Nobody was saying that... In fact if you read through the thread, you'd see i didn't include it as a question as i believe anybody with any understanding of the universe generally considers in a full gone conclusion already. Almost like an axiom, because of the sheer scales we are dealing with.
then what are we? we know the process that we are a product of is repeated hundreds of billions of times over in the void of space, the odds of there being other life are astronomical.
okay, you got me. obviously there is life in the universe on this planet...that doesn't mean there is life anywhere else. all the evidence in the universe can point to there being life everywhere in the universe, but until we find it, it doesn't exist.
we could have discovered it already, our world leaders could be hiding it. i leave no decision up to "we". until there is world peace there is no "we" imo. you have to pardon me, im not trying to argue. the world just sucks, im usually in my own. to me, every planet is alive, every star. i think of the universe as one big living soup. the question i concern myself with is whats beyond that, what is the shell of the universe, wtf do we make up? its a much more fun one to discuss. being that we are life, and we are in the universe, that suits me fine to answer the question currently at hand. i see your more logical way of looking at it though, and i can appreciate it.
BUT thinking we are the only life in the universe, or even considering the possibility that we are the only life in the universe, is almost suggesting we were put here, or were here for a reason, and from my travels, i think thats just derived from a christian/ religious mindset. i cant believe im conversing this well and havent been stoned in 8 days. not bad..
we were put here, by billions of years of evolution. im skeptical in believing that an educated person claiming our intelligent life is unique and perhaps the only one would reject the idea that simple life forms might exist. There is a big difference between the two. Try not to sound too condescending on educated christian/religious mindsets.
i dont like the words "put here". evolution is lie you said, a billion year process. we started out as retarded fish frogs and algae and shit. when all the different rays from the sun reacted with the dirt, and water of the earth, it created life. i think life is a product of harmony. from our perspective the sun and moon are the same size, this amazes me. from the looks of what were doing to the earth, we dont even belong here, we could be half alien half monkey who the fuck knows. i live in a realm of possibilities, and almost every religious, christian view, or mindset sticks to one thing, and it must be fact since a book says so. not for the sake of defying others, i will continue to condescend all of it if i choose to do so. which i do. all is nothing, and nothing is all.
sure theres other processes that i didnt mention that are a huge part why life came to be. but in a nutshell, this is how ive come to understand it. edit: feel free to elaborate if you know the details, because i damn sure dont.
Tell me this isn't turning into the "hot gases vs. sun rays" debate. I discussed this with a friend one night to no end. Can we jump to the end where we say, "Heat".
sounds good to me, although, if you think about it, a ray is defined mathematically as a line that has a starting point, shoots, and continues in one direction, just like anything coming from the sun. i was referring to x rays, gamma rays, and uv rays. giva*****break. i wish people would just express their own opinions instead of contradicting others'. edit: i did not shoot myself in the foot.
The time has come in this post for a hug: Paul Zak: Trust, morality -- and oxytocin | Video on TED.com /tangent
We were "put" here though as the result from evolution. "We" as in our cognitive minds, have only recently woken up in history. No we started off even much more simpler. DNA had to be created before life could evolve and diversify. I suggest you start here: The Miller/Urey Experiment along with: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1lHbCyZWt4&list=PLC0BF49A9FD6D92AB&index=5&feature=plpp_video"]Evolution of Humans Animated 4 billion years in 8 minutes Carl Sagan FileCabi net - YouTube[/ame] this sounds like religious propaganda. Life resulted from chemical reactions, which we could interpret as complete chaos! I hear this more and more, but we do belong here! The problem is that we are an arrogant race. another film i suggest watching: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2oXFWKpJiA&list=PLC0BF49A9FD6D92AB&index=4&feature=plpp_video"]THE SAGAN SERIES (part 2) - Life Looks for Life - YouTube[/ame] Therefore you should accept the possibility that we might very well be the only intelligent life form in the universe. You can still believe that life exists, but until proven, it is all just a hypothesis waiting to be tested. Remember, anything is possible until proven otherwise.
