flush or wait? 51 days since flip multi-strain

Discussion in 'Hydroponic Growing' started by Shreder, Jun 28, 2017.

  1. heya guys 2 of my 4 unkown strains are looking real good before harvest and im wondering what r ur thoughts about flushing...

    its 51 days since flip and gender was obvoius at about 10-14 days so we're at about day 41+ counting from first pistils..

    the bigger girl is some kind of a hybrid with real mixed identity flowers look sativa though all veg it had very big indica leaves, was the biggest from the begining.
    looking at trichs its 50 maybe 60% milky
    tiny amber spots only on the head of 3-4% of the trichs.

    the second one looks really indica with small yet fat, dense buds with hints of purple!
    trichs are 60-70% milky and aome trichs became pink! is this common in purple genetics?

    they still drink their water and nutes..
    tiny bit of nute burn but took care of that already..

    im doing dwc bubbler

    so when do u guys think i should flush? wish i couldve taken some trich pics..[​IMG][​IMG]

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  2. We grow in soil and I flushed plants some in the beginning, but never could tell any difference so I stopped it. It's a massive process if you have more than a plant or two because of the ratio of water to soil you're supposed to run through them. We don't use a ton of nutes in our plants anyway and the whole point is to clean those out of the plant, so maybe that's why I didn't see a difference. But with a hydro setup, I would think you would wait until pretty close to harvest before doing it. If you stop their food too far ahead of time, they'll not fill out like they should. Those last couple of weeks are all about plumping up the buds. Just some thoughts here... Your buds look like they've done some pretty good stretching during flower. Get your lamp closer to the top of your plants to stop that or decrease it. You'll always have one or two dominant tops that will stretch more than others, but when your buds are long and skinny like this, it's a sign your lamp is not close enough. If you're having to hang your light high just to cover all the plants you've got going, you're running too many with it and need to add more even coverage of light so you can bring it down closer. But you get the most out of one when you can keep light and plant as close as possible ... without light burn. But really nice buds. Congrats. TWW
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  3. We use soil so not sure what the point is in the hydro setup that you should flush. We don't use tons of extra nutes in our plants so I don't even do it. Did notice one thing. Your tops looks like they've stretched pretty bad during flower. Need to bring your lamp closer to the tops of your plants during flower to stop that. You get the most out of the light and plant when they're as close a possible during flower. If you have to hang your light high just to cover all the plants you're flowering, you need to run less plants at a time or add more light to your flower space. One lamp can only handle so many plants, regardless of how many watts it is. And the further away from the plant the light is, the less good it does. How many plants you should flower or how large a space you can cover depends on the wattage of light you're running and how much sq. footage of coverage you have with that light at the correct height. We flower using 1000 watt HPS lamps but only run 2 plants per lamp. They need space during flower to spread so light can penetrate the plant and develop out all the buds below the tops. The light will only penetrate the plant so far anyway, but you don't want only the tops of your plants to develop out. Just something to think about. When I started, I thought it was all about the number of plants I could fit into the space I had. I quickly realized that was not the case and I was just shooting myself in the leg as far as yield goes. Had to quadruple the number of lights I had in the space and more than half the number I thought I could flower at a time. By doing that, our plants produce several ounces each (averaging around 5 at the moment), after harvest and cure. I'm sure this is setting no indoor grow records, but the quality is superb and I'm happy with that for the time being. But harvest and development is all about lights and nutes are nothing but plant food. When you learn how to use both to your benefit, you really start to see good yields from plants. But you really have beautiful buds here. Best of luck to you and happy growing. TWW
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  4. hey man thanks for the insights, i use a 400w hps cooltubed with a distance of 30cm +- from the canopy of the big plant ur speaking of.. temps are ridicolous hige at 28c with ac on full power
    im using this 400 and another 250w.. so 4 plants over 2 lamps ic what u mean though... she gave me foxtails i couldnt figure why.. and yea ok that pretty rests my case as i was thinking to just start flushing when i c 90-100% milky so within a 7 day flush ill have some ambers... whats ur opinion about the pink trichs though? and the amber spots on the head of the trichs

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  5. Never.
  6. y comment just for the sake of commenting bro?

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  7. Lol - not at all - I don't do that. I just answered your question with a simple answer. You asked when you should flush and my answer was never - I never flush and I don't think anyone should. Withholding food in the last 2 weeks of flower would be counter productive.
  8. so basically ur going against the majority... i like it. but how so?

