things you've ever done in your life passes, then it's down to woaah, i control everything that happens just by the way i think... like if i want to be happy, i can just be happy. simple. it's a thought. if i want to let fear make me go crazy and trap myself in darkness i can do that too.

    Even if other people force me into a negative situation I can find happiness in thought of gaining strength and perseverance and learning how to overcome the most negative of situations. Even if I was put in jail and shackled to the walls, and had dogs bark at me, and snakes crawl in my pants, and women grab my crotch or caress my face, still if I was strong enough, to be able to let go of my ego, and find true self, and have a smile as they rip my intestines out my ass hole.

    I mean it's not that your enjoying the pain. Pain is a part of physicality, and joy is a part of spirituality. You just go to the source and your mind can be free to consider the sayings of Lao Tzu while you are disembowelled.

    Oh and 'God' is not the source. God is a consciousness. The 'tao' is the source. The masculine and feminine together. The creator came from the source: thought came from the source.
     
  17. A "feel good club"? Lol do you want to feel peace or suffering?

    The mind would have you convinced that suffering is the "normal" way or the "sane" way and that nothing but peace is not possible or wishful thinking.

    The best advice I could is to truly meditate and empty your mind and feel the silence. All your answers can be found there, directly within.
     
  18. With thoughts come an idea of a "right" way. If there is a right way, there is a wrong way. And if there is a wrong way, there will inevitably be many circumstances of the wrong way occurring, and this will cause your suffering. Just be, and you are more aware and competent in the world than ever, and there is no suffering.
     
  19. i guess the best way to describe meditation is as a form of voluntary spiritual and psychological free fall where one experiences a very personal process of reflection tailored to what you presently feel in doubt-or-curious with. For some its just a way for dealing with day to day stress because they are not interested in going too deep with the process in other words they are part of the "Feel good club" as you put it. This is akin to any method of coping such as exercise, arts and crafts, reading (hobbies, basically) and can be interpreted as tailor made for your body-soul connection (whatever that means to you). Now where meditation separates itself from other hobbies is in the fact that many of those who go deeper tend to profess a sense of introspection and reflection that other hobbies are (seemingly) incapable of achieving (which makes a certain amount of sense when you consider the amount of unknowns that exist in the universe imply the plausibility of the existence and true nature of mystical forces such as chakras and the third or inner eye ). in the end it all depends on what you are willing to believe in. :wave: Sorry for the wall of text - my keyoard is on the fritz
     
  20. #20 thabosshogg, Apr 14, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 14, 2011
    I've been getting more and more into zen buddhism lately, and I find that their method of meditation is my favorite.



    "sit just to sit"





    As to why anyone stops their thoughts, one must understand that the common western notion of "reality", isn't reality... it's an abstract fantasy we create in our heads based on our thoughts regarding reality.


    I love how alan watts put it... the common mind's way of treating reality... is like someone going into a restaurant, and "eating the menu instead of the food".


    Silencing the mind allows for reality to be perceived without thought labelling or seperating it, and thus one can get a glimpse of the "suchness" of reality.




    I mean, look at your hand for while.... don't think about what it is, don't call it a hand, just view it and take it in.


    If you can do this without thinking for a short while (or less if you are good at it) you will see that the hand is an infinitely mindblowing thing, a miracle, that so many people take for granted.


    Apply that mindset not just to the hand, but to the entire world, and you have the purpose of meditation/no-thought.
     

Share This Page