Light from the sun does not go in one direction, it goes in every direction. 1:50 to 2:30, but i suggest just watching the whole video. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmzHQljJ4bc&list=PLC0BF49A9FD6D92AB&index=21&feature=plpp_video]Feynman 'Fun to Imagine' 9: Big Numbers and Stuff... (Part One of Two) - YouTube[/ame] p.s. this man is my fucking hero.
You say it yourself though... if the history of the universe was a calender year we would only take up the last few seconds - and the universe will continue to have the resources available to produce the elements required for life long, long after we have been and gone, leaving almost no trace of our ever existence. Do you really believe that given the vastness of the universe only in its baby state that life is not merely an eventuality, and if it is, do you really propose it is rare enough to only evolve to one degree of intelligence in one unique location? Within the trillions of planets in the hundreds of billions of galaxies, is it likely that a species that only took a few million years to evolve to this status is alone in its position, despite the possibility of us finding /evidence of previous life on planets orbiting our own sun.. a mediocre star? You quote a Carl Sagan video yet we knew this the most, he realised the possibilities of the universe and was in awe of them.
Where did I say that in no way life isn't possible? We were talking about the possibility of intelligent life versus simple and complex life. I do not consider over 13 billion years (that we know of) a "baby state." A "baby state" would have been when stars could not remain stable. It took ~9 billion years to form our solar system, and another 4-5 billion years to get to this very moment in time. Yes, I do believe that intelligent life that human beings have is extremely rare which is what makes it so special. I do not deny the possibility that complex life is out there, but I think you skip over huge factors that helped with our own evolution. For example, do you not at least consider the dilemma of our moon size? Our moon is one of the biggest in comparison to the planet it orbits, yet this is never mentioned. Even further, the entire universe plays off of gravitational forces. Jupiter for instance, has a gravitational force on us. Even distance galaxies and stars have a tiny effect. We are not a species that took a few million years to evolve, it took over a billion. If you are going to use evolution, you need to go back to when it began. I either start at the beginning of the universe, or at the beginning of our solar system which is easier. In order for the human family tree, there had to be ancestors, which would require much more than a few millions years, lol. I was quoting him for his idea that maybe it is our race that spreads intelligence throughout the universe....
Well, if you consider the fate of the universe could be a heat death scenario where by every star either results in a black hole or burns out - eventually burning through all the available elements needed to produce stars - and that this fate is many trillions of years away. You could consider 14 billion years a baby state. Yes this is true there are many many factors collaborating to produce the desired effects for life on this planet. But then there are also trillions other other planets orbiting other suns. This is a large number, larger than you would be able to count to in your lifetime. If it could happen once in such a number then statistically it should be able to happen again. Also, just because earth's conditions are right for OUR existence doesn't mean other intelligent life couldn't sustain in an environment completely different to ours with other factors creating a different degree of equilibrium to survive. Well it took billions of years for all life to evolve, but we were referring to humans as the only intelligent life-forms. We evolved from early mammals which certainly aren't billions of years old... not all life came from the same kingdom or to quote your analogy 'branch' of a tree - many split off to create different phylum . If we were to go back to beginning of the universe then we are also allowing life on other planets that degree of time to. Did he really believe this? i am re-watching cosmos at the moment and sometimes his hyperbole and conjecture in the area of other life is almost too much. Agree with the smoke dude... if you couldn't tell i was high as fuarrk when i wrote that
Yes but this universe could be a stage from previously evolved universes. There could have been other universes that “banged†into existence but with much less matter and more energy (or more matter and less energy) so it was unable to sustain itself, and they kept collapsing in on themselves until finally an equilibrium was achieved. ...sike, who knows I do not like the term “baby state†because everything is contained in eternity. But we are the only intelligent life out there that we know of… therefore as of right now, the best and ONLY conditions for an environment to sustain life long enough for evolution to produce an intelligent species are that of Earths. Perhaps hostile environments create simple life forms like bacteria, but if that environment does not change, then evolution can not diversify. Yes but all life has a common ancestor, we all began somewhere. From there, life diversified.