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  9. If you do some research you will find that I may not be the minority. There are lots of flushing threads to browse through and you will find passion on both sides. After years of listening to the bickering I decided to do my own experiment on my last grow - and I'm not the only grower that has done personal experiments. I had 2 plants of the same strain - both equal in size - one I didn't withhold nutes at all and the other I flushed with water for the last two weeks. After drying and curing there was absolutely no difference in appearance, taste, or smoothness. And for the black ash/grey ash people I took a pic of both with about a 3/4" ash and they were exactly the same. Bad taste is caused by chlorophyll and if it's dried and cured properly, that's the key to good tasting and burning weed. Flushing has been debunked by a lot of people for awhile. Vegetable farmers don't flush before harvest. There is currently a good flushing thread in the Advanced Growing Forum titled - Flushing is unnecessary - it's pretty informative.
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  10. your comment is now super appreciated mick, thanks! could u be so kind and link me to that post?

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  11. #13 Dumme, Jun 28, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017
    It's not a majority, it's just the majority of what you see. What youre speaking of is called "fading" or "final flush", not flushing. This topic is a highly debated topic. Flushing is to cleanse media, by pouring large amounts of water through it, and is generally only done if you have nutrient buildup in your media. Generally 2-3 times the volume of the pot, in water, is used. After the buildup is cleansed, you go back to your normal fertilizing.

    Realistically after a one or two times flushing, there isn't any nutrients left within the media to flush, so you're not flushing anymore (with respect to organics, like soil). After that, you're just starving the plant of the ability to make plant food by starving the soil and the roots ability to make uptake.

    "Fading" or even starving, is another technique some farmers use to essentially start the curing process on the plant, before harvest begins. Why this is debated is be a use you could potentially loose much of your yield, for an effect that's not needed if you cure properly.

    I teach, to feed correctly, grow correctly, dry correctly, cure correctly, and nor final flush is ever needed.
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  12. thanks alot dumme. so where does this idea of flushing or final flush came from? the best case ive heard is that the plant itself absorbs a lot of nutes and salts and once the water is empty from nutes it will force the plant to give "everything its got"

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  13. It's kinda a complicated subject, and I'd first have to explain how a plant works...

    First of all, nutrients are not food. Plants make their own food called "photosynthate", from the nutrients. Its a part of the photosynthetic activities the leaves do.

    Nutrients dissolve in water, then free flow up the xylem, to the leaves, in a process called "transpiration". one the way, some immobile nutrients are used in various parts of the plant. Xylem is dead "phloem", and is the woody inner part of the stem.

    Once the nutrients reach the leaf, the fun starts. The mobile nutrients enter into the chloroplasts and feed the photo system engine, that consists of PS2 & PS1. This is very complicated, and would sooner be learnt from youtube, and here is a video:

    ATP is the driving force in this process, and it takes a bunch of it to make G3P and carbohydrates (later photosynthate. You may have heard people say "leaves store nutrients", well, this statement refers to the nutrients caught in these PS1 & 2 systems, in the continuous cycle.

    From here, osmosis carries "photosynthate" from areas of high pressure (source cells) to areas of low pressure (new growth).

    While the leaf is young and growing, its still a "sink", so not only is the raw nutrients from the xylem adding to the process, but photosynthate is also creating new chloroplast with ATP (this is where "mobile nutrients" comes to play, by nutrients moving from older leaves to newer ones). Eventually as the leaf grows, the "sink strength" dwindles and the leaf turns into a place of only "source cells". At this point it has only the ability to feed where osmosis carries the photosynthate.

    Keep in mind, the nutrients from the xylem continue to deliver raw nutrients to the leaf this whole time, and should be enough to maintain the "photo systems" engine within the leaf, **BUT**, if you stop fertilizing, the plant cant maintain the "photo systems", and chlorosis will occur first (yellowing), and decay soon after.

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  14. Your plants look like they have two or more solid weeks of growing to do op.
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  15. As @MickFoster suggested, "chlorophyll" is the number one reason suggested for harsh smoke. I suspect this information was carried over from tobacco farmers to cannabis farmers, and also what I find to be true. Here's tha catch, chlorophyll breaks down over time, regardless; no special steps required. This is the reason why non-faders, suggest feed & cure properly, and no flush is required.

    Good luck..
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  16. #18 Shreder, Jun 28, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017
    heya dumme if u know that by heart ur def not a dummy ;)
    fascinating stuff for the new grower.. unfortunately english is not my mother tongue so ill have to watch these vids 3-4 times lol..

    but yeah i get it better now, thanks. will def give them more time with nutes...

    how bout those pink trichs and overall when would u chop an unkown strain? i like my high more equal body and mind..

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  17. Noone can really tell you when to cut, as this is mainly personal preference. I recommend +25-50% amber.
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  18. ok thats what i thought... how bout pink trichs on purple phenotype?

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