Kill Bill C-15!

Discussion in 'Marijuana Legalization' started by Space, Sep 17, 2009.

  1. Bill c-15 is a canadian bill, which, if passed, would impose mandatory minimum sentances for drug offenders.

    with all this election talk, c-15 has dispaeared off the radar, but if we dont get a fall election, its a very real possibility that this will get passed (both conservatives ANd liberals have said they will support it).

    Please, everyone in Canada, write to your memer of parliament and present them with the facts, ask that they do not support this bill!
     
  2. I'm in the process of writing a huge article about this. Its crazy, for one marijuana plant, you will get 6 months of jail time. It's hectic.

    There are different groups that are working against this. I'm working with other students to try to stop this bill. I have a feeling it will end up getting passed, as both leading parties want it to, but I'm still going to do what I can.
     
  3. WHY?!!?!? This is fucking retarded. I hate conservatives sooooo much.

    There is pretty much a garuntee of a fall election though.
     
  4. Now you guys won't be able to brag to us about your cheap dank.
     
  5. Fuck that, I'll never stop bragging!!!!! Nah but seriously I doubt this will pass, think about how many Canadians would be going to jail!
     
  6. Our dank will still be cheap, we just have to go to jail if we get caught with it ;)
     
  7. Thank you for bringing this to my attention.. I am writing it.. tomorrow
     
  8. Hi all,

    Lots of information related to Bill C-15 here...

    Bill C-15: Mandatory Minimum Sentences for Cannabis Offences
    Cannabis Facts for Canadians - Bill C-15 (formerly C-26) - Mandatory Minimums for Cannabis

    Initially Bill C-15 called for mandatory prison sentences for anyone caught growing even a single plant "for the purpose of trafficking." Along the way, the minimum plant number to receive a mandatory prison sentences was raised to five. (Big whoop tee do.)

    If an election is called before Bill C-15 makes it's way through the Senate (where it is currently) it will die.

    If the Conservatives win the next election they would have to reintroduce the bill and start from the beginning of the process again.

    If the Conservatives win the next election with a majority... heaven help us!

    -FrankD
     

  9. LOL QFT.\
    Nah for real though, its them trying to fill up the :eek:
     

  10. Exactly what I wanted to post. Damn cellphone cant copypasta >_<
     
  11. Some C-15 related links...


    Bill C-15 Committee Meeting minutes:

    April 22, 2009 - C-15 Committee Meeting minutes (1/3) | WhyProhibition.ca
    May 4, 2009 - C-15 Committee Meeting minutes (2/3) | WhyProhibition.ca
    May 13, 2009 - C-15 Committee Meeting minutes (3/3) | WhyProhibition.ca


    And more recently...

    September 17, 2009
    Debates of the Senate
    2nd Session, 40th Parliament,
    Volume 146, Issue 53
    .....
    ORDERS OF THE DAY
    Controlled Drugs and Substances Act
    Bill to Amend-Second Reading <-- (Click to read full doc)

    Excerpt:
    Notable quote...

    Senator McCoy: We are on second reading of Bill C-15 in the Senate, which indicates that we agree in principle with this bill. I want to put on the record that I do not agree with this bill in principle. I read the committee report of the Senate that recommended decriminalizing marijuana. I would uphold that decision. I have heard nothing that would persuade me to disagree with the recommendation of that eminent committee of the Senate chaired by Senator Nolin, with Senator Banks as deputy chair or at least as a member of the committee.

    ---
    Senate Report online:
    Committee Reports

    Conclusions & Recommendations" of the Senate Committee:
    Final Report - Volume III
     
  12. That's...slightly good news...at least some sensible people were elected..
     
  13. This is bad, Harper's threatening to kill one of the drug mecca's of the world.

    FUCK YOU HARPER, GTFO of my Canada, aren't you wasting valuable time you could be spending sucking Obama's dick?
     

  14. Harper and Campbell both.
     
  15. #17 FrankDiscussion, Oct 9, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 9, 2009
    The latest news on Bill C-15...

