How much light is too much? How can you figure it out. Is 2 600watts air cooled vented out too much for a 4x4 floor?
You can't really give them too much light, just too much heat. As long as you're cooling things effectively you'll be fine. Two 600's properly cooled will be fine for 4x4
You're stoked if your cooling is done effectively. Where light becomes too much light is when relative power consumption exceeds gained yield.
are you doing SOG or something? because it just seems to me that 2x600w is alot of light and heat for a 4X4 (closet?). no doubt if you cooled it properly you would have INSANE BUDS fo sho. sounds awesome, i say do it
You could put a million COOLED watts into that space if you wanted to(or could) Cant really have too much light, just too much heat. There does come a point of diminishing returns though, kinda like smokin pot. You can only really get SO stoned, then you are just smoking for the fuck of it. The two 600s should do nicely if you can cool it... What type lights are you using? One HPS one MH?
1200w in a 4X4 is going to yield some impressive colas. like foreal. when i started growing around three years ago i moved about 16 plants into a closet i had lined with mylar etc and had hung a 1000w hps and turned it all on etc, went to dinner and came back... my plants which had just started flowering (12-16inches) were fried! so as sad and pathetic as that sounds, i know how hot it can get! my thermometer at the time said 109 degress or some un godly number like that. BE CAREFUL you dont need a fire... not untill that bud is harvested and in a blunt that is
You have a good point. The more light you introduce the more chances you're taking as far as fire risk goes. It doesn't matter if they're cool tubed or not that heat has to go somewhere and with the introduction of more electricity one cannot rule out fire danger. 1200 w seems like a lot for 4x4 though. I have a 4x4 12 plant ebb and flow and all I use is a 600w. I mean, if you're stoked on more light and have the budget my advice would to just go with a 1000w.
Even w/o any budget for a 4x4 footprint in one room the 1K cooled is your best choice IMO. Use a very good bulb,fixture and ballast if you want the best penetration,lumens and color spectrum. I also use about a 4x4' footprint and use a Hydrofarm Radiant 8" AC(air cooled by a 757 cfm can fan/filter)Lumatek purple 220v. "E" ballast and a Eye hortilux Blue 5500K MH/Super HPS and THEY ARE the very best you will find for a 4x4. BTW my last grow was my 2nd and i did a 1.2 GPW with this setup.
I don't know about too much light, but here are some fun facts about the best light source we've got. And oddly enough, the most worshipped of our non-celestial bodies. "Solar constant" = Average total energy Earth receives via the sun. That's the short version. Long version found here ---> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_radiation The "Solar Constant" on Earth is - "roughly 1366 watts per square meter (W/m²),[2]" So there is a point at which the watts you are able to throw at a grow can exceed that of what the sun can provide. Which seems....... superfluous. Now Lumens are another thing. The "constant" in terms of luminance, our favorite star provides us with "approximately 100,000 candela per square meter at the Earth's surface." Since a 1000w Grow Bulb can create just as many, if not more, lumens as the sun, given the obvious spacial dissimilarities, you could technically far exceed the total lumens of the sun. All of this info. goes to why grow bulbs are made the way they are, for the application we're discussing. It also speaks to the relevance of good 'ol calcs for optimal Watts per Sq. Footage. Just my $.02
