I have this theory that i think goes well to what you're trying to get at.... Everything is pizza. Everything is just a variation a pizza. A book is simply pizza without tomato sauce, cheese, and bread, instead it is a pizza with paper and ink A dog is simply a moving, breathing, hairy pizza Pizza can be dug out in mines and sold for thousands of dollars on rings, but this is a rare variation of pizza Pizza can be experienced and perceived in an infinite amount of ways, Simply imagine all the pizza you haven't thought of or experienced In this sense pizza destroys all relativity and relations.
Yes it was perceived for a very long time before discovery, back in the 60's I believe. However, say 100 years ago no one could even imagine it. I think Idealism is a great theory, but philosophy and logic dictate that it can not so simply be proven.
Yea, but all a stick figure is a bunch of lines. What im saying is that i have not imagined this dog with 6 legs (outside of the stick figure now thanks) meaning i have no idea how close the legs are to each other, or even if they are legs and not something like arms. It was just something i said, not imagined or perceived.
I don't mean to really say that this question literally proves idealism; I just mean to say that the inability to answer these questions sure helps to make the case for our reality revolving around perception (and the subjective experience of it) a lot stronger than most would suspect or concede.
But you have to understand that the description itself is based on perception. The idea of legs and dog is all based on knowledge perceived through the senses. I myself am able to perceive a six legged dog pretty easily in my imagination.
Is this really your refutation? I say adadafafafa exists, but I didn't imagine or perceive adadafafafa... now, does that actually render adadafafafa an existent thing?
Well, the idea is that through simple evolution of logic and perceptual observation, one can ultimately conceive of the Higgs boson. Let's forget about the idea of time and get to the most fundamental layer of this. If something can be perceived, it essentially exists. Whether it is in the mind or the outside world. This gets into some deep eastern philosophy if we want to go down that rabbit hole.
I understand what you are trying to get at, as it is easy for you to imagine said dog with 6 legs, its easy for me to simply say the first thing that comes to my mind. Btw where do the other legs attach? The ribs?
Nah, the hips are extended and there are two pairs of legs attached. They aren't that useful, but they seem lie they would help function well as a means t jump long distances.
No....i didn't say said dog exists or will exist, cause i dont know if it does or will. Talking existance and idealism is kinda weird.
I swear, man... you're making this a lot harder than it needs to be. The slightest mention of a 'dog', 'stick figures', '6 legs', etc, irrevocably refers to perception.
Ok, that makes much more sense. It certainly seems that way, not going to go into too many details but it is possible that what we see actually does not exist. What's being argued is that if something can not be perceived it must not exist. This too can be supported, but it is much more difficult to do so. There are some more very interesting thought experiments like this but it's very late here, they are better saved for after I get some sleep.
Haha this is where it gets wacky. If something cannot be perceived it doesn't exist, but since we can perceive every possible thing, the things we don't perceive don't exist. Yet there's nothing in existence which we cannot perceive, meaning nothing doesn't exist? Meaning... Fuck I don't even know what his means right now.
No, that's not what's being argued... and that's where you're losing my point. What exists must be perceived, for, how can you define or delineate the existent of a thing without perception?
I do these types of things on purpose, kinda. You assume it refers to perception, but there are many different types of dogs, many types of legs, many types of stick figures as well. I didn't define what the dog looks like, what the legs on said dog looks like, or what color the stick figure was. Because i have not perceived or imagined said dog.
So because you can't observe something it means it can't exist? Or is it like thoughts, where they may not exist, because you can't see them?