    Ottawa: Senate trains sights on second Tory crime bill - MedPot.net/Forums

    The Vancouver Sun
    Senate trains sights on second Tory crime bill

    Letters to the Editor
    Vancouver Sun

    Senate trains sights on second Tory crime bill

    By Janice Tibbets, Canwest News Service
    October 8, 2009 3:02 PM

    [photo caption] The Liberal-dominated Senate, a day after rewriting a Harper
    government crime bill, signalled that it will alter another piece
    of law-and-order legislation that would automatically jail drug
    dealers and marijuana growers for the first time in Canada.


    OTTAWA — The Liberal-dominated Senate, a day after rewriting a Harper government crime bill, signalled that it will alter another piece of law-and-order legislation that would automatically jail drug dealers and marijuana growers for the first time in Canada.

    A Senate committee grilled Justice Minister Rob Nicholson on his proposed legislation Thursday — particularly an element allowing drug pushers in six Canadian cities to escape jail time if they go through drug treatment courts — an option that is not available elsewhere because drug courts exist only in those cities.

    "How can you bring in all of these minimum sentences and say, if there are drug treatment courts in your area, you won't have to go to jail for the minimum sentence?" Liberal Senator George Baker said after the hearing.

    "I think definitely amendments will be put forth by Liberal members and by Conservative members."

    Judges would have leeway to exempt certain offenders from jail, provided they enter treatment programs imposed through drug courts that exist in Vancouver, Edmonton, Regina, Winnipeg, Toronto and Ottawa.

    Conservative Senator Pierre Claude Nolin, an expert in drug policy, warned Nicholson that the Senate legal and constitutional affairs committee intends to put his bill — a centrepiece of the government's law-and-order agenda — through "rigorous" scrutiny.

    [note: Pierre Claude Nolin chaired the committee that studied cannabis and recommended legalization --> http://www.senatereport.ca ]

    The committee's signal that it will not rubber-stamp the contentious legislation came only a day after Nicholson blasted the upper chamber for "gutting" another bill that would eliminate a judicial practice, when sentencing offenders, to credit them on a two-for-one basis for each day already spent in detention.

    The bill has the support of the opposition parties in the Commons, including the Liberals.

    The Senate actions have become a political football in the House of Commons, where Prime Minister Stephen Harper accused the Liberals on Thursday of pretending they support crime bills, only to stand by while they are stymied by their unelected counterparts.

    "What the Liberal party should do . . . is go down to the Senate and, instead of playing this two-faced game where they pretend to support tough-on-crime legislation but block it in the Senate, they should tell their own senators to be honest with the Canadian people, to pass that legislation and stop letting criminals get away," said Harper.

    Liberal MP David McGuinty countered that the Conservatives are revelling in the Senate scrutiny because they can use it as a springboard to reinforce their tough-on-crime message and take aim at their Liberal opponents.

    The drug bill sailed through the House of Commons earlier this year after the Liberals teamed up with the Conservatives, despite grumbling within Grit ranks that they were being told to support a bad bill so they wouldn't be accused of being soft on crime.

    "We're just exercising sober second thought," said an unapologetic Baker, who added that senators don't have the same political pressures as MPs.

    The bill would also strip judges of their discretion on whether to incarcerate drug traffickers, including offenders who grow and then sell as few as five marijuana plants.

    The proposed legislation was lambasted by 13 of 16 witnesses who appeared before the House of Commons justice committee during public hearings last spring.

    Critics have warned the legislation would flood jails and imprison drug addicts and young people rather than drug kingpins, who will continue to thrive, while small-time dealers are knocked out of commission.

    The bill would impose one-year mandatory jail terms for marijuana-dealing when it's linked to organized crime or a weapon is involved.

    Minimum sentences would be increased to two years for dealing drugs, such as cocaine, heroin or methamphetamine, to young people, or pushing drugs near a school or other places frequented by youths.

    The bill would enforce six-month minimum jail terms for growing five to 200 marijuana plants to sell, and two years for larger growers.