Source: Cannabis Lighting Types and Intensities I know this is an old thread but never it hurts to update, I figured this was the best place to post it since it defines how much light is too much. Lumen A unit of measurement of the total flow of light which is emitted continually from a source. One lumen is equal to the flow of light which is emitted from a very small wax candle. The common 40 Watt incandescent bulb emits some 400 lm (lumen). So the efficiency of that bulb is 400lm/40Watt= 10 lm/watt. LUX = lm/m2, the intensity of light which falls on a surface. Colour Temperature - measured in degrees Kelvin, the color of a light's output in relationship to the degree of heat applied to produce the specified colour of light. Daylight is measured around 5000 degrees kelvin If we direct all light from our 40 Watt lamp towards a floor area of 1 square meter the intensity of light on that area will be 400 lux, (400 lumen distributed over 1 square meter, 400/1 lm/m2 = 400 lux,) which is a little better than moonlight, but far away from the sunlight intensities we need for growing plants. The sun gives some 50 000 lm/m2 = 50 000 lux at the earth surface on a clear summerday. See the table below. The 40 Watt incandescent lamp is not only too weak for growing plants, it also has too little blue in its spectrum and is far too inefficient. Fluoroscent tubes and HPS and MH lamps are the better choices. Cannabis needs 24 hours of strong light for the first 4-6 weeks of vegetative growth. Then it needs 2 months of 12/12 hours of strong light and very dark, to flower and ripen. If they get less than 30000 lux they will still grow vegetatively but slower. And they will flower less, if at all. Light Requirements of "High Energy" Plants 1000 - 5000 lux Min. necessary for life 10000 - 15000 lux Min. necessary for consistent but sparse growth 20000 - 25000 lux Min. necessary for robust growth 25000 - 30000 lux Max. Efficiency for Sub Tropical varieties 25000 - 50000 lux Max. Efficiency for Equatorial varieties Plants need 25000-50000 lux too grow fast. 90000 lux Max. Sunlight Intensity on Earth's surface This is too much light, it is not good for the plant. Plants subject to intensities at this level or greater are at risk of "solarization," whereby photosynthesis is retarded. This can happen at noon on a clear Tropical summer day, especially at high altitudes. 140000 lux Sunlight above atmosphere (Solar Constant) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- More advanced theory: Scientific, but has many answers about how and why. Air Temperatures between 23C (70F) and 32C (90F) are ideal for growth; beyond 35C (95F) can adversely affect plants, retarding photosynthesis, and, in extreme cases, can cause leaf burn if a radiant heat source is nearby. Calculating with lumen, lux and efficiency: The cheapest and easiest solution to the beginner is to use fluoroscent tubes. The usual ones are 120 cm (48") long, and give at best 4000 lumen. *****Ed Note: If you care to get a light meter and measure the light from various distances to your flouros, you'll see immediately that you will want to keep the lights as close to the top of your plants as possible. ***** Your grow room must have at least these dimensions: 140 cm high (these plants get big, 180 cm is better, 120 cm long (to accomodate for the tubes), and wide enough, let's say 60cm (2 feet). The easiest is to build an extra wall, made of silver tarpaulin or wood. This wall is placed 60 cm from a real wall, to create a space of say 200*260*60cm for use as a greenhouse or rather two. Build the wall and divide the space up into two small rooms. Make some type of opening, so you can take care of your plants later. Put in ventilation and cover all inside surfaces with al-foil using a stapler. We want the light to bounce around in there until it finds a green leaf to do its work in. As much light as possible is needed for the growth of the plants. The ventilation consists of a 12Volt fan which pushes the warm air from the green house through a plastic tube which ends outside the house to let the warm moist and odors out. Instead of a fake wall you can disguise the green house as a very big bass speaker, stereo wall, tv-stand, cupboard or whatever. Buy the fluoros in ready-made units or do it yourself like this: Buy the bare necessities to put up fluoros, that is reactors, lighters, tube holders, lighter holders, wire.7mm, capacitors and connectors. Most of these devices have pushcontacts, that means you don't have to solder or screw much, just strip off the insulation from the cable and push it in. Put up as many tubes as possible in the ceiling of the green house. You might be able to get 6 tubes into every green house half. Every green house has a floor area of 0.60m*1.30m=0.78m2 With 6*4000 lumen you get 24000lumen. Divide by 24000lm with 0.78m2 to get 31000 lux, which is good enough. Use hanging mounts