Well, first things first.... Explain to me how Christianity is not 2,000 yrs. old, give or take 33 yrs? This is basic knowledge that I accused you of not having. So, then, how old is Christianity?
abrakadabra your original post can be perceived in two very different ways...it can sound like a mal-worded comment with no malicious intentions, or it can be seen as a post with a negative tone and no real beneficial additions to the discussion. The fact that your post immediately claims that the members of the discussion have no knowledge of what they're talking about besides the jist of it, and then you proceed to suggest that from what you have seen so far they may not have any clue about what they're discussing should be an obviousely offensive gesture seeing as you're a very new member and one of your few first posts already has no appearent motive other than to start shit... ...on the other hand, im not a mind reader and your post could very well have been an innocent one with the problem of having dual outcomes in tone as perceived by the reader....so for now having said this, i'll give you a warning and allow you a second chance to join the ORIGINAL conversation... But keep in mind the second that one of you..ANY of you, start up this flaming nonsense..im closing the entire thread, and it'll be because of you that someone elses thread got fucked....thats not a very nice thing to do IMO
Christianity has the same roots as Judaism which means that the basis for the old testament is approximately 1800 years older than you believe it to be. The birth of christ was the begining of the church of christ but these events were foretold or predicted therefore christianity in its essence is much older than 2000 yrs. Christ wasn't preaching anything new he was passing on the word of god which of course (since god is christs father) means that it pre-dates even christs existence. That is unless you know different.
That's the thing though. Christ was teaching something very new. He was telling of the new covenant. Yes, Christianity formed out of Judiasm, but they are very different religions. The mainstream Jews at the time considered it blasphemy to teach the way he did. Some still believe it to blasphemy to say Jesus was the Christ promised to us by Elijah. Chistianity began with this new covenant, not before. Making this a 2,000 yr. old religion, give or take 33 yrs.
Nice to see you finally joined in the discussion. I think the age of christianity might have a slight definition problem. Christianity as a word will be derived from christ (which means the balmed or summin like that). It was not formed out of Judaism. They have common roots, then they went i different directions. Judaism recognizes Jesus as a prophet along with Amos, etc. but do not belice him the son of god. This is why christians have the old testament, as well as the Jews but they call it Tora. The fact that the old testament is still part of christianity means that "christianity" has existed b.C. Just that a.D. it has evolved a lot by introducing Jesus and his new ideas...
This god satan stuff very well "explained" in Neil Gaimans Murder mysteries: Before there was world or universe or anyhting all the angels lived in a silver city and they each had an different jobs to do, in the center of that city was an huge factory that was creating the universe and most of the angels was there to create emotions, happenings, colors and everything. Lucifer was the leader of gods army and because there weren't any enemies they just practised each day, and on the meantime Lucifer spend his time walking on the edge of the city listening to voices of the dark. One day a very special angel, Let's call him jared, was awaken to investigate that murder. At first they suspected that it was Lucifer who had killed the angel 'cos the body was found in the outter edges of the city. It turned out that there were two angels that were working on the factory and they had started creating death, unfortunatly they were lovers too, because they had created love before death. The other one of these angels became so obsessed with death that the other one became jelaous and killed the obsessed one. As jared called Lucifer, and the angel who had killed the other one in to gods room, he revealed this and the quilty one admitted the murder and was sentenced. Lucifer was wise and pointed out that god was the creator of the city and in reality decided everything in the city so it was god who had created death and caused the murder, and lucifer continued that he wouldn't want to serve someone who can create something like death and cause misery to people and stormed out of the room and went to live on the dark outside the city. Jared asked god that god being the creator and such he must have known lucifers reaction, and if so then why? in wich God replied: there must be dark so there could be light, there must be injustice so there can be justice, and no good can exist without bad... Check out the novel or comic, it's splndid.
Well, you are all pretty close about the age of Christianity. It started in Judaism. When Jesus came He taught the same things that were taught in the Old Testament. The reason a lot of Jews rejected Christ is because they were looking for their king (which Jesus was) to come in and set up his kingdom. Jesus did the opposite, he came to die and reconcile us with God. The main reason so many Jews hated Jesus was because they were so stuck in tradition and following the law. They believed their works would get them into heaven, even though the Old Testament taught otherwise. Jesus taught that it was by faith, and not by works. This made a lot of the religious rulers of the time angry, and they killed him. This has a striking similarity to the Catholic church that is full of idol worship, and works instead of what the Bible really teaches (faith). Anyone know about the persecutions that those of the reformation indured by the Roman Catholic church? It's sort of the same thing that happened when Jesus was here. Same motives and all behind it. So to sum it up. Christianity is really as old as Judaism. The Jews just reject Christ as their Messiah, Christian's don't. The same things were taught in both testaments (except for a few minor exceptions). Now... on to the original topic of the thead... the whole God/Satan thing. Satan's not doing God's dirty work. Satan wants to overthrow God, and destroy everyone here on earth. As for what happened at his fall... This is what the Bible has to say about it: "Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations. All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us? Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee. How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the starts of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most high. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms; That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners? All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house. But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet. Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned." - Isaiah 14:9-20 This talks about how Lucifer fell. He thought he would exalt himself above God (basically he wanted to overthrow his creator). It also talks about what will happen at the end... How he will be cast into a lake of fire, and how people will mock him because of how pathetic he will be when his judgment is issued.
i assume you're referring to the catholic priests? and yes, i agree, the catholic church is totally muffed up, corrupt, and evil. don't confuse catholicism with true, biblical, christianity.