    © Copyright © Canwest News Service
    ---

    More info about Bill C-15:
    http://www.cannabisfacts.ca/mandatoryminimums.html
     
  16. Thanks for that update man!

    This can't be passed. Man...
     
  17. Liberal Senators may buckle and pass Tories' 'flawed' crime bills

    The Liberals voted with the Tories on drug bill because they're scared of being labelled soft on crime.


    The Hill Times
    Published October 19, 2009
    By HARRIS MACLEOD
    http://www.hilltimes.com/page/view/tories_flawed_crime_bills-10-19-2009


    The government's two crime bills currently held up in the Senate are "flawed," and could be unconstitutional, but the Liberals are afraid of being labelled soft on crime and Grit Senators may succumb to political pressure and vote against amending the bills, says a Liberal Senator who supports the amendments.

    "There is a real possibility that the amendments may be turned down by the Senate," said Newfoundland Liberal Senator George Baker.

    "And then the problems would cease and the bill would pass on third reading as it is, without amendment. And the same thing may happen to the Controlled Drugs and Substances Act [Bill C-15]."

    The two bills, C-25, and C-15 are part of the government's touted law and order agenda. The first bill, C-25, would eliminate the practice whereby convicted criminals can get two-for-one credit for each day they spend in pre-trial custody before being convicted. Critics of the law say criminals who know they will be convicted sometimes refuse bail and choose to remain in remand in order to shorten the total amount of time they'll have to spend in jail. The second bill, C-15, would bring in mandatory minimum sentences for drug crimes, which would change the law so that someone caught with as few as five marijuana plants would spend a minimum of six months in jail.

    Sen. Baker said he disagrees with the "general philosophy" behind both bills, but aside from that, he also said the bills contain enough legal errors to justify the Senate bringing in amendments. For example, Bill C-15 stipulates that if drug offenders agree to go to a so-called drug court, through which they can broker a plea deal that usually involves treatment and random drug tests, then they can get out of doing jail time. Drug courts only exist in six Canadian cities—Toronto, Vancouver, Edmonton, Winnipeg, Ottawa and Regina—and so if you don't live in one of those cities you don't have the option of avoiding jail. Bill C-25 says a judge does not have to explain why someone charged with a crime is refused bail, which Sen. Baker said was red-flagged by expert witnesses when the Senate Legal and Constitutional Affairs Committee studied the bill.

    The Conservatives have been attacking the opposition Liberals in the House of Commons and the media for the Liberal-dominated Senate holding up the bills. The Tories say it proves Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff (Etobicoke-Lakeshore, Ont.) and his caucus are "soft on crime," even though they voted to pass both bills.

    "What the Liberal Party should do...is go down to the Senate and, instead of playing this two-faced game where they pretend to support tough-on-crime legislation but block it in the Senate, they should tell their own Senators to be honest with the Canadian people, to pass that legislation and stop letting criminals get away," Prime Minister Stephen Harper (Calgary Southwest, Alta.) said recently in Question Period.

    The Senate Justice Committee voted to change the two-for-one law to time-and-a-half served, meaning convicts would get 1.5 days' credit for every day served pre-sentencing, as opposed to eliminating it altogether, which Bill C-25 proposes. The amendment would also give judges discretion in awarding pre-sentencing credits, and would require an explanation for their decision. No amendments have yet been proposed for Bill C-15, but they are expected to be forthcoming since the Senate voted to examine it in committee. Some of the Senators who proposed the amendments supported Liberal MP Bob Rae (Toronto Centre, Ont.) during his 2006 leadership bid, which led to speculation that Mr. Rae urged them to stall the bill to create headaches for Mr. Ignatieff, which Mr. Rae denied.

    Sen. Baker also said his colleagues in the Senate might not want to provide the Tories with any more ammunition to attack Mr. Ignatieff.

    "Liberal Senators may sit down and say, 'Look, the leader and the Liberal Party in the House of Commons is in favour of this bill. They don't want changes made to it. This is what the declaration was, so therefore we're going to vote against these amendments that the [Senate] committee has approved.' That is a real possibility," said Sen. Baker.

