Nope, I never said that. To begin with, morality is subjective, however, most cultures that share universal moral laws have always shared them and always will. Whether there is religion or not. I never implied morality would necessarily improve without religion, you are the one claiming it is declining because religion is declining.
Without religion how can I judge what is right and wrong for myself? I need god, some anthropomorphic figure in the sky, to get people with controlling interests in mind to write a book ambiguously describing things that will send me to burn in a fire forever so I, the oh so ignorant and helpless human, can discern between right and wrong, so I can have a moral compass. I want other people to interpret this book and tell me what it means because fuck doing that on my own. Give it to me straight Mr. Preacher man. And then fuck some little boys in the ass after your sermon. Oh and here's some money so you can buy shit your church doesn't need.
Double posting, but this is in response to your edit. Read what you type or articulate your points better. You said gays do spread AIDS more then later basically agree that if there were as many homosexuals as heterosexuals that would be the case. Even if that were true, there aren't more homosexuals than heterosexuals and therefore gays don't spread AIDS more. If you want to talk about the percentage of gay people versus straight spreading AIDS then use percentages, not make ignorant statements. Lets also consider that about half of the gay people in the world aren't men and aren't having anal intercourse. So, your percentage of gay humans spreading this virus is going to be even farther off than you think.
Do you know how many times I've heard the same thing from countless people. Yeah, cause every single preacher fucks little boys. If I were to tell you every single non-religious person was a selfish cunt, you'd be offended right? Good. As am I. My uncle is a priest with three kids and he doesn't fucking rape children you cunt. Nor does my priest at my church. Nor does my girlfriends priest at her fucking church. You moron. All I said is that without religion "forcing" people morals, morality has gone down. Todays society is fluttering with sex for the sake of sex, not love. People like this guy saying priests are pedophiles cause he probably saw a joke of it on some bullshit TV show and assumed it's true. Gangs, corrupted politicians, etc. I honestly HATE society now. Loved it before. I hate the mindset people have without religion. Oh be one with yourself, you can do whatever YOU want, make stupid decisions, yadda yadda yadda. At least with religions people cared about there fucking actions. Now, people are just selfish and looking for nothing but a good time. Thus, underage sex, drug use, and crime have all risen. Deny it or not. Just take one good look at US Public School teenagers. Please do. Then tell me society is okay. Hey, maybe I'm wrong, maybe it isn't the lack of religion doing this, but I still say society is falling apart. EDIT: With religion out of the picture there are becoming more and more gays. Thus, easier spread of diseases. What if one day there are as many gays as straights? Imagine the rapid increase in AIDS. It's honestly a fact that anal intercourse spreads AIDS, and STD's much much much easier then vaginal intercourse. Gays have anal more so then straights. More gays, more disease spread. Though, I feel bad saying this cause I'm really not against gays at all. So I guess it is what it is.
Please show evidence that anal sex spreads AIDS more than vaginal. Even if that nonsense were true there are most likely more heterosexuals engaging in anal sex in the world than gay men. I love how you post anti-gay propaganda but make sure you remind us that you're not really against gays at all in nearly every post.
It's not religion, although I get why you think that. At least with religion, when it works well, provides some kind of moral compass. No, not religion per se, but those who reject or turn away from religion, often let go of the god idea too, and that is the problem. The two are so heavily intertwined, that rejecting Christianity, especially if one once was one, usually lets god go too. Understandable. But those who find and keep a personal connection, don't suffer the pitfalls you describe. I can't say there are more Gays or less Gays, and I doubt it has anything to do with religion as this is something you are not something you become. Perhaps more people feel free to be themselves without religion judging them all the time, so in that sense, they are far better off. But if you replace God with consumerism, which many seem to do, or just do, then where do the moral role models come from?
You have all posted great responses and have got me thinking. I'm at work and can't carry this debate on any longer it's hard to keep up and pull out information. It's just that my original point was, less religion, less morals, more gays and easier spread of diseases. I myself don't even know if I believe in God or not. I just have noticed with the decline in religion, it seems people care about things a lot less. Which to me, isn't a good thing. Maybe I am wrong, it's my opinion though. It's what I've read, learned, and seen in my life. That society isn't what it used to be. To be honest I learned that originally in my school. I've also read about it on sites, been informed by family members, etc. I'm not anti-gay, and I was just proving a point that less religion, more gays, more disease. I'll admit that that is the weakest of points because I know they practice safe sex as well, and there are a lot less gays then straights and it isn't a very serious problem at all. It was just a point. I don't agree with gays personally, but I don't hate them and I do agree with same sex marriage. Love is love. Who am I to tell them to not love each other. Feces carries diseases more so then vaginal liquids do. How can you say that isn't true? Here I'll post this to back this up but wiki-answers isn't the best site to use, but still. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_is_anal_sex_more_likely_to_spread_disease_than_vaginal_sex
You too esseff? There is no evidence that as more people reject the idea of a god there is more immorality. In fact, there are less atheists in prisons than anywhere else. Other traditional forms of immorality that non believers may engage in, as I've mentioned, are subjective and you know this.
