Two ends of the same circle really, so close they are almost the same. For a while this issue seemed at odds to me. How can there be a need to dissolve the ego, let it go, yet understand and accept there will still be one, and yet have something I don't need, and still walk the path without needing to let go of doing so. A paradox it seemed. Then I realised that while both paths are necessary - the path of intention and the path of surrender, eventually they'd have to merge into one unified whole. The intention to surrender, and the surrendering of intention, so that what is left, has elements of both, as well as something that goes beyond it. The seeker is usually drawn to follow one path or another, but few are drawn to both, and even fewer understand what each really means at their highest level, and even fewer still realise the results of reaching the apex of that journey. No more conflict, no more struggle. All things make sense when both sides are in balance. While this may not be quite how things are right now, it feels much closer than it ever was.
the way i think of it sometimes is that the ego is really just a term...say for example a term for your "self"...when you are still in duality and have not made it back to oneness you see yourself as seperate..so if you are seperate then there is competition...the seperate ego is in competition... when you realize yourself to be one with "god" and complete your journey it is not like your ego is no more it is just completely changed...it now has a new perspective
Duality is the problem. You see "self" and ego as separate. But even "duality" and "unity" are ideas that come from duality itself. The ego is an idea used to explain the part of you that is separate from your "self", but they have been one in the same the entire time. So, in essence, the ego never existed. But the dualistic mind cannot comprehend this, because it will always think in terms of polarities. The ego is like a layer of ice on top of an ocean. It gives the reflection of the limitless sky, but in reality, it is water, just like the ocean. It is not separate from the ocean. When you realize this, you realize the reflection of the sky was a mere illusion and never existed.. only in the mind. This is where you realize "unity", that all is one, that the water below is the same water that is above, in the clouds. And the same water that is in the soil, the plants, the fruit, and you. So, the ego exists as much as a reflection exists. To lose an ego, or to "spiritualize" it, means it has to exist first. But it doesn't, only in the mind.
If I could, at all moments of my day, understand "isness" and bypass the notions of duality, well...I'd understand a lot more about reality.
I say, duality does exist, it is the constant, and the positive. It's one thing and one direction. It is the Tao that moves forward. It is the way, that never ends, always in harmony, always balancing, always there. The noun and the verb. But it's joy that brings adjectives life.
Nice. I see the ego not so much as being separate, but what we use to perceive the way we interact with the world. We all recognise someone with a huge one, so it's not as if the idea of ego doesn't have reality regardless of what it actually is. For those who embark upon the 'spiritual' journey, they often come across the need for dissolving the ego, or at least the idea of doing it. This creates a certain mental construct about what it is and how to do it, thus reinforcing our dualistic nature. Whereas, by learning to understand what the ego actually is, and not having to 'kill' it in order to realise what needs to be realised, we learn to integrate the idea of it, and this is what I mean by spiritualising it. The result still brings about unity, as has been mentioned. The difference is it is actually realised and not merely understood.
The way. Adjectives are just a description of either the noun or the verb. The noun is the Tao, the verb, is the Tao. The Tao is in essence, to me, the will of God. And we live by it, letting it guide us, treat it well, and it will treat us well. The Tao is everything good, and everything bad, for through the Tao all things were made. And everything that was made, is good and bad.
so this is what i am taking from all of this so far, the idea is that ego and self are the same. To experience oneness we must transcend this self. But as long as we are alive we will have to come back to the sense of self but once transcended self may never be the same as it was before.
[quote name='"esseff"']Two ends of the same circle really, so close they are almost the same. For a while this issue seemed at odds to me. How can there be a need to dissolve the ego, let it go, yet understand and accept there will still be one, and yet have something I don't need, and still walk the path without needing to let go of doing so. A paradox it seemed. Then I realised that while both paths are necessary - the path of intention and the path of surrender, eventually they'd have to merge into one unified whole. The intention to surrender, and the surrendering of intention, so that what is left, has elements of both, as well as something that goes beyond it. The seeker is usually drawn to follow one path or another, but few are drawn to both, and even fewer understand what each really means at their highest level, and even fewer still realise the results of reaching the apex of that journey. No more conflict, no more struggle. All things make sense when both sides are in balance. While this may not be quite how things are right now, it feels much closer than it ever was.[/quote] You've been talking about being able to drop your ego from your most personal beliefs. I admire the discipline of will that I assume it must take to be able to do that, but I have to wonder why you consider it a good idea to do that. (Sorry, I meant to respond to you several days ago, but got caught up in a heated debate over in the science forum. A debate that should have actually been in here.) Anyway, consider this as a possible part of the answer to your thought here: I have thought for a long time now that the information age is bringing about the balance you speak of. We have been facing each other in forums, and chat rooms, and blogs. we come mind to mind in comment sections of online news stories. We have television, where everything is not always as it seems but our truths still come out in a plethora of ways. Over the last two decades or so, we have been learning about each other in ways we never imagined before. Doing it faster than we have ever done it before. Over an area spanning the globe. WHAT we have been discovering is that we are all human beings, and that human beings are animals, and that no one is better than anyone else. I think we have yet to completely realize the truth of those discoveries. People are still having a hard time relating to one another, and allowing for each others differences. But the above truths are becoming more and more fully evident with the passing of each day. At least I think so.