    Bill C-25 was unanimously passed in the House of Commons, but Bill C-15, which would change Canada's Controlled Drugs and Substances Act, passed without the support of the NDP and the Bloc Québécois. The Liberals joined forces with the Harper government to pass it. When the House of Commons Justice Committee studied the latter bill, witnesses were overwhelmingly critical of the use of mandatory minimums in relation to drug offences. A 2001 government report done by the Justice Department reached the same conclusions.

    "Mandatory minimum sentences in the U.S. [both at the state and federal levels] have imprisoned mostly low-level, nonviolent offenders. Drug consumption and drug-related crime seem to be unaffected, in any measurable way," the report said.

    Mandatory minimum sentences will lead to more overcrowding of prisons in Canada, and also remove some of the discretionary powers of judges and put them in the hands of politicians and the police, said Eugene Oscapella, who teaches drug policy at the University of Ottawa. He said that despite the overwhelming opposition from experts, and evidence that more comprehensive drug policy that focuses on treatment and reserves tough sentences for high-level drug dealers has been far more effective, the Tories and the Liberals are taking the path they believe is the most politically expedient.

    "Promising to get tough on crime, to get tough on drugs, it's easy. It fits on a bumper sticker. To explain why the use of the criminal law not only doesn't work but causes enormous harm to society, takes a lot longer," he said. "Obviously the Liberals think the Canadian public can't be trusted with the facts, and so they're doing exactly the same thing the Conservative government is doing. They're trying to out tough each other."

    Last week The Globe and Mail reported the government plans to increase the size, and budget for federal penitentiaries in order to accommodate the influx of prisoners resulting from the new crime bills. The annual budget for prisons has grown from $88.5-million in 2006-07 to $195.1-million this year. And is projected to reach $211.6-million in 2010-11.

    Prof. Oscapella, who testified before the House of Commons committee that was studying the bill in the spring, pointed to Justice Minister Rob Nicholson's (Niagara Falls, Ont.) remarks to the committee on April 22 as proof the government's only reason for bringing in the mandatory minimums is political. Mr. Nicholson was repeatedly asked what evidence the government had that mandatory minimums were effective.

    "We're absolutely convinced, from our consultation with Canadians, that this is exactly what Canadians want us to do. ... We have the evidence that Canadians have told us that," Mr. Nicholson responded.

    Past Liberal governments have put forward bills to decriminalize the possession of small amounts of marijuana, in 2003 and in 2004, but both times the bills ended up dying on the order paper and were never reintroduced. Liberal MP Keith Martin (Esquimalt-Juan de Fuca, B.C.), who abstained from the whipped vote on bill C-15, said his party supported the legislation because they're spooked by Conservative attacks that they're not tough on crime.

    "That's an Achilles heel for the Liberal Party, that we're perceived as being soft on crime when we're not. And we have done an appalling job of communicating what we have done," he said.

    NDP MP Libby Davies (Vancouver East, B.C.) said the Liberals missed an opportunity to show they weren't buying into the Conservatives' "politics of fear."

    "People are fearful about drug use in their neighbourhoods, parents are very worried about their kids, and what the Conservatives do is play on that fear," she said. "Instead of having an honest debate about drug policy and what we need to do in our society they say, 'Oh, we'll just come out with a tougher law'."

    Once a mandatory minimum law is on the books it's not easily repealed in the future, and most Canadians don't believe marijuana possession is something people should be sent to prison for, said Ms. Davies.

    "There's loads and loads of people who are very worried about their kids, or young people, or students having a sentence because they pass a joint to someone. ... The thousands of Canadians who have convictions just from marijuana, simple possession, is huge. I think people are very concerned about that because they don't see it as something that should result in a criminal record."

    A 2007 United Nations report found that Canadians use marijuana at four times the world average, making it the leader of the industrialized world in consumption of the drug. The report revealed that 16.8 per cent of Canadians aged 15 to 64 smoked marijuana, while the world average is 3.8 per cent. Canada ranks fifth in the world for marijuana use.

    news@hilltimes.com
     

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