My comment wasn't directed at you but thanks for the input anyway. Don't pretend I'm the only one generalizing here. It's a shame you have such a negative view on society. Sure there are plenty of bad parts about it. But in reality there is a lot more kindness and beauty in it than you may realize.
I really hope that is true, but because of people I've meant and things I've experienced in today's society, I really don't like it. Maybe I am wrong, maybe society is okay. Then again, from what I've seen, maybe it's not as nice as you think.
This post ^ showed me you aren't insane. Glad you made that, I was actually beginning to wonder. If you are working, I won't continue this discussion until you have more time. But when we continue it, you need better evidence for AIDS being passed easier through anal sex than a wiki answer page which has no credibility and has nothing to do with AIDS transmission.
For people confused about God, I found this interesting site but haven't been able to read all of it. Give this a read. http://realtruth.org/articles/070601-006-teog.html
That's the problem, Jesus was not GOD, he was the son of god, this "god" was never nailed to any cross. Either way, I am not agnostic, I am not an atheist, I have no religion, unless, I could make my own, which I wouldn't, I just have my own types of beliefs. There is in fact a "god". Whether it is a person, or a being, or nothing, who knows. We didn't just come from thin air, we had to be created by someone or something, whatever that was, is what I consider our "god". But I do not worship any such thing, because I don't believe in devoting your life to something that gave you life in the first place. You were given your life to live it, not devote it to whatever gave you that life, I am sure that was not the intention. Also, for those who believe in evolution, that still holds the question "Where did life come from?" What did life evolve from? No one knows where exactly life started, but something had to create it, if it was the matter in the sky, so be it, then that is "god", but I will not follow any certain rules or regulations, just because HUMANS tell me that god said to do it. Final verdict? There is a god, imo, not any type of god you guys put him or her or it out to be, but whatever created us, whether it be life, something beyond life, or something unexplainable that will never be discovered, that is what I consider "god", but I do not worship no such thing, I live my life on my own jurisdictions. ---- Life after death? I also have my own theory on that, it's borrowed from the Buddhist "Reincarnation" theory. I also have another weird theory on it, but i'll save that for later. I believe we do die, and we do in fact release our souls. Ever hear someone say "I can see the light!" right before they die, or close to death? I believe that's because, what they are seeing, is their soul leaving their body(possibly through the face, eyes, or mind?)and when the soul leaves the body, it will travel for another vessel to live in. Our souls are eternal, WE are our souls, but we are also the mind, let me explain. In my theory, I believe that every body is just a vessel. You got the brain, the heart, the blood and water, the tissue, the skin, the visions with the eyes, yada yada, you get where i'm going. Our souls take over these vessels at a very young age(possibly a newborn baby)and then our souls control the body and give it personality, knowledge, strength, etc... Our body is just a big machine, for souls to find and control so they can live another life. When we die, it is because our SOULS know, that the current body we are in, cannot take much more and we need to release out of the body and find a new one, to start a new life over again. This is why death occurs(natural death), it is when the soul decides that this body will not aid you anymore in this life, so they let go of the body, and find a new one. A body without a soul is just an empty vessel. Thus, it eventually decays and turns into bone. Now, when the soul leaves and finds another body, they search for newborn babies, you know why? Because newborn babies don't actually have souls to start out with, they are just machines, like I said. Programmed to eat, sleep, and shit, so they can stay alive. When the soul finds the newborn baby, and takes over the vessel, that is when the baby starts to have characteristics and personality(because of the soul)and it starts to do more than just eat, sleep, and poop. You ever notice when a baby just automatically starts learning how to walk, talk, lie, steal, have an attitude, etc? Right out of the blue? That's because the soul has finally found a body, and is working on making the body it's own. The only way to do this, is for the soul(you)to train this new body so you can live with it, that is what babies are for, they are the easiest to train and control. Okay, so that explains my theory on what happens when you die, and how you keep on living. But that still begs the question, why do we forget our past lives? Heres my theory on that: I believe that, souls have no memory, when a soul enter a human, and lives their life, all of that humans life is embedded within that humans brain. So, when a soul leaves a human for the last time, the soul will also leave that humans brain and all of it's memories inside of it, behind. So when a soul finds another body, it is a new brain, therefore, memories are fresh, and you will have to start from scratch. The only thing that keeps our memories, is the all powerful brain, and the soul can't take that with to it's next life. ----- Now, that brings up yet another question: Can our souls enter the bodies of animals or other species to live a new life in? I believe that they can NOT do this. I believe souls are divided up in groups, we are the human souls, we can only enter, and leave, other human vessels in order to live. That is just my theory. ----- Now for the last question: Does karma matter? The reincarnation theory suggests that, based on the good or evil things you did in your last life, will determine the outcome of your next one. I do NOT believe in this theory at all, but, it is just a theory, so here is mine: I said earlier that you leave all of your memories behind when your spirit leaves