Color, Does It Exist When We Are Not There 2 Perceive It?

Discussion in 'Philosophy' started by Boats And Hoes, Mar 22, 2012.

  1. No... not at all. I know there is a world that subsists beyond perception, but, it is noting like the world we perceive in appearance and representation.
     
  2. THE REAL QUESTION IS






    Is clear a color?
     

  3. Do you?
     
  4. #24 Boats And Hoes, Mar 23, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 23, 2012
    Yes... When a seed is planted in the soil, existing beyond perception(the world of essence), it will still, with enough care, be galvanized, while in the soil, and thus be manifested in the world of appearance; it is functioning in the world of essence, but, once it "sprouts" out of the dirt, and it becomes subject to perception, it's imputed specific attributes and modifications, due to the perception of the perceiver.
     
  5. This is one of those 'if a tree falls in the woods and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound' questions.

    Basic quantum mechanics. The universe behaves differently when it's being observed, so we really can't know for sure. There's simply no way to observe something being unobserved.

    I find it interesting that there's colors we can't even see...hard to imagine...
     
  6. "Color is usually attributed to external bodies. However, color is actually the activity of the eye's retina. It is a sensation. The external body is perceived as the cause of the sensation of color. We say, "The body is red." In reality, though, color exists only in the retina of the eye. It is separate from the external object. Color is a mere sensation in the sense organ. The external object is perceived by the intellect's understanding as being the cause of sensations.

    Color theorists began by investigating light and colored bodies in order to find the cause of color. They should have started with an investigation of the effect, the given phenomenon, the changes in the eye. We can afterward investigate the external physical and chemical causes of those sensations.

    The eye's reaction to external stimulus is an activity, not a passive response. It is the activity of the retina. When the eye's retina receives a full impression of light, or when whiteness appears, it is fully active. When light is absent, or when blackness appears, the retina is inactive(no color).

    There are gradations to the intensity or strength of the retina's activity, or reaction to external stimulus. The undivided activity of the retina is divided into stronger or weaker degrees when stimulated by pure light or whiteness. When influenced by light, the degrees are: Light — Half Shade — Darkness. When influenced by whiteness, the degrees are: White — Gray — Black. In this way, grays are seen. The intensity or energy of the retina's activity increases as more light or whiteness stimulates the eye. These gradations are made possible by the quantitative intensive divisibility of the retina's activity."
     
  7. The world of essence is objective, and the world of appearance is subjective. My world of appearance, is most definitely going to be different, than the world of appearance according to a dog; we're both in the objective world of essence, we're simply just experiencing it differently, in representation. A dog has a more enhanced stage of hearing than man; this is obvious. My dog and I can be sitting in a room, and all of a sudden, his ears prick up and his head jerks towards a certain direction. I did not hear anything in my world of appearance, but the dog certainly did in his. At all times, within the world of essence, messages are being emitted, on any stage of sense, for perceivers to perceive; even if I, the human, can't detect the noise of a tree falling with my hearing, the dog can, and did.

    Through perception, the object compromises its essence, by conforming itself, and becoming subject to the dictates of perception. So, the subjective world of appearance only ends, when the subject retires, but essences subsist, and are continued to be perceived by perceivers. And when all of perception vanishes, essences will remain pristine and indifferent.
     
  8. That whole paragraph is really convoluted and does nothing to prove your point that things exist outside of perception.
     
  9. Okay, it's really simple... Does a seed in the dirt, not subject to perception, "exist"?
     
  10. If a tree falls in the woods and no one is around to see it fall does a bear shit in the woods?

    Two hands clap and there is a sound. What is the sound of Jesus?

    Or something like that. I was never very good with riddles. Or remembering what my refrigerator.
     
  11. #31 Boats And Hoes, Mar 23, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 23, 2012
    Okay, just say you don't want to understand and inquire... don't resort to manifesting condescending sarcasm.
     

  12. I'm sorry. Please tell me more about how you understand everything about perception and know how the world works. I'm so interested in learning from you.


    That is condescending sarcasm. The previous post was actual zen riddles combined with my own sense of nonsense humor. Just having some fun breh.
     
  13. #33 Boats And Hoes, Mar 23, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 23, 2012
    I'm chill, man... I'm just saying, if you ask a question, don't be intimidated by it's, "convoluted", response - and resort to jokes, bro.
     
  14. [Ying Yang Twins]Haaah?[/Ying Yang Twins]
     
  15. Okay, you asked if a tree falls in the woods, does it make a sound if no one is there?

    Here is my "convoluted" answer... The world of essence is objective, and the world of appearance is subjective. My world of appearance, is most definitely going to be different, than the world of appearance according to a dog; we're both in the objective world of essence, we're simply just experiencing it differently, in representation.

    A dog has a more enhanced stage of hearing than man; this is obvious. My dog and I can be sitting in a room, and all of a sudden, his ears prick up and his head jerks towards a certain direction. I did not hear anything in my world of appearance, but the dog certainly did in his. At all times, within the world of essence, messages are being emitted, on any stage of sense, for perceivers to perceive; even if I, the human, can't detect the noise of a tree falling with my hearing, the dog can, and did.

    Through perception, the object compromises its essence, by conforming itself, and becoming subject to the dictates of perception. So, the subjective world of appearance only ends, when the subject retires, but essences subsist, and are continued to be perceived by perceivers. And when all of perception vanishes, essences will remain pristine and indifferent.
     

  16. Aight. Lemme rephrase the question. If no sentient beings exist in the universe, does the universe exist?
     
  17. Yes... as the world of essence, and NOT as the world of appearance - how we know and "perceive" it.
     

  18. How do you know?
     
  19. I just showed you with the example of the dog hearing the tree fall... messages are being emitted, regardless of, if perceivers are present - hence, there is a world independent of subjective perception(something external enabling perception and appearance).
     


  20. No, you showed me how if some one (i.e. a dog) can perceive an event (i.e. a tree falling) then it exists. I'm asking how you can be sure something (i.e. a universe) exists if no one (i.e. zero sentient beings) is there to acknowledge it's existence?
     

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