Iron's Method

Discussion in 'Coco Coir' started by Ironhead, Apr 8, 2016.

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  1. You want to get down to whatever ppm you want goin so if you wanna put in 600 get it somewhere 5-600ppm I like to get mine 200ppm under my target just to know the salt is gone
  2. Okay i got it down to 600, & that's after feeding with regular strength again.

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  3. #1863 Ravenboy, Sep 20, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2016
    hope its ok to share a photo...

    since i transplanted them three weeks ago as 6 inch seedlings, these coco/perlite (top feed-recirculating) plants have been getting 7 1/2 gallons of nutrients a day.

    I am feeding 18 times a day, every 90 minutes, and each time they get 1.7 quarts, dumped on them in only 12 seconds

    1.7 quarts COMPLETELY saturates the coco/perlite. Most of it drains out in less than ten minutes. there is only 2.5 gallons of coco/perlite (50-50) in those pots. Lots of LST on them. they will be ready to flip when they double in height. In about 5 days.

    they stay VERY VERY wet, they never get anywhere CLOSE to dry, and because of the frequency of the feeding schedule, the root zone is highly oxygenated - growth rate is close to DWC rates.

    Fed with jacks 15-12-26 in tap water and nothing, nada, zip, zilch else, not even ph down (my tap water is perfect for jacks). It does not get simpler.

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  4. #1864 demonpuke, Sep 20, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2016
    Don't post your opinions on this thread if they contradict Iron, he will resort to name calling.
  5. #1865 STIGGY, Sep 20, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2016
    a true Guru
  6. #1866 STIGGY, Sep 20, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2016
  7. Now that is a funny picture right there

  8. Hey guess what? It's my thread and if you don't like it, you can get the fuck out.

    You don't see me going into other threads and telling them how to grow.. I would appreciate if you did the same thing here. A lil tact would have gone a long way in your initial post, but insinuating you know everything while I repeatedly fuck up is not gonna fly in here. Sorry.

    Any grower longer than a noob would know you can overwater your plants in coco if there isn't established roots before you start watering them heavy.

    Sorry you don't like my opinion on the matter, but once again, if you don't like it, don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out.

    That's all I'm really gonna say on it anymore.
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  9. Looks interesting enough eh? Forgive me if I'm still wary of the next "wave of the future" bucket..... didn't work out so great with the Hempies.

    Keep me updated tho, I'm intrigued to see how they progress thru flower.

    I always thought recirculating systems were more on the hydroponics side and need to have stronger nutrients added to them.. the GH feed chart calls for double the amount of nutrients given.

    Do ya just take the top off to check and adjust the ph?
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  10. @Ravenboy
    are you running drippers?
    any problem with clogging ?
  11. hey Iron where did you find those feed charts? The ones on the website look different?
  12. Iron do you PH the water when flushing with FloraKleen?
  13. Get out of this thread. No need for your bullshit here.
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  14. #1875 Ravenboy, Sep 21, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2016

    i hope its ok to share some thoughts and observations about coco, hempies, salt buildup and the like

    well hempies certainly aren't a wave of the future, they've been around about 20 or more years, even before they were so called invented by dalaihempy , they existed for growers not growing cannabis

    you had problems with hempies? thats odd. if kept wet the reservoir keeps the medium more moist which prevents so much evaporation, typically salt buildup is slower in a hempy. if watered to runoff AND the coco is never allowed to get dry

    you also said you had problems with 6/9. and that is also odd. there are so many growers using this in coco perlite with success (not so many on this forum, but on the other one i hang out on its VERY popular).

    both of these things - odd to me.

    coco and wetness:

    when coco isn't kept wet enough, the plant likes to grow soil roots. thats why when people think they've overwatered. they actually have one of two things going on

    plant has well established water roots, and is drooping - RH is either too low, or coco is too dry : solution = raise RH, or is under oxygenate so water it again. When a plant is growing fast, RH is crucial. a plant looks overwatered when the VPD is too high, the reason is that the internal pressure in the plant is too low due to transpiration. so backing off on the water won't fix this drooping. it makes the problem worse because when coco is too dry it shrinks and brake roots.

    plant has mostly soil roots and is drooping, RH is too low, or coco is too dry.

