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Lecithin without coconut oil?

Discussion in 'Weed Edibles' started by Gucc1, Aug 10, 2017.

  1. #1 Gucc1, Aug 10, 2017
    Ive been doing some research on using sunflower lecithin as an emulsifier for bho edibles or, more specifically, for medicated drinks and syrups. But I havent found exactly what im looking for by search. Everything ive found with bho and lecithin always involves coconut oil. My question is, can lecithin be used by itself to "transfer" the decarbed bho to whatever i am making, whether it be water for drinks, honey or homemade simple syrup? I figured since the lecithin emulsifies the bho, there wouldnt be a need for a fat for it to bond to, but i could be misunderstanding the concept. Any help?
     
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  2. #2 BrassNwood, Aug 10, 2017
    @Gucc1
    Lecithin - Wikipedia
    Most lecithin is about 35% oil to start with and I don't see why it wouldn't work so give it a try and report back ASAP.
    It's the one thing I haven't tried. I'd likely use the liquid as it's easy to work with.
    BNW
     
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  3. #3 Gucc1, Aug 10, 2017
    Thanks for the info. I'll be reporting back tonight after my lecithin comes in. Im planning on mixing up a medicated simple syrup, kinda like a canna lean type deal. I already have the syrup made up, just waiting for the lecithin to make the magic happen.
     
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  4. #4 BrassNwood, Aug 10, 2017
    Incredible, Edible Herb
    Give Sam's thread a read for ideas on Tincture to sugar for making syrups. Some good folks over there and it's an active thread.
    BNW
     
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  5. #5 Gucc1, Aug 10, 2017
    I have actually already tried making the medicated sugar with everclear tincture i made with bho. The issue i was having was the waxes were separating as soon as it touched water. Im hoping to go back to the tinctures eventually, and add a small amount of lecithin to try to keep everything bonded.
     
  6. #6 PsychedelicSam, Aug 11, 2017
    Lecithin is an emulsifier for oil/water combinations and it may help in your syrup but I've never really had a problem stirring mine into any kind of cold beverage or hot. What kind of separation are you getting when you place it in water? Is the syrup well infused with no clumping?

    I'm not really sure that you can use the lecithin as a carrier for the cannabinoids, though it may be possible. Good luck with that. :)
     
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  7. #7 Joker1121, Aug 11, 2017
    I'm confused about your medicated sugar- there should be no water involved unless you are making syrup. Winterizing will remove the waxes and insolubles. Anxious to hear about how your lecithin works out, good luck.
     
  8. #8 Gucc1, Aug 11, 2017
    Sorry, let me explain further. The sugar i made was with old waxy material that i made an everclear solution with. After i mixed it into the sugar and evaped all the ethanol out, it seemed to hold together. I used the sugar in some homemade limeade and i was left with floating globs that looked like the starting material. I have considered that it was just the waxes floating, but the color of it made me believe it had thc in the globs as well.

    I will get back to you guys tonight on my experiment
     
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  9. #9 Gucc1, Aug 11, 2017
    Okay so quick update. So bare with me as i am still figuring out ratios and stuff. So far my solution is staying together, bho wise(im getting some floaties from the tiny bits of the fruit i used). What i have found so far is that a slow, even heat is key for getting the solution to completely bond.
    The first batch i made i mixed the decarbed bho and lecithin together and threw it back in the oven (that was still warm from the decarb) and stirred vigorously. This seemed to be an important step as my next batch i didnt reheat the bho/lecithin and it took much longer for everything to bond.
     
  10. #10 Gucc1, Aug 11, 2017
    What i mean by bond is both staying together in the syrup and when mixed in other liquids.
     
  11. #11 PsychedelicSam, Aug 11, 2017
    Did you use liquid lecithin? And stirred it directly into the concentrate? And it dissolved in the drink? 50 questions time. :rolleyes:
     
  12. #12 Gucc1, Aug 11, 2017
    Bring on the questions! I used liquid sunflower lecithin and mixed it directly into the concentrate. The syrup dissolves into a drink, but it took quite some time of slow cooking (about 3+ hrs). I kept taking droppers to test its solubility into fluids every half hour or so until there was no more separation.​
     
  13. #13 PsychedelicSam, Aug 12, 2017
    Was it the concentrate and the lecithin that you stirred and cooked together to make a the "syrup"? What was the proportions that you used?

    Even with sugar syrups the key can be in getting it hot enough and keeping it stirred. Sometimes if you've used a concentrated infused sugar, there is a crust that can form on top. One way to get rid of that is to dribble a little bit of alcohol on it then stir it in.

    Is there an oil sheen on the fluids you're infusing with it? There is always a light oil sheen on the top of most water based liquids and that's about all but maybe the lecithin can take care of that? Does it give leave it a clear drink or emulsify the texture?

    In your first post you said you had the syrup already made so are you adding the lecithin to the infused syrup then heating and stirring for 3+ hours? That seems that would make the syrup an emulsion which would then work in a water based drink. This topic comes up a lot with syrups so any new tweaks are always helpful. :)
     
  14. #14 Gucc1, Aug 12, 2017
    @PsychedelicSam
    Okay, sorry I havent fully explained myself. My plan was to make a medicated simple syrup. I made the actual syrup before hand (equal parts water, sugar and fruit). After i mixed my concentrate and lecithin together i put it into the simple syrup.
    By oil sheen, do you mean the floating small globs? With the simple syrup It seems to develop a crust (which seems like tiny fruit pieces)on the top after sitting for a while, but will mix right in after a quick shake. When mixing into a drink, it initially leaves a cloudiness by seems to clear up with some light stirring
     
  15. #15 PsychedelicSam, Aug 12, 2017
    Now I've got it. That put 2+2 together for me. Good job. I'm going to remember that and will probably try it myself. Some people use glycerin for the emulsifier but that doesn't work as well. What was your bho to lecithin amounts?

    By "sheen" I mean just a light oil sheen that floats on the surface, not coarse. If you ever add a little tincture to a cup of coffee it mixes in well but you see that sheen and it sips right off. I'd imagine the lecithin takes care of that. If you used fruit in your syrup then that's probably what you see floating if you didn't strain it real well. What kind of fruit? :)
     
  16. #16 Gucc1, Aug 12, 2017
    I haven't worked out an exact ratio quite yet but i eyeballed about a 1:1. As for the syrup, I used raspberries, blueberries and strawberries
     
  17. #17 Gucc1, Aug 12, 2017
    Update: so i just noticed this red residue left over in the cup. @PsychedelicSam, have any input? Both the oil and the lecithin had a dark gold/amber color to it but this is closer to the color of the berry syrup. Im wondering if its from any leftover waxes that wouldnt break down from the lecithin
     

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  18. #18 PsychedelicSam, Aug 12, 2017
    It's a combination of the berry juice and the lecithin. I use lecithin as a dietary supplement, usually in some Tang, and the inside of my glass always has the same residue, only a bit orange. It's like a skim coating because it's a phospholipid.

    You used 1g and 1g or something like that? :huh:
     
  19. #19 Gucc1, Aug 12, 2017
    Okay thanks. Not quite that exact, i just poured it over the concentrate until it doubled in size. I think the second batch i added more than the first
     
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