for the tubes, they are cheapest and easiest to use. They also make it easier to pack the tubes densely in the cieling or hanging at different levels, hanging only in the thin electric cables. If you manage to get 10 tubes into the top of the green house you get 40000lm/0.78m2= 51300 lux in there. As another example, let's take one of the most popular hps grow bulbs: Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 53,000 430 123.3 2000 16k Philips, SON T AGRO The Son-T-Agro gives out 53000 lumen. If we use a reflector to direct all of that light towards a floor area of 2 m2 we get a light intensity on that area of 53000 lumen/2 m2, which is 26500 lumen/m2 (=lux) We can see in table 3 above that it fits in: "25000 - 30000 lux =Max. Efficiency for Sub Tropical varieties". We add some daylight fluoros, 6 fluoros a 4000 lumen=24000 lumen. Divide by floor area 2 m2 to get =12000lumen/m2=12000lux Together the hps and the fluoros give 26500+12000=38500lux in the 2 m2 big grow room. see table 3: 25000 - 50000 lux Max. Efficiency for Equatorial varieties. This combination will draw 430Watt+6*40Watt+100Watt in the ballast units, total =530+240=770Watt of electricity. Our total efficiency is 53 000 + 24 000 lm divided with 770 Watt, which is 77 000 lumen /770 Watt = 100 lm/Watt At 38500 lux we have an illumination which is optimal for growth, Illumination Chart Light Intensity (lux) as a Function of Area Illuminated (m2) Light Source lumens 1.0 m2 1.5 m2 2.0 m2 2.5 m2 3.0 m2 3.5 m2 4.0 m2 1000W HPS 140000 -- -- 70000 56000 46700 40000 35000 600W HPS 90000 -- 60000 45000 36000 30000 25700 22500 400W HPS 50000 50000 33300 25000 20000 -- -- -- 250W HPS 29000 29000 19300 -- -- -- -- -- 1000W MH 115000 -- -- 57500 46000 38300 32900 28800 400W MH 40000 40000 26700 20000 -- -- -- -- For example, from this chart we can see that a 600W HPS used to illuminate an area of 2.5 m2 will result in a lighting intensity of 36000 lux. Note that this presumes that a reflector is being used so that all the light is being directed towards this 2.5 m2 area. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- LIGHT BULB PRODUCT LIST HPS Conversion Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 40,500 360 112.5 1900 24k Philips C150S63/RETROLUX 23,000 215 106.9 1900 24k Philips C215S65/RETROLUX 15,000 150 100 1900 24k Philips C260S64/RETROLUX High Presssure Sodium (HPS) bulbs Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 140000 1000 140.0 2100 24000 Philips C1000S52 Ceramalux 130000 1000 130.0 2100 24000 Sylvania LU1000 Lumalux 130000 940 138.3 2100 24000 IwasakiEyeSunluxUltraAceMHcnv) 90000 600 150.0 2100 24000 Philips C600S106 Ceramalux 84000 600 140.0 2100 18000 Sylvania LU600 Planta 53000 430 123.3 2100 16000 Philips Son T Agro 430W 51500 430 119.8 2100 18000 Sylvania LU430 Planta 50000 400 125.0 2100 24000 Philips C400S51 Ceramalux 50000 400 125.0 2100 24000 Sylvania LU400 Lumalux 47500 360 131.9 2100 24000 Philips C360S51/EW Ceramalux 45000 360 125.0 2100 24000 IwasakiEyeSunluxUltraAceMHcnv) 29000 250 116.0 2100 24000 Sylvania LU250 Lumalux 28500 250 114.0 2100 24000 Philips C250S50 Ceramalux 27500 225 122.2 2100 24000 Philips C225S50/EW Ceramalux 22000 200 110.0 <2100 24000 Sylvania LU200 Lumalux 16000 150 106.7 <2100 24000 Sylvania LU150 Lumalux 6300 70 90.0 <2100 24000 Sylvania LU70 Lumalux MasterColor (MH) Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 6200 70 88.6 3000 7500 Philips CDM70/U/M 6200 70 88.6 3000 7500 Philips CDM70/C/U/M 9500 100 95 3000 10k Philips CDM100/V/M 9200 100 92 3000 10k Philips CDM100/C/V/M Metal Halide (MH) bulbs Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 125000 1000 125.0 4200 12000 Iwasaki MH BSX/BU 1000 115000 1000 115.0 4000 12000 Sylvania MS1000/BU SupMetalarc 115000 1000 115.0 3400 12000 Sylvania MS1000/C/BUSupMetalarc 111000 1000 125.0 3700 10000 Philips MH1000/U/BT37 40000 400 100.0 4300 20000 Philips MS400/HOR 40000 400 100.0 5000 20000 Philips 5K High Output Metal Halide 39000 400 97.5 4200 20000 Sylvania MS400/HOR SupMetalarc 38000 400 95.0 4200 20000 Iwasaki MH 400 Eye Sunlux 38000 400 95.0 3800 20000 SylvaniaMS400/C/HOR SupMetalarc 34500 400 86.3 3200 20000 Sylvania MS400/3K/HOR Super Metalarc Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 23000 250 92.0 4300 10000 Philips MS250/HOR 23000 