Another Tincture Thread - Try it, You'll like it

I do it just as you described with a fan and it usually doesn't take long but I live in AZ and the humidity is non-existent and that helps a lot.

 

I'm about to post results for post-extraction decarb of Dragon oil in the oven so if you want to decarb additionally now, you can do it. I'll have that up shortly.

 

AVB vs Roach Dope

AVB Roach​

Select Image to Expand
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Before I post the post-extraction decarb information, I'm going to add this report for roach material since we've been discussing "post-toking". I'm only doing this for general information and education for those who do use their leftover material.

The roaches ranged from 1/2 to 1 inch long and range in age from current to a few months. My main reason for doing this test is to see how and if the material decarbed while being smoked and to check CBN creation. As you can see, the roach material had many more remaining cannabinoids than the AVB and it appears that about half of the THCA has converted. The AVB had none basically.

 

Post-Extraction Heated Decarb - Infused Coconut Oil
High Concentration & High Volume (Dragon Oil)
(Example 2)




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The lab results shown above are from 2 separate tests of the same sample material. I had the lab place the results next to each other so that they will be easier to compare and not take up as much room. The column on the right is the first sample and the one on left is the last.

I have a good friend who was going to make some Dragon oil with 6oz of buds and because he's made it several times before, he sort of put the processing on automatic pilot without giving it much thought....until after he had already started processing. At that point he realized that he completely skipped the decarb. This was fresh bud and definitely needed it. He called me freaking out and I was able to calm him down when I told him about the first oil experiment I had done and that this was the time to test out the oven process. It would be a good test because it was highly concentrated and 6 fluid ounces.

The column on the right is the first try. I had told him to put the oil in a 240°F oven for an hour or until the bubbles stopped. Well, he got impatient and only left it for 40 minutes and it was still bubbling rapidly at that point. Not alcohol bubbles because that had already been done prior to this but carbon dioxide bubbles from the carboxyl group baking off. It was at this point that I got it tested to see if we were on the right track. Lo and behold, we got about a 70% conversion from THCA to THC. That's close to the range we get with a 225°/30 minute heated decarb. You might be able to use this is a low dose but with this high of a dosage, the higher THCA could cause some issues. At this stage my friend said that it was a bit edgy at a milliliter dosage ("00" cap) and he would have to take it a while before bed in order to be able to sleep.

The left column shows the results after he placed the oil back in the 240°F oven and let it heat until all the bubbles stopped. He said that it took about 2-3 hours and I suspect that is because the concentration was so high. There is over 3.5g of pure THC in each ounce of coconut oil. Lower concentrations shouldn't take as long. As you can see, it went from 73mg/ml of THC to 107mg/ml and 33.3mg/ml of THCA to just 2.9mg/ml. I call that full decarb.

There are some other notable differences. First, the CBDA went from 1.92 to 0 as did most of the other cannabinoids except for CBC which nearly tripled. Since there is no CBN, that increase in CBC must have come from the CBDA. As is the case with lab testing of oils and edibles, not everything is detectable. The labs, several, have noted that but none seems to know why. Something to do with the solvents they have to use. For my complex cookies they have to soak it overnight in acetone. But nevertheless, the good stuff is there and tells us that our extraction and decarb were absolutely successful.

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Also, look at the change in color from the first to the second.

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"This begs the question ---- where did the CBN go? I can't imagine that the second round of decarbing obliterated it? I was/am under the impression that CBN is the end product of the decomposition reactions (especially at these temps). If anything, there should have be quite a lot more CBN after a 3+ hour decarb @240."




For some reason the quotes aren't working right now.


Yes, OneE, that is one of the many questions and is why a single test isn't the final word. I have asked the lab science guys and they are not sure of the answer. They aren't the only lab that has that issue and it's also across the board with the various solvents and edibles. The labs are aware of the lapses but have no answers because no one brings it up, except me. Everybody who uses labs are only looking for total THC and total CBD, not the individual compounds. My current lab is working with me to try to answer some of those questions.


One theory is that over that long of a period of time all of the compounds begin to break down into non-cannabinoid metabolites, even CBN breaks down. That and the eventual volatility of the more fragile compounds.


Another possibility is that because the detected levels are below 0.01% and doesn't get read by the software. I need to discuss this with the lab some more and get things more consistent if that is the issue. Different technicians. But I have more of these tests with other concentrations and times so that we can be a more balanced impression.

 

"Interesting results once again Sam. The oil really protects the THC from degradation well yet many of the other cannabinoids do."


That is my thought as well. Oil is a very good preservative and I believe it does protect it. I've had Dragon Oil with only a partial decarb sit in a warm cabinet for over 3 months with no further activity but I can take some GD that's had no decarb at all and it can sit for 3 months and be fully decarbed. Although the preserved Dragon oil sat that long, there was no appreciable difference in the compound levels but no heat at all.


I suspect the answer will be a combination of all I listed and maybe some things not yet considered or known. I believe that by getting into these details, we're bringing awareness to the general community with the hopes of inspiring better cannabis products.

 

"Damnit PSam, thanks do much for what you're doing. Now I gotta go get this stuff I've been gifted tested. All I know about it is that it works, I go from not being able to walk, next thing I realize is I'm showered an dressed, wtf, life ain't good no more, but it's much better than before I tried cannabisThanks
DD"


I'm sorry to hear that life isn't so good right now but I can certainly say that I can relate and it sucks. It sounds like you got a good gift, though. I'm going through a time of intense pain myself and find myself trying to juggle different therapies without becoming too dependent on them, including cannabis for economic reasons only.


I have found that by testing things that I know has worked I get a better understanding of how things work with all the different cannabinoids and things and it now allows me to better pinpoint the strains that work for my pain without sacrificing the psychoactive effects. It also lets me target the strains and not waste money on unknowns as much. If you've got a lab available and the extra cash,it's well worth the money, especially when you've found something that works well so you can look for it in the future.