What's your opinion? I personally don't think so, i think we've came quite a ways by educating people since the 1920's. The whole reason marijuana is criminalized is because of Mexican immigrants who introduced the drug to americans. (We already grew hemp for clothes, paper, etc.. but had no idea of it's inhaling properties.) The goverment associated this new drug with the "weird immigrants that spoke a satanist language". Then is when the whole reefer madness thing came along, with all the lies from the goverment and media saying it is a drug that kills people, causes white women to want to marry negroes, makes negroes think they are better than whites, makes people commit murder, etc.. etc. It was all a huge racism ordeal. I cannot believe that the racism in are country has subsided somewhat but marijuana still remains illegal! I HATE OUR GOVERMENT. your thoughts? Or if you have another opinion as to why marijuana remains illegal please explain.
Those are regarded as the reasons why marijuana was made illegal, but I don't think they're the reason why it remains illegal. I think the main reason why marijuana remains illegal is because of a look tough on drugs culture that permeates Congress and our law enforcement agencies. This look tough culture places extreme peer pressure on the people who work in these agencies to fit in with the rest of the group by towing the prohibition line. One of the most effective ways of combating this is by getting a large number of the general public to write into the our legislators asking questions about the prohibition. They don't need to be against the prohibition though, just as long as the questions are pouring in our legislators are going to be feeling pressure to change their stance on the issue.
To answer the initial question, no, I do not think it is out of reach. Progress is being made, albeit slower than any of us would like to see. The "look tough on drugs culture" that amsterdamage speaks of is definitely a big factor. In addition, I think the overhwelming ammount of misinformation about marijauna has a lot to do with it. The solution to this is spreading accurate information to combat the lies spread by the government and agents thereof.
I agree with you man. Have you noticed how prohibitionists twist the word "legalization" to imply that it means all the drug dealers and underage kids smoking marijuana would become legal? This scares people into supporting the prohibition. Instead of using the word "legalize" I prefer to say that we should control marijuana with the same laws we use for alcohol. People know how we control alcohol today and they see how successful it is at keeping bootleggers away and preventing minors from being able to buy it, so they're forced to either support what I'm proposing or to oppose the way we're currently controlling alcohol. This is a good position to put people in.
Hush, no you don't. As far as decriminalization goes, I think we can pull it off. Hell, we already have medical marijuana & that looks like it's here to stay.
I think first we need to use the terminology which says what we mean. Do we want "decriminalization" or "legalization?" Don't get me wrong- either would be better than what we have. However, some of the biggest issues that prohibition causes are not remedied by decriminalization. The Mexican cartels, for example, would have a HUGE amount of their profits taken out from under them if MJ were legalized. However, decriminalization would still perpetuate the black market. The overcrowding of prisons and prosecuting of non-violent marijuana growers and users is not alleviated by de-crim. The chances of minors getting their hands on MJ is not solved by de-crim, nor does it provide any sort of revenue to fund needed social programs. I caught a program on the History Channel last night entitled, "Gangland." It outlined how the Mexican cartels came to be (they were Mexican drug police trained in military tactics by, -here's the shocker- the U.S. Government!) They were offered huge amounts of money by the cartels to work for them rather than the Mexican government. So how does the U.S. government now do an about-face on something they created? How do they not look like complete idiots? Over 400 American citizens have been kidnapped by the cartels. How does this not make national headline news? You can't "get tough" on homicidal maniacs. The cartels are an army unwittingly created by the U.S. government, and perpetuated by their prohibitionist policies. (Oops!) There are a lot of issues why prohibition continues. A lot of it involves people protecting their jobs, and also not wanting to fess up to their failed policies and mistakes. They don't want to admit their failed policies are at the root of the violence. Legalization takes away the lucrative black market. It only makes sense.
The reason marijuana became illegal is because of the cultural at the time at which it was made illegal. The reason it remains illegal today is because it's not easy to just say, "Ok, marijuana is legal now." It would shake up the drug companies. Marijuana legalization needs to start with decriminalization from the bottom up. State by state, marijuana hopefully will continue to be decriminalized. It eventually will make enough sense to nationally decriminalize it.
I think that grasscity should get together and start a movement with picket signs and shit. have a big march. right in front of the white house! just like the women's suffrage movement...bahaha. and just pressure the shit out of a government to legalize or decriminalize it
I think you are exactly right Hedberg! At present, possession of Cannabis has been decriminalized in 13 states. This translates to almost 1/4 of the US pop living under decrim laws. Recent polls also suggest that almost 3/4 of the us population would support federal decriminalization. The us is in a position to enact national decrim laws. But this means nothing if we fail to convince our elected officials that the majority of their constituents support cannabis decriminalization. We MUST get active, we should be bombarding our elected officials with emails and letters demanding their support of federal and state level decrim of cannabis. We need to make it clear to Congress that we are not a minority of lazy pothead weed addicts fighting to keep a habit, but rather productive members of society seeking the right to enjoy a natural medicine and recreational substance that is safer than both alcohol and tobacco. We must make our voices heard!! KEEP FIGHTING FOR YOUR RIGHT TO TOKE GC!!!!!!