Nope, I'm not cunfusing anything. Who is to say people didn't make up the bible, and christianity, in the first place to get people to do what they say? This goes with all religions, that is why I don't believe I have enough knowledge to believe or not believe in any religion.
Christianity is a pegan religion. It's based on religious beliefs that were around long before it was even thought of. Then the church destroyed or locked up the majority of the evidence. Also, the vatican stands on the ground of a destroyed pegan temple.
If you knew anything about the Bible, you'd know that it's kind of impossible for someone to have just made it up. The manuscripts that are used to get what we have as the Bible were written over a huge area (from the mid-east to asia minor, and into europe), they were also written over a span of a couple thousand years, and also they were written by 40 different people. Now, you tell me why all those manuscripts, over that much area, and by that many people over that long of a time, all come together to tell one story without contradiction (legitimate contradiction). Christianity's roots are in Judaism, which is one of the world's oldest religions. Technically Judaism wasn't officially a religion until God established His covenant with Abraham. Before this time, people had begun to worship other gods, but their roots came from one place, which was people who walked with the God of Israel. If you go to before Abraham, you'll find several people who walked with the God of Israel (before they went into Israel), so if you don't want to be too technical, one could say the roots of Christianity and Judasm go back to those times, only differences being: Judaism just wasn't officially a religion, and the Jews weren't a distinct race at these times.
Sorry, I forgot to go into this in my last post... The vatican itself is a pagan temple. The Catholic church is loaded with idol worship.
Here's a few links for ya. - http://www.jesusmysteries.demon.co.uk/interview.html http://www.cnn.com/2000/books/news/09/21/jesus.mysteries/index.html http://www.jesusmysteries.demon.co.uk/home.html I'm not talking about christianity being based on Judaism, though that is true. I'm calling christianity a pegan religion because it's based (along with judaism) on pegan religions that pre-date both of them. Read the articles, read the book. It's some pretty interesting stuff.
Christianity in a nutshell: Lets go back for a minute to the Garden of Eden. This is really simple.... When humans were created and placed on this planet (and the details of how we wound up here are insignificant), things were simple, life was simple, and it all worked together. Humans and animals would eat the food available to them, poop it out which would make fertilizer and in turn keep the soil firtle for more plant life to grow to make more food. Likewise, the plants breathe in carbon dioxide, and through the process of photosynthesis, expire oxygyn. We and other animals breathe in oxygyn and exhale... you guessed it, carbon dioxide! In this time and place, everything took care of itself. There was a perfect balance, and everything was truely in harmony. We had everything we'd ever need. Enter satan, enter temptation. What was the first temptation? Well, we symbolize it with the eating of a fruit (often protrayed as an apple). But, really, why did Adam and Eve want that fruit in the first place?? Because they were tricked. This trickery is the first temptation. Satan said to them: "don't you want more..... for yourself?" They had everything they ever needed... everything they ever wanted... they were happy! Yet, they were selfish.... if all this is so wonderful, certainly more would be better. Except they already had everything they could ever want. So, here we are, countless thousands of years later, still thinking about ourselves... still thinking about our OWN interests and no one elses and still trapped in a web of FEAR! The answer to (the lack of) world peace, the answer to world hunger, the answer.... is so simple that we just can't seem to fathom it. The answer is love. True, unequivical, unending, unceasing love for one another. Think about it, if we truely loved one another, and worried about each other instead of worrying about ourselves, we wouldn't have to worry because all our needs would be taken care of for us. We would have no need to fear, for indeed it is fear that makes us hate one another. If, indeed, we had no need to fear one another, because we all held, as our highest interest, the interest of the GREATER good, we would have no need for weapons to "defend" ourselves from one another. No nukes, no SCUDs, no missles, no cannons. World peace! If, indeed, we wern't spending our resources to build weapons, but instead we spent our resources helping one another, we would spend a large portion of our resources distributing food to those who need it. For it is not a lack of supply, but a failure in distribution (because we're greedy, and distribution costs MONEY) that causes world hunger. No more hunger! If, indded, we wern't spending our resources to build weapons, but instead we spent our resources helping one another, we would spend a large portion of our resources researching to find cures for diseases. No more illness! Perfect harmony is achieveable, if we all learn to love one another fully, completely, unselfishly, and unceasingly, as God loves each of us. That, my friends, is what Christianity is really all about. You can spread love or you can spread hate... the choice is yours.
And what I'm saying is that these other pagan religions stem from the same God. Here's the history in a overly simplified version. God creates man. Man has fellowship with God and all is peachy. Man sins and causes a schism between God and man. Now, some choose to follow God, some choose to follow after their own desires, their own gods, etc. Some worship the true God, some worship statues. Instead of everyone following the same God (as everyone once did) they began to branch out. Different religions are formed, but there are still those who are following the original God. After a while God forms a covenant with one of the people who want to follow Him. This is the birth of Judiasm, and the root of Christianity. So yes, technically there are other religions that predate judaism. Unfortunately you have it backwards though. Seeing as how all mankind originated in the same area, then proceeded to spread out throughout the world, they all originally had the same knowledge of God, and took aspects of their original religion with them as they ventured out and eventually began changing their beliefs. This is why you see so many similarities to Judaism and Christianity in so many of the world's other religions.
what is the most important thing out of any of this? here it is: even if all religion is bullshit we use it as a tool to better ourselves remember humans are the only animals with imagination(thx daily planet ) so religion is like a motivative tool and eventually tools become better so religion evolves and christianity has evolved from judism it is a newer form of it and itll keep getting refined and remade to fit with the times and inspire people to do good not all other religions are like that some still belief in sacrificing and shit so religion is good if used and evolved correctly