the vessel and moves on. This would also mean, if you were a mean person in your last vessel, and you leave, then you will be leaving all of your mean memories inside your last life, and they will not carry on to your next one. Every life is brand new, it's like picking a number out of a hat, you never know what your going to get. I have two other theories on this as well: 1. ANOTHER theory of mine, that supports the Buddhists theory, is that yes, karma DOES carry over, in a way. I also mentioned earlier, that spirits give personality to an empty vessel, such as a newborn, would this mean that good or evil could be considered a personality? If so, this means that some spirits are just bad spirits, and some spirits are just good spirits, and some spirits are both. When a good spirit gets a hold of a new vessel, does this mean that the new vessel it overtakes automatically will become a good person in the future? Possibly, if your soul was created to be good, then this would mean every body you enter, will grow up to be a good person, because your soul is pure. The same could be said about a tainted spirit, if there are bad spirits, this would explain the bad people in our world. 2. My second(or third)theory on this subject, is that our spirits all start our pure, and each toime we enter a new vessel, and do something bad as that new vessel, our spirits will then be tainted with a little bit of evil. This would mean, for example, let's go to the beginning of time: - New pure soul is created, enters a body, does bad things as he grows older in the body(doesn't know any better, it's a NEW soul) - When the body dies, the soul is then cursed with something bad for the next body he/she enters(I also believe souls have no gender until they enter the male or female body, but even then, souls are just souls, only the bodies are girl or boy) - When the soul enters the new vessel, the soul will then have to deal with some type of curse or bad luck, that it earned in its past life. - If the soul gets past all the bad in this life, and does good, then the soul will get marked with a gift(Extreme knowledge? The ability to fight with superhuman strength or reflexes? A big dick? Who knows, it's just a theory), and when the soul enters the next body, that body will have a gift and depending on how the soul uses that gift in that body, will determine if the souls NEXT life will have a curse or a gift to it. This could be one way of looking at it, or you could look at it the other ways I have mentioned. ------- Okay, i'm going to stop now...didn't realize how long this post was until now, lol. One last thing before I go, though. I just wanted to point out, so I don't start any flame war, that this is in fact JUST my OWN theory that I made up one day when I was stoned, and I have stuck with it ever since because it just makes sense to me for some odd reason, I don't know why... Oh, I also wanted to point out something about that newborn thing. When a soul tries to find a newborn and what not? Possibly, the soul searches for pregnant women instead, and take over the baby while it's forming inside of the stomach? Then, it takes time for the soul to get used to the new body when it's born, which is why a baby doesn't have much of a personality right off the bat. This, or the other thing I said, I stick by both, because I don't know, so I try to keep my mind always open about new ideas and theories about things we will never know until it happens. One last thing, don't think of me as religious, because I am NOT, I hate the whole idea of religion, but I still have my OWN beliefs, that I do not try to put off on anyone else, these are things that I myself think are true. Criticize me if you wish, and waste your time for trying to argue about a theory that you AND me know nothing about. Or you can open your mind to EVERYONES theories on this thread, and take every theory into consideration. One of us has to be right...lol
I can see how not having anything that is seen as greater than our ego can make those who have no moral compass within choose certain things over other things. They have a purely material view, and without religion in the game, having a purely material view promotes consumerism, and may promote greed, desire, lust. So while the answer is not religion, if it's a question of seeing life as nothing more than a decaying lump of meat, and consumerism reigns, I choose something else.
I agree there is no evidence that rejecting the anthropomorphic god leads to immorality, and of course there are less atheists in prisons the longer they're in there for, particularly if they're on death row. But not having a way of seeing life from an inner perspective, doesn't give those who lack morality, direction, empathy, that they didn't get from loving parents, a way of seeing things differently. Remember, big difference between religion and the god idea, and once the anthropomorphic aspect is released, finding a connection that makes the universe a conscious thing and therefore more than the ego, helps create the connection that exists between us. Seeing me as you and you as me, removes separation, creates less selfishness, more harmony, less hate, more empathy. Religion was supposed to do that, or help those who were along the way, but it became corrupted because it is man-made and too controlling.
and the point of that is? If you're not going to contribute to the discussion then nobody gives a fuck what you say anyway. Get on with your life.
Same old nonsense. He starts off by quoting the Bible, which is weird considering atheists don't believe the Bible. He quotes the book of Psalms and claims that "God said it" when in fact it was the author of Psalms who said it. He doesn't even give a reason why anyone should accept the Bible without question. He just quotes it and accepts it. Then he says "creation or evolution?" while ignoring the fact that many theists accept both. Then he equates cosmology with evolution, which are 2 totally different scientific fields. Lots of people do this dishonest tactic because they think their audience is too intellectually lazy to look it up. In short, he's writing for people who already believe in God in order to try and make them feel comfortable. He's not writing to convince any atheists.