LONG REPLY: it took me a few days to gather my thoughts on it.. and it is still a work in progress.. but no point in making it even LONGER... is decriminalizing is out of reach? Marijuana could not be controlled with the same laws as alcohol. they are different substances and should be dealt with accordingly. Age limit - 21 (or tied to alcohol.. the age issue has to do with development. people from 18 to 21 are still considered "Impressionable" and shouldn't limit their potential) at least until it has been properly studied Growers Licenses- $750/plant (female or hermaphrodite plant in budding stage) or $7500/20 plants (female or hermaphrodite plant in budding stage) or $75,000/400 plants (female or hermaphrodite plant in budding stage) Sales tax- $50/oz (female or hermaphrodite goods{dried flowers, dried stalks for processing items like paper, cloth and other such varieties} on hand) or $700/lb (female or hermaphrodite goods{dried flowers, dried stalks for processing items like paper, cloth and other such varieties} on hand) or $7,000/20lbs(female or hermaphrodite goods{dried flowers, dried stalks for processing items like paper, cloth and other such varieties} on hand) Transportation License- FREE for any amount under an oz $20/oz of product being transported $200/lb of product being transported $2,000/20lbs of product begin transported Cannot be within a reasonable area of schools and must be kept behind a counters; accessible only by employees of the particular company selling; employees must serve product to customer until paid for by customer; customers must not be accompanied by persons under the age of 21 while on company premises. USE: cannot be used in areas where tobacco products are not allowed. Businesses employing persons in already hazardous areas should not be under the influence of drug while at work. Tests will be funded by taxes (mentioned above) to test employees - randomly or (a set number of times) a month/year available to all businesses who present a need to need employees to be tested. If users are caught behind the wheel Treatment: treatment will be paid for, for those who seek it, by product tax system(mentioned above). Businesses selling product must advertise aggressively for treatment areas in the community. All extra funds will be to aid law enforcement in areas (police, DEA, correctional officers) to keep the areas of drug abuse under control where need be, or enforcing tax system(mentioned above) TAX LAW ENFORCEMENT: If growing/transporting/selling is being done without proper licensing the offender must pay 10 times the license fee for amount on hand. Growing laws: Persons growing under 100 plants and selling mass quantity's to distributors or vendors need only pay growers fee. Sales tax laws: persons selling product must be identifiable from the mass public. Can sell from vehicles, but product must be locked up and camouflaged. persons selling product must not have be in the presence of persons under the age of 18 (schools, track meets, playgrounds etc.. and cannot have underage passengers in sales vehicle) If license are bought in conjunction with other{growing, sales, transportation} licenses, tobacco licenses, or alcohol licenses save 20% off license fees mentioned above. Persons selling product (not from a vehicle, must be 21 to sell from vehicle) must be over 18, supervised by a person over 21, unless persons selling is 21. if person(s) of employment are between 18 and 21, adequate surveillance systems must be in place, and there can only be 3 persons under 21 to ever person over 21 on shift. Transportation tax laws: vehicle for transportation must not be obviously carrying product. If carried in smaller amounts (less than 2 lbs) product must be secured (locked and out of sight). if carrier is transporting more than 2 lbs, product must be locked at all times not loading or unloading, must also be unmarked and out of plane sight. no matter how much person is carrying (over 1oz) person must have proper documents present as well as proper identification. If proper documents or identification is not present, then carrier must pay double the license fee, and if no documents or identification are presented to court hearing carrier is fined 10x the amount due for carried amount. Advertisement: Can only be advertised in places where alcohol and tobacco adds advertise, any where else is prohibited. If Individual is growing for his or her own personal use: NO TAX Max 4 plants in the blooming process Max 2 plants in the drying/curing process MAX 2 lbs of dried flowers at any given time. Must have transportation license mentioned above if transporting. Under the above tax system: i believe we would have a very lucrative government as well as new cash crop. A lot of jobs would pop up. I could see many positions popping up for small businesses. there are several jobs that need to be done: gardening, nursing (weekly if not daily), drying/curing/clipping, environment maintenance, quality control firms, all the obvious sales positions (waitress at hookah bars as well as sellers in head shops and gas stations), as well as the paper work process of the operations go (finance, legal, HR, etc), truckers or transporters, pulp mills from paper products could be replace, as well as oil processing possibly converting to bio diesel and many more. These jobs could be easily paid for considering: the cost of growing buds is potentially free (..out side in pristine conditions..) and the current sales rate for an oz is 200 (friend prices) and any where from 250-400/oz in a flooded market I doubt this will displace many jobs, however taxes could be in place to help find people who's jobs have been removed due to the restricted sale of hemp. I made sure not to put a tax growing male plants. I did not want to tax the