    solution = raise RH or let coco dry to get it oxygenated. watering it again WILL oxygenate the roots, however, you have soil roots, they don't like it so wet, even if it IS oxygenated - the problem here is that the plant CANT develop water roots until it can handle the water.... backing off on the watering makes the plant perk up, but does nothing to make it want to grow water roots. my experience is that establishing water roots at a young age helps a lot. then keep that little baby sopping wet, i water them several times a day even when only 3 or 4 nodes.

    and i went to recirculating because coco/perlite isn't the best choice for hand water DTW UNLESS you have the time to water more than once a day. I am retired, but hand watering isn't my idea of a way to spend a day

    my PPKs have NO salt buildup. there is so little time for it to get dry enough to evaporate, its just not an issue.

    so its pretty well understood that salt buildup in coco comes from evaporation, and most likely nothing else.
  15. more on Irons reply to me:

    jacks nute strength:
    most people run jacks at 600 PPM (.5 scale) regardless of the system - stuff is dirt cheap and requires no amendments. none. i add stuff when i hand water babies, but thats it now.

    the GH charts have always been a total JOKE. everyone complains about their charts - i nearly killed a grow trying their stupid charts - DOUBLE the amount .... haha - ludicrous - LOTS of threads online about these bogus charts. if you use these charts, go slow, work up to a strength, and read the plants is a good idea

    like their nutrients, hate their charts, don't like the cost of GH though. don't like adding a ton of amendments either. and the GH business model is to make somethings thats EASY into some kind of voodoo that you need all this crap ....

    PPKs....this isn't the next wave of the future either, these are well established, just not on this forum. many years these have been around... at least 5 years, several iterations of the design.

    there is nothing magic, its basically just top feed recirculating. many people use calcined clay as a medium (turface, floor sweep, kitty litter), others use coco/perlite.

    the pot has a tube coming out the bottom filled with perlite, its both a drain and a wick. no rocket science, but it has the effect of lowering the PWT so all the coco can be used by the roots, which won't grow well in that area under the PWT. if you eliminated the tailpiece, and used normal buckets you'd still get good results... the secret is oxygenation - the secret is ALWAYS oxygenation of the roots.... whether its hydro or not. and its the same secret for the top feed DTW you do on this thread.

    the plants don't need to be fed 18 times a day. but the roots like the oxygenation, so often, and i feed day and night.
  16. no. i cant deliver 1.6 liters in 12 seconds using a dripper

    the idea is that a large slug of water - as it descends into the medium, it pulls air in behind it from the top.

    1`.6 liters is JUST enough to totally saturate the coco/perlite in ten liters of doc /perlite, but not enough to float it. so every 90 minutes these PPK buckets have a 100% gas exchange taking place in the medium. old gas (oxygen deleted) for new (rich in oxygen)

    a dripper never gets you there. it can keep the coco moist, it just isn't as effective at oxygenation as a slug of water is. a drip doesn't flow thru the moist medium pulling in a lot of oxygen behind it

    so i have 900 liter per hour aquarium pumps and 1/2" feed lines. no clogging i assure you
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  17. Wow.. this thread.

    All over how coco is watered.. hmmm.

    Well I guess y'all have your opinions and I have mine.

    Now get the fuck out.
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  18. Just gonna reiterate that I've said to water less frequently during early veg and more frequently during flower.

    I guess the other guys that have actually grown this way that chimed in saying drying out helps some pots sometimes doesn't account for anything because we aren't scientists... but it works well for me.

    Skinny of it is that it's needed to have less water in veg and more frequent watering in flower.

    I never get buildup in my containers til about 2-3 weeks into flower. Now that's when I've. Even bumping the feeding up to 2 times a day and the plants are looking awesome!

    Easy way to go by is the ppm.. if the runoff is high,(like water at 600 and runoff is 700), you need to water more often.. if the runoff is low(like water at 600 and runoff is 500), you can water less frequently until it catches up to itself and the runoff ppm matches or is closer.

    Seems like I would like to aim for the ppm to be below what I'm feeding, that way I'm not washing out any nutrients out of the bottom.

    I think that's in a perfect world tho.

    So just go by ppm and the plant should tell you when the root system is developed enough for more frequent feedings.
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  19. Wait, I thought you had your own thread..

    Just in here to bash me and talk shit and show pictures of your fugly plants? Haha good luck with that.. hope these turn out better than your shit ass Hempie thread.

    We already know we don't get along and have different views.. why come in here to start more shit? For what reason? I see none.
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