From Where Do Your Rights Come?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by NorseMythology, Aug 15, 2016.

  1. This could just as well have been posted in the philosophy forum, but this is more pragmatic than philosophical i think, so here it is.

    Firstly, i should define the term 'rights' (feel free to argue this and anything else i say).

    Rights - the nature of ones ability if one were the only existing human being.

    So the only constraint would be natural laws.

    Now assume two such beings exist on earth. The same would apply no? One cannot kill the other being because one couldnt have done that if they were the only being (in keeping with my definition). One cannot own because ownership implies the included and excluded, since there is no one to exclude, ownership isnt a right.

    Ownership is a social contract, one could approach the other and ask them to agree that X should be exclusively considered to be ones possession. Since you rely on the acknowledgement of another, it isnt a right.

    Since rights preceed law/contracts and other human inventions, it would be illogical to say rights come from a government, religion, community etc.

    Such inventions can only secure, reclaim or diminish our rights, they cannot grant something that is antecedent to them.

    Some people (in the US) think our rights come from the Constitution/Bill of Rights, but that is a contract, a subsequent invention, just like governments.

    On a side note, can someone be bound by a contract they never agreed to?

    So, to my original question, from where do our rights come?

    Again feel free to argue any points i have made, or add your own, state tour own case, or what have you.

    Feel free to bring in any arguments from political philosophy (philosophers) but please state the arguement and dont assume everyone is familiar with the material.

     
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  2. From Where Do Your Rights Come?

    why?

    Norse Mythology naturally once they were Christianized ...lol
     
  3. I dont follow

     
  4. #4 jmick, Aug 15, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2016
    What?

    So do our rights come from being a person or something that the govt. bestows on us?

    Is that what the OP means...in a nutshell?
     
  5. I was making the case that our rights cannot logically come from governments, communities, religions, documents etc.

    So then from where do they come?

     
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  6. GUNS!!
     
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  7. Rights are a human invention, like morals, and religion .. and haven't always been consistent throughout human history.

    I don't believe in such a thing as universal rights, though I do believe that all living beings want to experience the greatest amount of happiness and the least amount of suffering possible. This is about the only thing all creatures have in common throughout the sentient living world. Whatever rights we decide to create should be based upon this premise.
     
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  8. "Rights are a human invention"

    Care to elaborate?

    "Havent been consistent thoughout human history"

    I would argue that it is the RECOGNITION of human rights hasnt been consistent

     
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  9. "Man is born free, and everywhere he is in chains."

    Figure that out and you done figured out all terrestrial matters as they pertain to the human enterprise.
     
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  10. One of the greatest minds of the 20th century has already covered this very well

     
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  11. For some reason youtube links arent working, what is the title of the video?

     
  12. Damn I wasnt aware. George Carlin: You have no rights.
     
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  13. Dude, I mean no disrespect, but how good is your life that you have time to think of stuff like this.
    I work crazy hours, play hard when I get a chance, and generally too busy to care about where rights come from.
    Life is what it is. Yes, allot of our rights have been constricted in The US, but the people are to blame.
    They use stupid reasoning when it comes to voting. Voting for somebody because of gender or race and no other reason is insane. Obamas race had nothing to do with him being a horrible president. He doesn't lie and do unlawful things because he's black, he does them because he's not a good person. How can the people support Clinton when her lies and deception have been chronicled for decades? Trump? Fuck if I know. If people used their heads when it comes to voting we wouldn't have the two candidates we have now. If people knew and understood the rights that we do have and voted people out when they try to take them away, the politicians would get the message. I'm free to work or not. If I don't want to work, I don't have to. I just have to live the life that comes with not working.
    I'm free to do pretty much whatever I want as long as it doesn't harm anyone else or break a law. I could have partied less in the 80's and got more serious about a career and probably been more successful. I make the decisions I make and have to live with the results. Too many people make decisions based on what they saw on Facebook or YouTube, or for purely greedy reasons, not for the good of the country. People will jump all over social media and demand a bakery close for not serving a same sex couple, or call for the head of someone that says Kim Kardashian has a fat ass, but our political figures lie and treat the people like we are idiots, and hardly a whimper from anyone.

    I see people claiming to be Democrat, Republican, independent or whatever. I'm American, I don't care what party you are affiliated with, I try to vote for the best person. This is still a country where if you work hard, have a good idea, you can still be successful. I can't speak for people in other countries as I have never been outside the US,
    but we don't have it as bad as people like to make it sound, and there is a reason people are trying to get into this country. I feel for people that are truly oppressed and are kept from making a living or having a life and I say If you can leave or sneak out, welcome to America. If you want to come though, do it legally and respect our country.

    Again, no disrespect meant from my opening line. If we were face to face, I would have said it with a laugh,
    passed the bowl, and proceeded to have a conversation and maybe see what other thought were boiling in the soup.
    And speaking of soup, as my buddy Skip would say, "shits as fucked up as a soup sandwich".
    As for where rights come from.
    I think they come from inside of us. People can live and exercise their rights to the fullest, or they can sit around
    complaining how our rights are being denied us or taken away.
    It's a lot more fun coming up with reasons why I should drive my truck through the mud than sitting around and saying I would like to drive through the mud, but then I have to clean it or I might get stuck.
     
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  14. My life isnt particularly great actually, i just have different priorities than most people i guess.

    Thank you for your perspective contribution!

     
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  15. The constitution does not grant rights, it simply states there are certain inalienable rights that we are endowed with by our creator. It is an acknowledgement by some very wise men that the government they formed recognized those rights.

    The government cannot take those away unless we surrender those rights, something too many people do.
     
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  16. So what you're saying is a being should have the potential to act in any way as long is it doesn't disable another human from doing the same? I'd have to agree
     
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  17. In a perfect world humans are born with their rights/freedom and documents such as the constitution are meant to protect our collective and individual rights by clearly outlining what they are, so that other individuals or entities such as government and police cannot violate them without consequence, imo.
     
  18. It isnt that we 'should' have the potential, we DO have the potential.

    Opinions may differ, but they should be as logically consistent and defensible as possible.

    For one being to dictate what another being can or cannot do, the former must believe itself to be superior to the latter. Before one dictates over another, they should examine the basis for their dominance over another.

    It is a sickness of the ego mind. That degree of unjustifiable arrogance that is worrying.







     
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  19. We do because we should.
     
  20. Before i disagree ill ask if you would clarify first

     

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