processing of hemp to cloth and other such merchandise that could be associated with all that could be considered to not have any "intoxicating components". I think that it should be encouraged for people to grow any where where they need stable soil as hemp's roots will hold the soil together. I think many more studies on marijuana should be done and their findings publicized. I think that they will find many new ways that hemp is good there are already marches in Washington about legalizing it. what we need is our congress people to get involved, and they can do that with our motivation.. over them votes for them to be on our side of the issue (sign petitions) have rallies. i think the grass city community should organize something though. we should rally with other "pro-pot" communities like the NORML guys and the "Anti war on drugs" group and organize events to support our causes. we need to circulate fliers about what to do to get it legalized and why to legalize thorough the internet community. Post a positive message with some facts behind it like "WE ARE 3/4'S OF THE WAY TO LEGALIZATION WITH REGULATIONS!"so people know their voice counts and they should speak up. The reason it has been aloud to go on is because there isn't public outcry for regulating it. with our situation i think our economy needs it. Hemp could solve a lot of problems and promote economical prosperity, especially from our government. Our four fathers gave us the right to negotiate the terms of the national government through our congress, lets USE that ability! United we stand as hemp atavists. we need to set up a petition for everyone to sign to get a group started. We use that petition to get a tour together of all the different demographics of stoner music. Have cheech and chong there to do some stand up, KMK, Cypress Hill, get cover bands to do some serious hippy music, Wyclef.. I'm trying to hit everything here.. I don't think a million man march is out of the question, but if we have a petition of people in every ones area to bring concerts to that area i think we could get some fun out of getting some petitions signed and also get the word out about how not harmful pot is. All the good things about it. make it 18 and up so no ones parents get all but hurt, do it in a large area and have private security so cops don't have anything to worry about. Have petition areas as you walk in to the concert area so people entering can sign for causes. I think if we organize that and approach NORML and the other groups we could get some financial backing to put this stuff together. Send these petitions to our congressional representatives and government officials (Mayor, gov. etc). Every name on that petition is a vote to them. One thing matters above all other things in the world of politics: RE ELECTION I don't think a march on Washington would be all that productive. They get all kinds of crazies out there. I think paperwork is how we are going to get this accomplished.. paperwork and parties. If people know how close we are to regulated pot laws this movement could get a lot more momentum. and plus, people love concerts.. and cheech and chong.. MYSPACE and FACEBOOK groups might also really get this started. we might be able to petition tom and guy from facebook (who ever her or she is) to fund our little event and advertise for us. Concerts are also a great fund raising tool! $25/head on a concert like that would more than pay for venues and guests. we could use that money to advertise on hightimes and what not. Another good reason to do things like this, with the concert, is because fans of the bands will come.. allowing us to get a better fallowing (and signature/voters base) for our causes. Another thing we need is some one from each area to take care of the work in their towns (gathering signatures, or seeing what is needed to get the concert to their area. I think the big reformist groups are good for a lot of things. I am not sure they have an interest in regulating any more. a lot of layers through norml are making bank on the plant being illegal, and if its not good for business why do it? if legalized norml would no longer be needed. we need to unite for this cause and not try to realize profits out side of our goal (legally regulated buds). Web sites area always good, but i think we should have more ads around the web community in addition. we should petition our local, federal and national governments. help our representatives understand what we are standing for and what we are all about. I found this proposal. Quite a bit more complete than my own.. They call it The Inalienable Rights Enforcement Initiative: http://www.lao.ca.gov/ballot/2008/080110.aspx I tax a bit higher.. they expect $5 per 1/8th oz, where my figure is some where closer to $7 per 1/8th oz, or $14 per 1/8th oz if grown and sold in two different places. even with my model there is still an opportunity for a competitive market (even against the current black market). What do you guys think? is this any kind of a plan?
junk104: I stopped reading very early into your proposal. The portion where you suggest taxes be used to test employees for drugs. That's a big Constitutional no-no. At-will employment means they can test people, but that is a term of employment. We certainly do not want federal funding being used in the workplace to ferret out marijuana users. Employers who see fit to do so on their own to ensure a safe work environ can certainly do so, but you need to take that out of there ASAP. We don't want our rights to privacy trampled on like that, do we?? (I DON'T!!)
yeah, sorry, i should have looked at the other side of things there. I was thinking that I wanted to get people working for big companies behind the bill. I didn't think about the invasion of privacy. good call.