250 92.0 4200 10000 Sylvania MS250/HOR SupMetalarc 22000 250 88.0 3800 10000 Sylvania MS250/C/HORSuMetalarc 18000 250 72.0 3200 10000 Sylvania MS250/3K/HOR Super Metalarc Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 15000 175 85.7 4300 10000 Philips MS175/HOR 15000 175 85.7 4200 7500 Sylvania MS175/HOR SupMetalarc 15000 175 85.7 3800 7500 Sylvania MS175/C/HORSMetalarc 15000 175 74.3 3200 7500 Sylvania MS175/3K/HOR Super Metalarc Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 9300 100 93.0 4200 7500 Philips 4K Master Color ED-17 8500 100 85.0 3200 10000 Philips MS100/BU/BD/M/3K 7800 100 78.0 4300 10000 Philips MH100/U/ED28/HR 6800 100 68.0 4200 7500 Philips 4K Master Color PAR-38 Flourescent tubes, 48" Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 4400 60 73.3 3000 12000 Sylvania F48T12/D830/HODesigner 4250 60 70.8 4100 12000 Sylvania F48T12/D41/HO Designer 4250 60 70.8 3500 12000 Sylvania F48T12/D35/HO Designer 4250 60 70.8 4100 12000 Philips F48T12/SPEC41/HO 4250 60 70.8 3500 12000 Philips F48T12/SPEC35/HO 4250 60 70.8 3000 12000 Philips F48T12/SPEC30/HO 3700 40 92.5 5000 24000 Philips F40/AX50 Advantage X 3700 40 92.5 4100 24000 Philips F40/AX41 Advantage X 3700 40 92.5 3500 24000 Philips F40/A5 Advantage X 3700 40 92.5 3000 24000 Philips F40/A5 Advantage X 3600 40 90.0 5000 24000 Philips F40T12/ADV50/ALTO 3600 40 90.0 4100 24000 Philips F40T12/ADV41/ALTO 3600 40 90.0 3500 24000 Philips F40T12/ADV35/ALTO 3600 40 90.0 3000 24000 Philips F40T12/ADV30/ALTO 3500 40 87.5 4100 20000 GE Staybright 3500 40 87.5 3500 20000 GE Staybright 3500 40 87.5 3000 20000 GE Staybright 3400 60 56.6 6500 12000 Philips F48T12/D/HODaylight 3300 40 82.5 3000 20000 Philips F40T12HomeLightWarm 3300 40 82.5 4100 20000 Sylvania F40/D841 Desi800 3300 40 82.5 3500 20000 Sylvania F40/D835 Desi800 3300 40 82.5 3000 20000 Sylvania F40/D830 Desi800 3300 40 82.5 4100 20000 Philips F40/41U Ultralume 3300 40 82.5 3500 20000 Philips F40/35U Ultralume 3300 40 82.5 3000 20000 Philips F40/30U Ultralume 3280 40 82.0 5000 20000 Philips F40/50U Ultralume 3200 40 80.0 4100 20000 Philips F40T12HomeLightCool 3200 40 80.0 3500 20000 Philips F40T12HomeLightWarm 3000 40 75.0 6500 20000 Sylvania F40/D865 Design800 2325 40 58.1 6500 20000 Philips F40DXDaylightDeluxe 2250 40 56.3 5000 20000 GE F40/SUNSunshineFullSp 1900 40 47.5 3050 20000 GE F40PL/AQ/WS Plant&Aquarium 1875 40 46.9 3400 20000 Sylvania F40GRO/WS Gro-Lux 1600 40 40.0 na 20000 Philips Agro-Lite 800 40 20.0 6750 20000 GE F40PL Gro & Sho Mercury Vapor bulbs Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 60500 1000 60.5 4300 24000 SylvaniaH36GW-1000/DXBrWhDlx 23000 400 57.5 3500 24000 SylvaniaH33GL-400/N Warmtone 22000 400 55.0 4300 24000 SylvaniaH33GL-400/DX BrWhDlx 13000 250 52.0 3500 24000 SylvaniaH37KC-250/N Warmtone 12500 250 50.0 4300 24000 SylvaniaH37KC-250/DX BrWhDlx 8900 175 50.9 <3500 24000 SylvaniaH39KC-175/N Warmtone 8400 175 48.0 <4300 24000 SylvaniaH39KC-175/DX BrWhDlx 4500 100 45.0 <3500 24000 SylvaniaH38JA-100/N Warmtone 4100 100 41.0 <4300 24000 SylvaniaH38JA-100/DX BrWhDlx Tungsten Halogen Quartz double end lamps Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 22000 1000 22.0 <3200 2000 Sylvania 1000T3Q/CL 21000 1000 21.0 <3200 3000 Philips 1000T3Q/P/CL cl pl 11000 500 22.0 <3200 2000 Sylvania 500T3Q/CL 10500 500 21.0 <3200 3000 Philips500T3Q/P/CL ClPlusline 10000 350 28.6 3075 2000 GE Q350T3/CL/ULTRA 9200 400 23.0 <3200 2000 Philips 400T3Q/CL Clear 6000 300 20.0 <3200 3000 Philips300T3Q/P/CL ClPlusline Standard Incandescent Bulbs 110V/230V Lumen Watt lm/watt Kelvin Hours Manufacturer, Name 400 40 10.0 2000 1000 40 Watt Std. Incandescent Bulb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Equivalences: 1 lm/m2 (lumens per square meter) = 1 lux (lx) = 10-4 lm/cm2 = 10-4 phot (ph) = 0.093 lm/ft2 = 0.093 foot-candles (fc) 1 meter = 3.3 feet 1 square meter = 10.8 square feet 1 foot = 0.3 meter 3 feet = 1 yard = 0.91 meter
Nice cut & paste Qew, i think i've read that material on even a different website than you linked. Seems it gets around LOL Good info. all the same. I would point out for those reading..... on paper is one thing, in practice is another. Instead of taking all this at face value, put it into practice and draw your own conclusions. This is a good baseline to follow though.